Fredericksburg as CSA: Union doesn't attack Prospect Hill

[Swiss Samurai]

Has anyone else made this experience? Is it possible for the AI to be so passive? I started this phase 3x and the Union troops never attacked (I couldn't even see them they were apparently so far back).

[Kristoph42]

That has never happened to me. They always attack. Where did they attack you? At telegraph road?

[Bramborough]

Come to think of it...I had a similar occurrence during my first CSA campaign (Colonel)...Union only attacked on Marye's Heights, and I think maybe in the middle. But they did not attack the sourthernmost VP at all, throughout the battle. I knew they were out there...some scouting skirms caught sight of a few brigades, they just didn't advance.

[Ninjasquirrel]

Maybe you have too many troops there, the only times I seen the ai hesitate to attack like that is if you have that area packed and they're too weak to take that position.

[JonnyH13]

No it is not a bug but the AI strength calculator determined that an attack in that direction would be useless and focused elsewhere. Also historically the Union did not really try to flank the position and instead attacked head on with disastrous results.

[Hat8]

The AI tries to avoid where you're strong and gives up attacking after it's lost too many men or if you're too strong overall.

[Swiss Samurai]

Originally posted by Kristoph42:

That has never happened to me. They always attack. Where did they attack you? At telegraph road?

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/912416459773895109/4CEE2B7C3754DD54EDB90E365E4E697C4BBC9DFC/

They only really attacked at Marye's Heights. During the last phase of the battle they sent a few brigades south but they then just sat around and did nothing.

Some additional info: playing on BG difficulty, killed around 60k Union troops at Antietam and was using three full corps at Fredericksburg - so it could be that the Union AI was like: "Hm, I'm a bit weak right now, I don't want any additional losses in parts of this battle ..." which would actually be a nice feature, because while I only lost 2,5k troops at Fredericksburg now the Union also lost 'only' 25k - which is probably a good deal for them I'd suppose. If I'd gone for the (counter)attack it might have been another Antietam for them ... wow, now I feel like a general who could have crushed his enemy completely but bungled this opportunity (which proves the awesomeness of this game).

[Stone]

I have had this happen before. They ignored me on the first phase, the second phase went as planned, and the third phase they hit me hard with the units from the first phase and the units they got for the third.

[Kristoph42]

@ Swiss Samurai . . . LOL, if you would have counter attacked you would have lost more than 2.5k. Maybe the Union was hoping you would attack?? Regardless, that is a great victory because you lost a minor amount of men and get a whole bunch of recruits.

[D-Dub]

Originally posted by Swiss Samurai:

Originally posted by Kristoph42:

That has never happened to me. They always attack. Where did they attack you? At telegraph road?

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/912416459773895109/4CEE2B7C3754DD54EDB90E365E4E697C4BBC9DFC/

They only really attacked at Marye's Heights. During the last phase of the battle they sent a few brigades south but they then just sat around and did nothing.

Some additional info: playing on BG difficulty, killed around 60k Union troops at Antietam and was using three full corps at Fredericksburg - so it could be that the Union AI was like: "Hm, I'm a bit weak right now, I don't want any additional losses in parts of this battle ..." which would actually be a nice feature, because while I only lost 2,5k troops at Fredericksburg now the Union also lost 'only' 25k - which is probably a good deal for them I'd suppose. If I'd gone for the (counter)attack it might have been another Antietam for them ... wow, now I feel like a general who could have crushed his enemy completely but bungled this opportunity (which proves the awesomeness of this game).

YES.

I had this same experience the first time I played F'burg as CSA. It was spooky as all get out at first, as I kept waiting... and waiting... and waiting... and worrying. Then I sent out SKMs -- and found the Union huddled up in a corner. They were all weak-strength bdes, but there were plenty of them. The AI was savvy. And I missed an opportunity. Still, it was awesome.

[Swiss Samurai]

Originally posted by Kristoph42:

@ Swiss Samurai . . . LOL, if you would have counter attacked you would have lost more than 2.5k. Maybe the Union was hoping you would attack?? Regardless, that is a great victory because you lost a minor amount of men and get a whole bunch of recruits.

