Abolish state religion as Quing

[Dragow]

Nuff said, 1905 and i cant even try to enact that, since no-one cares.

[kgkong]

Have you been increasing your intelligentia's clout size? Bosot them. Get them up.

Also try and have political group leaders die. When the option to duel comes up, have them duel. One, sometimes two will die and they get replaced by a new character with new traits.

[Dragow]

Originally posted by KingGorillaKong:

Have you been increasing your intelligentia's clout size? Bosot them. Get them up.

Also try and have political group leaders die. When the option to duel comes up, have them duel. One, sometimes two will die and they get replaced by a new character with new traits.

Yeap, Int is around 20% now and clergy around 7%. I could easily abolish the low, if only someone decided to vote for it.
I havent seen such weird behavior in any other nation, it looks almost like full suffrage being locked behind tech, so i wonder is there any hidden mech behind Heavenly Kingdom/boxers?

[kgkong]

What ideological trait does the head of the Intelligentia have? How powerful is the Landowner and Devout groups?
Landowners will have a tendency to support the devout because it means keeping authority in their hands.

But you also gotta add the Intelligentia to the government, not leave them in the opposition. The only reason why the Intelligentia won't support Freedom of Consciousness and Total Separation is if they have have a group leader who has an ideology that endorses state religion.

[Dragow]

Originally posted by KingGorillaKong:

What ideological trait does the head of the Intelligentia have? How powerful is the Landowner and Devout groups?
Landowners will have a tendency to support the devout because it means keeping authority in their hands.

But you also gotta add the Intelligentia to the government, not leave them in the opposition. The only reason why the Intelligentia won't support Freedom of Consciousness and Total Separation is if they have have a group leader who has an ideology that endorses state religion.

Once again, it is not a matter of support. The actual support for State Religion law is around 5%. There is no support for anything else, complete 0. Religion doctrine is not included in any IG, apart from clergy (those 5%), which as i said is almost gone.

[kgkong]

That's because the Intelligentia only have 5% clout power and wealth. They're so cut out from having any political power it's gonna take forever to get that fixed late game. You need to work on better political group management earlier in the game if this is a late game problem for you. Early game you just need to be more careful with the pop up events that adjust group attraction, leader of group popularity, and keep them from dipping too unhappy.

Early game, sometimes you just have to roll the dice and hope that 5% grows into 10%, keep legitimacy as high as possible, and rock those +20% chance to success more, take a few +10% enactment time to give your political group more time to muster up the political support for the law. Most of the first laws I enact from day one in a game, I have to add the Intelligentia into governmetn and run on a 9% chance of success. On average it's about 2-3 rotations of it the attempt to enact before it finally passes for me. As long as you don't tank your legitimacy, it doesn't take very long for most things to pass.

In the case of events that pop up that don't help improve the Intelligentia popularity and attraction, you wanna stifle the strongest opposition party to the legislation, or pick the option that bolsters a neutral group. Most cases that'll be the Trade and Industrialist groups, which you will also need to have more political power when you go to enact their endorsed legislation later game.

[Dragow]

Originally posted by KingGorillaKong:

That's because the Intelligentia only have 5% clout power and wealth. They're so cut out from having any political power it's gonna take forever to get that fixed late game. You need to work on better political group management earlier in the game if this is a late game problem for you. Early game you just need to be more careful with the pop up events that adjust group attraction, leader of group popularity, and keep them from dipping too unhappy.

Early game, sometimes you just have to roll the dice and hope that 5% grows into 10%, keep legitimacy as high as possible, and rock those +20% chance to success more, take a few +10% enactment time to give your political group more time to muster up the political support for the law. Most of the first laws I enact from day one in a game, I have to add the Intelligentia into governmetn and run on a 9% chance of success. On average it's about 2-3 rotations of it the attempt to enact before it finally passes for me. As long as you don't tank your legitimacy, it doesn't take very long for most things to pass.

In the case of events that pop up that don't help improve the Intelligentia popularity and attraction, you wanna stifle the strongest opposition party to the legislation, or pick the option that bolsters a neutral group. Most cases that'll be the Trade and Industrialist groups, which you will also need to have more political power when you go to enact their endorsed legislation later game.

I am not sure why are you keep writing those long responses without bothering to read any of mine.
Once again
Clergy - bad - 5%
Intelligentsia - good - around 20%

Intelligentsia demand all usual stuff they do, apart from religion.

[kgkong]

I am not sure why are you keep writing those long responses without bothering to read any of mine.

I misread the one bit about how you worded State Religion support is at 5% now. My apologies, I do have a vision impairment.

However, I can say the same thing about you as you haven't responded to this yet:

What ideological trait does the head of the Intelligentia have? How powerful is the Landowner and Devout groups?
Landowners will have a tendency to support the devout because it means keeping authority in their hands.

But you also gotta add the Intelligentia to the government, not leave them in the opposition. The only reason why the Intelligentia won't support Freedom of Consciousness and Total Separation is if they have have a group leader who has an ideology that endorses state religion.

To even add to this, how's the rest of the approval ratings of other groups? How's your radical pop numbers look in comparison to your loyalists and total population? Was trying to prevent dumping a hundred questions on you by asking a couple at a time to get shorter concise responses from you so I can give more accurate responses. I get it, you're trying to understand why you're having a problem enacting a legislation. But you haven't actually said what the problem is other than "nobody supports it". My above quoted questions and commentary is relevant to helping you. The extra bit that followed after this has more to do with general information about the challenges when enacting. All relevant when trying to enact legislation. But if it's not relevant to you so far, then it sounds like you haven't actually started to the enactment process. So can you provide in clear details what your issue is and explain your "nobody supports" commentary more thoroughly?

[Dragow]

See, that is what i am trying to explain. I know what to do, when there is a minuscule support or how to bump it up, or how to turn it etc. My problem is that not a single IG has any standing on religious law.
Only clergy, which is around only 5%.
I cannot even start enactment process, since no one will support it. Exactly 0% on the screen (usually even irrelevant igs are listed there).
It looks a lot like a bug, tho right now i assume there is some hidden mechanic which broke down.
Qing in general looks very buggy (e.g. i refused to confront British about opium trade and nothing happened, no related event, no generic penalty debuff, nothing.)

[kgkong]

So every group is neutral about State Religion, Freedom of Consciousness and Total Separation? That doesn't mean you can't pass the legislation.

The only reason why you wouldn't be able to remove State Religion, to be physically blocked out from it, is if Intelligentia are not in the government, and the button is greyed out. (There are other details as to why the button will be greyed out but we'll address this shortly.)

So is the button greyed out?

[Dragow]

They are in the government since the begging of campaign, the blocker is "above 0% approval" criteria

[kgkong]

Hover over the button and wait for the tooltip to show and screenshot it for me.

[NotA Catgirl]

I also have the same problem, and I think it is a bug. The Qing Intelligencia is a country-specific IG and it has specialized interests. That’s why the Qing intelligencia does not have a stance on religion, resulting in 0% support for freedom of conscious and rendering it un-changeable, unless there is an anti-religion leader. My Intelligencia leader is republican, which shouldn’t matter here.

However, Qing also has a country-specific religious IG, and as long as the leader is moderate, it will support freedom of conscious and state religion. But here come another bug, he only supports state religion and indifferent on freedom of conscious despite the specialized trait saying they will support both.

The ultimate result is 0% support for freedom of conscious