this game is too politically correct

[kippy]

You get punished too hard for going right on issues

[rockyjoejoe2007]

Gasp*

[D-Black Catto]

it's not politically correct, it's a commie propaganda. I don't know if it's intentional or not. The command economy, multiculturalism and single party state are just too good. The council republic are pretty great too, and the game in most laws pretty obviously progresses from the most inferior at the top to the most superior at the bottom.

The game portrays a marxist view of the world, were society develops from feudalism, to capitalism, to communism.

Once again. I don't know if it's intentional or not. And frankly speaking, it's just a game so I'm not bothered by it. However, I'd be grateful if the law tree got diversified and expanded in a way that doesn't make going communist as soon as possible an optimal choice.

For example, currently there are two main ideologies in the game that appear after early period. That is positivism and then communists (communist, vanguard, anarchist). This kinda portrayes the evolution of social discourse in the west from 1830's to 1900's.

However the final decades saw the rise of fascism, which is severly underrepresented in the game. The nazi party is just a jingoism with a couple of extra steps, almost indistinguishable from presidential disctatorship or other such systems.

Hopefully, in the future, there will be a patch or dlc that will give that movement more flavor.

[RISKINVERSE]

@D-Black Catto
Are you saying there aren't enough Nazi options??

[Zero, Dark Knight]

I agree - this game promotes a law system of 'progressive and acceptance is positive and healthy and happy and everything is wonderful"

There's no ability to create the state you want to create because the radical system punishes you for trying to create a system where some people aren't welcome.
The loyalist system is too weak to counter it.

There're too many agitators and 'enact <thing>' with no way to get rid of them, constantly creating civil wars.

There's no way to expel / force groups of populations out of your country.

Assimilation is quite slow.

This game - in many ways is good - but it's spewing extremely heavily "left is best, right is wrong".

You can not create your own country or go a-historical.

[D-Black Catto]

Originally posted by Zero, Dark Knight:

I agree - this game promotes a law system of 'progressive and acceptance is positive and healthy and happy and everything is wonderful"

There's no ability to create the state you want to create because the radical system punishes you for trying to create a system where some people aren't welcome.
The loyalist system is too weak to counter it.

There're too many agitators and 'enact <thing>' with no way to get rid of them, constantly creating civil wars.

There's no way to expel / force groups of populations out of your country.

Assimilation is quite slow.

This game - in many ways is good - but it's spewing extremely heavily "left is best, right is wrong".

You can not create your own country or go a-historical.

now then, let's not go too far here! you can certainly create your country, and roleplay however you want. I just had an awesome game as theocratic japan (forget meiji resotration ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, go full buddhist!)

you can get rid of foreign agitators by passing closed borders law

Originally posted by RISKINVERSE:

@D-Black Catto
Are you saying there aren't enough Nazi options??

Indeed there aren't. Communist ideas are represented by various systems in the game (collectivized agriculture, command economy, councils, anarchy etc) while nazi have none. Nazi party may appear late in game, usually composed of military pops, and for all intends and purposes they are just jingoist presidential dictatorship under different name.

Which is very ahistorical. In reality, just like there were various flavors of communism which the game represents, there were also various flavors of fascism. There was mussolini style, hitler style, but also franko style and arguably showa japan style too. It was a powerful mass movement in its own way, yet the game doesn't give it much attention at all.

Which is why I think this should be expanded upon in some patch or dlc.

oh, and although religion is kinda fading in this time period, it would be cool if there was some religious mechanic for theocracies, especially the papal state, to influence pops of the same religion who live in other countries. That would make theocracy a unique system on its own. Perhaps give different mechanics to different religions too?

[endymionologist]

Paradox has two design goals for all of their GS games: 1, make a game that is fun to play; 2, make a simulation that can (without a human player) resolve to the state of the world that existed in real life at the end of the timeframe.
The first goal is already impossible, because players don't all enjoy the same things. The second goal makes the first even harder, because it sidelines all the Nazi power fantasies in the face of the incontrovertible truths of liberal democracy.
Look, just cook up some kind of LotR mod and play the Mordor you want to play, but don't expect the base game to conform to any outlook but this: in the clash of nations, racists get their lunch money stolen.