You're right, for we all know: "For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill."

Originally posted by D-Dub:

I had this same experience the first time I played F'burg as CSA. It was spooky as all get out at first, as I kept waiting... and waiting... and waiting... and worrying. Then I sent out SKMs -- and found the Union huddled up in a corner. They were all weak-strength bdes, but there were plenty of them. The AI was savvy. And I missed an opportunity. Still, it was awesome.

I was definitely not expecting such behavior and it shows me the creativeness of the AI in this game. Probably one of the smarter AIs I met in a strategy game.

[CivWar64]

Sometimes I think the AI prefers to sit back as the Union and pound you with artillery for a long time before deciding to attack. And it's a bit unnerving waiting, and waiting, and waiting. And during that time it usually sends only 1 unit ahead to attack, as if testing the waters. Waits a while, then does it again. And sometimes it then decides, "Oh, well, the arty didn't do what I thought, so no sense attacking."

I had this happen at Fredericksburg (across from the town), Cold Harbor (part 2), and Washington, Day 2 at the leftmost fort (Ft. DeRussy). In this last one, they finally swarm attacked after hours of pounding, and only after their reinforcements arrived way at the bottom left even though they way outnumbered me on that flank.

It reminds me of a Gary Kasparov quote after he lost a chess game to Deep Blue, stating that it seemed to have an eerie, human-like intelligence. I guess it's almost time to greet our AI overlords...

[PaloAlto]

Originally posted by CivWar64:

Sometimes I think the AI prefers to sit back as the Union and pound you with artillery for a long time before deciding to attack. And it's a bit unnerving waiting, and waiting, and waiting. And during that time it usually sends only 1 unit ahead to attack, as if testing the waters. Waits a while, then does it again. And sometimes it then decides, "Oh, well, the arty didn't do what I thought, so no sense attacking."

Nah. On the higher difficulties (MG or Legendary), the Union has no problem in attacking. It has everything to do with manpower. On BG or Col, especially when a player has decimated the enemy in previous battles, the AI just does not have the manpower to function correctly. Instead of attacking, it just cowers out of sight, because it knows it will be decimated if it attacks. One of the reasons I can't play the game on BG anymore. I just do too much damage earlier in the campaign and it becomes a joke of a fight later in the campaign. On MG or Legendary, the AI gets enough manpower, even if you are decimating the enemy in most battles, to still have sufficient numbers to be aggressive.

[Hat8]

Originally posted by CivWar64:

Sometimes I think the AI prefers to sit back as the Union and pound you with artillery for a long time before deciding to attack. And it's a bit unnerving waiting, and waiting, and waiting. And during that time it usually sends only 1 unit ahead to attack, as if testing the waters. Waits a while, then does it again. And sometimes it then decides, "Oh, well, the arty didn't do what I thought, so no sense attacking."

I had this happen at Fredericksburg (across from the town), Cold Harbor (part 2), and Washington, Day 2 at the leftmost fort (Ft. DeRussy). In this last one, they finally swarm attacked after hours of pounding, and only after their reinforcements arrived way at the bottom left even though they way outnumbered me on that flank.

It reminds me of a Gary Kasparov quote after he lost a chess game to Deep Blue, stating that it seemed to have an eerie, human-like intelligence. I guess it's almost time to greet our AI overlords...

The AI saw a suicide mission and decided not to engage. Shame that Burnside didn't have the same sense.

[Kristoph42]

@PaloAlto. . . . .I like your point, think you may be right.

[[MCS] Yoritomo]

Doing CSA on BG now, After Fredericksburg and winning Gettys on day 1 the AoP gained 80.000 new man per large battle. Skirmishers are 1000 Man units and Cav also and usual Brigades are 2000-3000 and a 3000 man Iron Brigade is not a soft target. While
AI outnumbers me now 2 to 1 on the smaller Battles around Cold Harbor and i have to attack.

wtf?