Tier list discussion for 2v2s

[GAIN CITY]

note: this is for 2v2

I wanted to make a thread regarded what people view as currently too strong and in need of alterations to make the game more fun and consistent. granted its going to differ, i wanted to address some major concerns i have with the current state of the game:

Firstly, my god, supports are horribly broken currently, unless you are poloma, in which case RIP. but for the rest of them, they all boast this ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ ability to do damage (sirius and oldur especially) while maintaining being major threats due to heal. others, like pearl boast tons of CC and pretty much unparralleled orb taking capabilities. now i wish i just thought they were busted, but after playing them, all of them (minus poloma) seem to be hitting way, way too hard for what they are designed for. the only thing that stops a team of 2 supports from running rampant is the inability for them to really secure kills on their own.

secondly, my god melee heroes. rook was buffed to ♥♥♥♥♥♥ Smorc tier, and shifu is still a mess of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ survivability, with mobility, and tons of damage for no real reason. and then we have bakko, croak, and freya just sort of existing in the tier all being pretty unusable atm.

and lastly, ranged characters, where jumong is strong, i dont find him super broken and i find this overall the most balanced of the 3 classes right now, no one is really peaking out as broken here. rather we just have jade underperforming in a ton of ways, and in need of a buff.


so my thoughts currently as far as whats to strong and needs to be fixed:

Too strong:

Sirius - Way too much damage, with way too much healing, and weaken ruins your ability to really react to him effectively.

Pearl - My god, good damage, with tons of cc, and one of the hardest to contest orb strats in the game, she also has the best heal for some reason.

Shifu - i dont think i need to explain this one to anyone. hes been absurd since forever, people have mained him solo to top tiers with ease, and hes absurd even in low tier games.

Rook - possibily not too strong, but his ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ smorc style might die out when people effectively find counters, but regardless he will exist as a noob killer and will overall be bad to the health of the game if he does turn out to be like that.


On the strong side (not quite broken, could use minor tweaks)

Lucie
Oldur
jumong

Fineish tier?

taya
iva
bakko (maybe i dunno, he seems acceptable currently)
Ashka



weak side:
Poloma
Ruh Kaan (looking at his animations, alongside his cosmetics and glitches, i think this guy was legit rushed out for the update, i think this is why hes weak atm.
Croak


on the horribly weak side

Jade

^ lost an insane amount of survivability, and often finds herself getting trashed pretty badly by any rush down characters. even top tier players are having trouble making her damage output work with how easy to kill she is. ex stealth spamming is required, and it delays the real reason you pick jade, that insane ult (which was also nerfed slightly)

Dudes i dont know where to place (aren't being played much at rank 13-14 and i dont play them)

Varesh
Freya



So i'd love to hear you guys' thoughts on the matter, i dont find the balance currently to be really healthy at all because some characters are super strong, and make up a ton of skill difference with pure ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ power.


Tl;dr

2v2 tier list

S tier:
Sirius/pearl/shifu

A+ tier:
Rook

A Tier
Lucie/jumong

A- tier:
Oldur

B+ tier
Ruhkaan

B tier
Taya/Iva/bakko/ashka

C tier
poloma/Croak

D tier
Jade

??? tier (prob C-B)
Freya/Varesh



Post updated as of 10/29, so includes the hotfix, this added sub tiers like b+ a- and A+, to give a bitter idea where characters sit in relation to each other

[Smug Kot]

even with the nerfs Poloma still god tier, literally this patch did nothing just scaled more champs to god tier (no bad but its not the whole point)

At hight MMR its the same mirros: Poloma, Shifu, Pearl, Rook (From bottom to god hilarous), Sirius (it was good before, they overbuffed him now).

[GAIN CITY]

perhaps, i think the reason i view poloma as bad is because shes pretty squishy if you focus her down. you literally can't focus her linked teammates or its unwinnable.

[Rucktoe]

Jade and Croak at D tier. LMFAO

[NightlyNow]

Is this 2k and below tier list?

[GAIN CITY]

Originally posted by SakyunLight:

Is this 2k and below tier list?

grade 13 - 14 actually. and granted its from a 2v2 perspective which varies slightly from 3s.

and it was also prehotfix that just came out.


Croak is in D tier along with jade because neither are really doing anything to warrant picking them. croaks insane survivability is no longer the reason to pick him, rather his disruptive nature, which took a hit. his biggest synergy was well, jade, because of snipe combos, which still at the end of the day tended to lose to a simple shifu/pearl combo. jade took a massive hit to her survivability and viability, and as such i dont really think putting croak anywhere near decent is accurate. hes almost always a nonfactor in grade 13-14 and can easily be replaced by just about any other melee (minus freya because she's become rare these days)


for dps you've got shifu/rook, for survivability you've still got shifu.

for disruption you've got like all the other melees with incaps still.

for range threats you've got bakko and harby. him being D tier i suppose, is more a statement as to how fall behind he falls to other melees, rather than actually his state with relation to other character, i will fix the list slightly to account for this.

