Victoria 3

Victoria 3

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Mythrind Jul 14, 2024 @ 9:29pm
Great Powers forcing Japan to open market
Playing as Japanese Shogunate is not feasible any longer due to Britain or France forcing Japan to open their market by 1841, which kills their economy and causes Japan to go into debt before it's able to get started.

Please put an inhibition to the Great Powers forcing open market on Japan within 5 years of game start to give me a chance to develop my economy a little before I'm forced to lose money immediately at game start.
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Showing 1-15 of 19 comments
Zebulon Ecthelion Jul 14, 2024 @ 10:21pm 
Yeah, it should be America forcing Japan to open its market in 1853.
Kapakc Jul 15, 2024 @ 12:40am 
I noticed that if you reduce your troop numbers for the Revolution cheese the AI usually becomes domineering, maybe thats why?
Originally posted by Naram-Sin:
Yeah, it should be America forcing Japan to open its market in 1853.
That was only because the Americans got there first, the French were going to do the same iirc.
Razorblade Jul 15, 2024 @ 3:00am 
For one, 1841 is 5 years after the start date of 1836. Are you suggesting a few months of guaranteed extra time would have made a difference?

Secondly, have you tried upgrading to Line Infantry? I've personally never been targeted by Britain or France, but that's always been enough for Russia at least. Japan's starting army is massive.

Third, if you know it's definitely coming, and you seriously can't do anything about it, as you have suggested, just don't build so aggressively. The majority of expenses in the game are from Government Wages, i.e. Construction Sectors and Goverment Administrations. If you're mostly just taxing Peasants, and not acquiring a bunch of Interest, you're not going to go into a death spiral.

That is all to say, this seems like a skill issue.
BebopFx Jul 15, 2024 @ 12:05pm 
Are you trying to stay as Shogunate and not get Honorable Restoration?
Dark Sun Gwyndolin Jul 15, 2024 @ 12:15pm 
Yeah, I've experienced belligerence towards Japan myself in 1.7. There was a bug with how Great Powers interact with Isolationist Majors like Japan that was causing massive aggression from the AI, but it's fixed now.

Expect the AI to still be more aggressive to Japan than they used to be; don't downgrade your Barracks to cheese the Boshin War, upgrade to Line Infantry and a basic navy as soon as you can afford to, and make sure to Improve Relations with the Great Powers (especially Russia and Great Britain).
Dank Williams Jul 15, 2024 @ 12:29pm 
Originally posted by Nephalim Glory:
Expect the AI to still be more aggressive to Japan than they used to be; don't downgrade your Barracks to cheese the Boshin War, upgrade to Line Infantry and a basic navy as soon as you can afford to, and make sure to Improve Relations with the Great Powers (especially Russia and Great Britain).

The issue is you can't build up your economy enough to even afford line infantry and a basic navy before either France or UK declare on you. Even after downgrading for the cheese it's still too expensive to go with even 20-25 line infantry
Dark Sun Gwyndolin Jul 15, 2024 @ 12:51pm 
Originally posted by Dank Williams:
Originally posted by Nephalim Glory:
Expect the AI to still be more aggressive to Japan than they used to be; don't downgrade your Barracks to cheese the Boshin War, upgrade to Line Infantry and a basic navy as soon as you can afford to, and make sure to Improve Relations with the Great Powers (especially Russia and Great Britain).

The issue is you can't build up your economy enough to even afford line infantry and a basic navy before either France or UK declare on you. Even after downgrading for the cheese it's still too expensive to go with even 20-25 line infantry

Before I can offer any further advice for playing Japan, I need to ask; did you start your game before or after 1.7.4?

"Fixed some issues with AI strategy logic for isolationist countries which was inadvertently applied to non isolationist countries, causing the AI to generally avoid befriending other countries"

That's the bug that led to excessive belligerence towards countries like Japan.
Last edited by Dark Sun Gwyndolin; Jul 15, 2024 @ 12:51pm
Dank Williams Jul 15, 2024 @ 1:42pm 
Originally posted by Nephalim Glory:
Originally posted by Dank Williams:

The issue is you can't build up your economy enough to even afford line infantry and a basic navy before either France or UK declare on you. Even after downgrading for the cheese it's still too expensive to go with even 20-25 line infantry

Before I can offer any further advice for playing Japan, I need to ask; did you start your game before or after 1.7.4?