[Thingolus]

Victoria 2 dealt perfectly with fascism, if you lose your homeland provinces and are doing horrible after losing wars and going bankrupt people are turning to fascism.

No reason for a country to go for that route actively but if you bully another nation a bit too hard in the lategame or screw up too hard it should be a possibility that fascist laws are suddenly getting huge trajectory to the point of revolts happening on their own or you submit.

Most likely going to be DLC anyway.

[Gnasty Gnome]

Originally posted by RISKINVERSE:

@D-Black Catto
Are you saying there aren't enough Nazi options??

yes

[Mr. Wiggles]

Originally posted by endymionologist:

Paradox has two design goals for all of their GS games: 1, make a game that is fun to play; 2, make a simulation that can (without a human player) resolve to the state of the world that existed in real life at the end of the timeframe.
The first goal is already impossible, because players don't all enjoy the same things.

Those are Whiz's goals. For "Not-EU5" Johan promised a healthy dose of toggle-able "railroading" and historical events.

Originally posted by endymionologist:

[...]incontrovertible truths of liberal democracy.
Look, just cook up some kind of LotR mod and play the Mordor you want to play, but don't expect the base game to conform to any outlook but this: in the clash of nations, racists get their lunch money stolen.

The what now?

[kippy]

I like playing with the trains most of all. And that they run on time.

[Emelio Lizardo]

Actually the Nazis were Leftist Socialists.

Yes, many political issues in the game have leftist or incorrect form. As example Feminism is shown on the innovation menu as deriving from human rights when it properly should be positioned under Socialism. The game correctly demonstrates that all the "women's rights" propositions degrade fertility. Frankly it doesn't go far enough.

Multiculturalism is a modern concept and is shown as having no negatives. In fact what would happen is the creation of competing identity enclaves within a nation which would disintegrate that nation. This is purposeful. Much of what you would today call "woke" is specifically designed to break down a society and a nation.

"An evil man will burn his own nation to the ground to rule over the ashes." - Sun Tzu

Almost all nations in the "old world" are ethnostates. Many of which are by their nature genocidal. It is just in the Americas where propositional states exist. Even so ethnic and cultural homogeneity are important.

Socialism amplifies genocidal tendencies.

Agitators should arise out of the universities and their movements are usually funded from there. Particular universities should become "schools of thought", like the Frankfort group. The students who murdered Arch Duke Ferdinand were inspired to action by their university professor.

Missing are some important figures from social movements, particularly Antonio Gramsci and Herbert Marcuse.

[Oracle]

communism and command economy will provide same standard of living as others, but in terms of free money to build some crazy banana army, yeap

[D-Black Catto]

Originally posted by Emelio Lizardo:

"An evil man will burn his own nation to the ground to rule over the ashes." - Sun Tzu

5 seconds in google

https://www.truthorfiction.com/sun-tzu-rule-over-ashes-quote/

your other claims can be disproved equally as easily, but like certain philosopher said "There are people who want to know, and people who want to believe" and you who don't do basic research before writing multiple paragraphs of ideologically motivated text are clearly in that second category

[Platonov]

Being a free market warmonger low taxes work too (as long you can create quality of life for poor by taxing luxuries). You call it commies propaganda because you don't know how to play the right right...

[D-Black Catto]

Originally posted by Platonov:

Being a free market warmonger low taxes work too (as long you can create quality of life for poor by taxing luxuries). You call it commies propaganda because you don't know how to play the right right...

anything can work if you're good enough. hell, staying as autocratic monarchy with traditionalism and state religion works too, im playing ottomans now and im in 1890's with none of these laws changed yet and less then 10% radicals in my country.

Which doesn't change the fact that as far as raw bonuses are concerned, as far as min maxing is concerned, the bottom options are almost in every case superior to the ones on the top.