[Smug Kot]

Originally posted by Akira:

perhaps, i think the reason i view poloma as bad is because shes pretty squishy if you focus her down. you literally can't focus her linked teammates or its unwinnable.

Only if Poloma its dumb and not running ultra hardcore meta perk for self healing and escaping.

Originally posted by Rucktoe:

Jade and Croak at D tier. LMFAO

Croak its crap becouse its has to deal with invi-frames based champions most of the time at hight rank, bye bye ultimate/stuns.

Jade lost a invi-frames ------> straight to crap tier.

Rook got more ways to activate his invi-frames and RMB has invi-frames now ------> Straight to god tier.

invi-frames > everything

plz nerf invi-frames unbalance the whole game.

[Gloubi (mirage worst map ever)]

Originally posted by KICKER:

ugh 2v2 tier list *barf*

should have been the first line in your post so I don't waste my time reading useless opinions about balance in a joke game mode that can`t ever be balanced

when you graduate to the real game mode of 3v3 you will find all champs are viable

"real game mode of 3v3" when all the tournaments are 2v2 :))))

[GAIN CITY]

Originally posted by KICKER:

ugh 2v2 tier list *barf*

should have been the first line in your post so I don't waste my time reading useless opinions about balance in a joke game mode that can`t ever be balanced

when you graduate to the real game mode of 3v3 you will find all champs are viable

3v3 isnt' in anyway more balanced than 2v2. i find balance in 3v3 far more variable and far more onto team cordinations than anything. therefore, asking for a tier list in 3s is pointless because at the end of the day its 90% down to what you can do and team compositions, rather than specific characters themselves. trying to understand the actual tier list of team compositions, and the number of possibilites, would take literal ages to create and hoping for something as such when patches are coming out often is unreasonable.

that being said, i've honestly seen more tournaments in 2v2, and generally speaking, the prefered format of most esports tournaments if there is two modes on the same maps (as such disregarding twisted treeline) is the lowest number of people per team. this is because its far easier to organize, and get, smaller teams, than hope people can get together a ton of people for those larger teams.

but hey its not like i've organized tournaments and know the issue of trying to get even a 3 man team together reliably.

[Vern]

jumong totaly balanced..i mained it since today and climbing like a madman
tnx balancing team for giving me max range char with 16dmg/hit and 3iframes to play with..
new improved totaly not broken jade..im totaly not taking advantage of him atm facing mirrors all day long..tnx

[Leo Frank]

I agree with OP for the most part . At the higher levels these tiers are correct. Hame needs balancing for sure but its still EA. Lets hope.the devs pay attention

[Smug Kot]

Originally posted by Mops TENTACLE BOSS:

I started today and I've personally had great success with Croak. Maybe I just have good synergy with him but his mobility combined with toxin seem to make him really effective. Not sure why he's at the bottom.

Uhhh stomping noobs with croak its easy....later people will predict you movement and cloacking also avoiding you ultimate/stun damage with invi-frames.

[GAIN CITY]

Originally posted by Midday Delight:

Originally posted by Mops TENTACLE BOSS:

I started today and I've personally had great success with Croak. Maybe I just have good synergy with him but his mobility combined with toxin seem to make him really effective. Not sure why he's at the bottom.

Uhhh stomping noobs with croak its easy....later people will predict you movement and cloacking also avoiding you ultimate/stun damage with invi-frames.

pretty much this, in high tiers you run into the issue of his abysmal dps and hardly worthwhile ult. even among characters who rely on baiting out the enemies moves to ult (ruhkaan, sirius, iva, jade, lucie) he still sits pretty much in the bottom tier for ults. even when it goes off its pretty bad.

granted ex spit and ex cloak are good, and blades are.... not terrible? the lack of a real ultimate really hurts the character.

[Leo Frank]

Originally posted by Akira:

Originally posted by Midday Delight:

Uhhh stomping noobs with croak its easy....later people will predict you movement and cloacking also avoiding you ultimate/stun damage with invi-frames.

pretty much this, in high tiers you run into the issue of his abysmal dps and hardly worthwhile ult. even among characters who rely on baiting out the enemies moves to ult (ruhkaan, sirius, iva, jade, lucie) he still sits pretty much in the bottom tier for ults. even when it goes off its pretty bad.

granted ex spit and ex cloak are good, and blades are.... not terrible? the lack of a real ultimate really hurts the character.

All this. Croak at high levels cam do well but you have to really outplay others. The poison of his ult is just shrugged off with an iframe . He needs better burst for a squishy assassin or a devastating ult to capitalize on his sustain with toxin