"Fixed some issues with AI strategy logic for isolationist countries which was inadvertently applied to non isolationist countries, causing the AI to generally avoid befriending other countries"

That's the bug that led to excessive belligerence towards countries like Japan.
Both, but also I was using the UHM mod which fixed that issue. I've given it 3 tries so far and every time I've been friends with Russia but UK and France hate me
Nayburz Jul 30, 2024 @ 12:31am 
I've been trying to learn the game with Japan and it's been frustrating as hell. Debt spiral after debt spiral and I have no idea why.
Originally posted by Nayburz:
I've been trying to learn the game with Japan and it's been frustrating as hell. Debt spiral after debt spiral and I have no idea why.

As a minor or unrecognized nation, you have very little credit to work with. Don't overbuild your construction sectors and avoid accruing interest as much as possible. It's gonna take a LONG time for your economy to properly start snowballing, so be patient. As Japan, pass Agrarianism as soon as possible (bolster the Rural Folk), as you have a lot of arable land and the changes to building ownership make farming the cheapest way to empower the RF (nationalized buildings, and farms you make yourself, don't have aristocrats).
Azunai Jul 30, 2024 @ 6:59am 
japan is a terrible country to learn the game.

if you're looking for good tutoral countries, try sweden or belgium. both fairly small and easy to manage and they don't start with crippling laws that hold them back. and they're both strong enough to beat up african, south american or asian countries and become colonial powers.
Yes please, Open my market baby
Zarobien Jul 30, 2024 @ 3:50pm 
Damn. I been waiting for USA to get it's ♥♥♥♥ together and come open my markets, while maintaining good relationship with Great Britain and France.

Only thing I have is defensive treaty with Joseon and 100 pointy stick units.
watchout Jul 30, 2024 @ 8:42pm 
Originally posted by Nephalim Glory:
Originally posted by Dank Williams:

The issue is you can't build up your economy enough to even afford line infantry and a basic navy before either France or UK declare on you. Even after downgrading for the cheese it's still too expensive to go with even 20-25 line infantry

Before I can offer any further advice for playing Japan, I need to ask; did you start your game before or after 1.7.4?

"Fixed some issues with AI strategy logic for isolationist countries which was inadvertently applied to non isolationist countries, causing the AI to generally avoid befriending other countries"

That's the bug that led to excessive belligerence towards countries like Japan.

For whatever it's worth, whenever I play Japan on the current patch, the UK still declares in the 1840s pretty much every game. And that's with me not cheesing or deleting units or anything, that's with the starting 101 units half upgraded to line infantry. I play that start a lot, probably done it about 10-13 times this patch, and in all but 2 the UK declared in the 1840s. One other time it was France that declared the war instead (I think in the early 1850s), and the one other time they never declared (played into the mid/late 1860s).

So there is still excessive belligerence towards countries like Japan in the current patch. The Economic Imperialism strategy is very aggressive towards opening up valuable markets (specifically for Japan: it's written in the code to favor opening Japan's market if Japan has a GDP over 2m and if the attacking GP has 25+ naval units and nationalism invented, and further encouraged to attack Japan if Japan's GDP is over 5m).

As a Japan player, if ANY GP has the Economic Imperialism strategy and an interest in the Japan region, they are eventually going to try and force Japan to open the market. It's scripted in the game files to do so. The good news is, you can probably fend off the GPs that come for you if you don't expand before you are technologically on par (particularly if you get to Line Infantry and have at least 30-40 units upgraded before they land), because you will massively outnumber most of their invasion forces. So it is annoying because it will cost you time and money to fend them off while you're trying to build up a functioning economy, but it's doable though you'll only be able to get a white peace in the end.
Last edited by watchout; Jul 30, 2024 @ 8:59pm
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Date Posted: Jul 14, 2024 @ 9:29pm
Posts: 19