Tech speed is way too fast

[Not Ela]

As titled

[MP]

Nah. It just feels fast because of spread mechanics, but in the end you still hit the final techs by the 1930.

[Thamalandis]

Prussia rushes Mil-Tech and Bureaucracy techs but often lacks supplies to adopt them early. If you are in their market you can produce it and they switch instantly.

However their industry research is mediocre at best. Same with Scandinavia, they may still be using basic fertilizer in 1890. They seem to go for social tech focus.

Every tech can spread once someone has it. The fact nations rush certain trees preferred allows this to happen nearly always, unless you spammed so many universities no one can catch up.

Can you have steampunk airplanes flying with massive mist-engines by 1875? Yes. But what do you give up for them?

The tech-system is fine. My main qualm is seeing the Faber-Bosch nitrate binding in Tier IV not Tier V, but in theory anyone could have discovered it earlier than Faber, they just failed. It's not reliant on other technologies in the tree.

Unlike airplanes... which fly with basic steam engines... for some reason. The game needs an extra "combustion engine" factory to avoid this.


If you TRULY want to rush an endgame tech, do "Mass Surveilance". It allows the military police which not only keeps your army loyal during liberal reforms for a while, it will also act like "Suppression" against Turmoil and Tax Evasion for FREE, everywhere. This saves authority you can invest in other areas while not drowning in radicals.

[Bibliophylax]

I feel he is right.
Literacy is your reasearch cap, and your reasearch power is basic 50 + universities
If you rush a high literacy and stay the closest possible with universities you will be ahead in techs with major powers

[Sovieticozasz]

Originally posted by Bibliophylax:

I feel he is right.
Literacy is your reasearch cap, and your reasearch power is basic 50 + universities
If you rush a high literacy and stay the closest possible with universities you will be ahead in techs with major powers

that is incompetence on the part of major powers. It is literally impossible to catch up in technology while there exists a hardcap on innovation if the countries that start the game ahead play semi-competently.

the problem is that the AI is just not playing the game.

[Thamalandis]

We can argue if universities are not powerful enough, but the AI doesn't spam them like its gold.

The AI pushes a capital university, for Britain often to about 25 at the end... maybe 30 on a good day. It however leaves Oxford at level 1 - realism I know, right.

So in theory if you push for 30 universities midgame, you slowly outrun Britain. You long outran other ones. 25 universities are equal to a countries base research. So you roughly double yourself. That costs you about 50k in upkeep. Which midgame should lie around as pocket change for you unless you messed the economic game up or are a small dot on the map.

I'd be willing to support a small buff to universities by 50% too. But it is not really needed. It just looks odd to build 50 universities in one city. Maybe it should have a cap per pop...

[Bibliophylax]

I don't know i have not check it. lvl 25 ? it's enough to reach the 100% cap as 1 lvl give 2 points. When you stack them you get the effeciency bonus too, thats why the AI stacks.
In my runs i was stacking on my capital state too.

Edit for Soviet: Yes the AI is weak most of the time, i said all i think of it before, even if I have not tested everything yet

[Thamalandis]

The cap is 200 with 150 at 100% literacy and 50 base. There are nations starting below 30% literacy (thus below the early fake cap of 100).

In fact those daring enough to piss of the industrialists to get Child Education can get up to 35 extra cap (or 11 midgame universities) extra.

[Bibliophylax]

I forgot the actual max, thank you to remind me of. Yes this is exactly as it is.
This is why i personnaly think the workers IG and communism are meta.
You have the best laws and institutions

[Thamalandis]

That is incorrect. The freedom laws also carry 25% reduction for protected speech to spread tech and all techs can be reduced by up to 20% cost.

If you form a grand coalition of the industrialists, the military and the intelligentsia, you can get:

-20% for two tech tries in cost and -10% for another (I never had all 3 over 20%... but 2)
165 cap focus investment
+25% spread (with 80% literacy cap without child schools, and 75% efficacy for spread, this means (25 + 0.75 x 80 = 85, 85 x 1.25 = 106.25 which is shown as 53 to 160).

However the techs costing only 80%, 80% and 90% (middling 84%) while still having better tech spread for 3 spreads and 1 focus research slightly weaker, will allow you to research faster than any communist.

You will also pay around 40% for all industrial buildings, get +50% migration (or +25) and have stronger armies. Overall the army/industrialist/intelligentsia coalition is the strongest ingame in ALL aspects.

"But communists get +10% throughput!"... that is not better in money overall, maybe in wages and thus living standard. However Welfare and if you don't want happy industrialists just "pleased" ones even partial child support can be done without the red plague.

[Thamalandis]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2885662676

[Bibliophylax]

well, that's the best summary we can found on it so far.
You changed my mind, but i'm out of willingness to test it at the moment

[Thamalandis]

It's harder to cater to 3 factions, so you have to plan your laws accordingly. Communism is definetly the lazy... easy way out. However, once Paradox fixes the hyper radicalism overcharge in the game - if they hopefully do - it will be easier as the debuffs to party loyalty are partially gone. So you get more flexible laws.

[Bibliophylax]

I have not played the game since the patch, and my playthrough were quite easy on the radicalism level. I know they lowered the threshold, it is definitely harder now.

[Thamalandis]

To put it mildly, there are like 2 events ingame to reduce radicals and dozens that increase it. And every small change in living standards makes them radical, which can happen very easily when they are rich. For example due to profitable trade routes and their high wages ruining local average wages.

Collapsing by market switch or independence wars will turn 60% of your nation radical during the shift to new suppliers. They won't go away for decades...

There are no "national fervor" events for capturing land of your people, for winning wars, for enacting laws a major faction LOVED - they allegedly plan to add that, which is needed to balance it a bit.

The lack of +loyalist events is the problem, not the radicals.

Factories and economies ingame if wages are too high fire a few thousand, let the average wage drop and then rehire them to lower wages to be profitable.

The fact the game does this while firing them for a few weeks causes radicalism. Something communism with state-run doesn't suffer.

Any new tech also fires a lot of people. All those become radical. Small changes in market prices will also cause radicals.

Conquering land with more than 30 infamy will turn 65%+ of them into radicals.

Enacting laws with a faction fallin below -10 will turn those radical.

Ultimately, if anything happens ingame, they get radical right now. Nations regularly explode into civil wars mid to lategame and the player can handle it with enough suppression and a bit of tact at some -tax waste%.

This is why I said rush "Mass Surveilance". It's "Suppression" decree for free everywhere. After that, the horror is not over, but neglectible.

[Bibliophylax]

Yes lol, I often played with 1.6M radicals and 300k loyalists in my games, but it happend late, and my government was already reformed. They never tried anything, i got one strike maybe in my gameplay. Saw a topic of someone about his steelmills working as radicals factory due to high turnover too lol. Upgrading automation and rails transport create radicals even if they can easyly found jobs somewhere else, the sys is broken honestly....
Actual system need a lot of rework imo. Saw a mod on it, but the patch break it. I'm in the waiting stance