2nd Bull Run is impossible!

[Mr. sELfDesTrUcT]

Is it just me but is 2nd bull run, played as the rebels next to impossible? Could use some tips from peoplewho have beaten it with the rebs.

[Ashantai]

There's a very key point here - you only need to hold Stony Ridge and kill X% more enemy than you lose. You don't actually need to take Henry Hill - That's a second way to win.

Have reserve units behind your Stony Ridge Line including melee cavalry. When the enemy death charges your entrenchments countercharge.

[Speedkermit]

You need to have your strongest corp holding stony ridge. Ideally 12 infantry brigades with arty support.

[Mr. sELfDesTrUcT]

I think I screwed up long before the battle began. I am assuming 10.5k infantry and cannon is not enough to do the job. I had better results When I contested the center while slowly giving way on my left but,sadly, they took the ridge with a minute to spare. they mass so much infantry in the center it is hard to withstand with the numbers I have.

[Speedkermit]

10.5k infantry isn't really enough. The most important objective of the battle is to hold that ridge. Do this and you get at least a draw.

[Detail]

Its actually very winnable, you just have to stay disiplined, remaining in fortifications with supporting lines until your reinforcements showup. They will come at you but if you play dynamically you can decimate every charge. I use my calvary on my left up the hill to annoy and distract the AI on the Union right. Once you get reinforcements flank Polk at Stoney ridge while sending most of your reinforcements to attack the hill on your left, you don't need to attack both hills. I also send a couple units back towards Henry with Calvary to get a leg up on the final phase.

The other poster is correct, you have to get the deployments right to get your strongest corps at Stoney.

[Dragoneer]

Originally posted by luksm23:

I think I screwed up long before the battle began. I am assuming 10.5k infantry and cannon is not enough to do the job. I had better results When I contested the center while slowly giving way on my left but,sadly, they took the ridge with a minute to spare. they mass so much infantry in the center it is hard to withstand with the numbers I have.

yeah i had the same issue first, you need to get the recon talent so you can actually see how much troops you realisticly need, its completely possible to get on this battle with way to few troops and just get destroyed, however if you have 2 decently armed/reinforced corps, 2nd manassas is one of the easier grand battles, atleast for the confeds, im sure its harder for the union

[uhamster9]

Originally posted by Dragoneer:

Originally posted by luksm23:

I think I screwed up long before the battle began. I am assuming 10.5k infantry and cannon is not enough to do the job. I had better results When I contested the center while slowly giving way on my left but,sadly, they took the ridge with a minute to spare. they mass so much infantry in the center it is hard to withstand with the numbers I have.

yeah i had the same issue first, you need to get the recon talent so you can actually see how much troops you realisticly need, its completely possible to get on this battle with way to few troops and just get destroyed, however if you have 2 decently armed/reinforced corps, 2nd manassas is one of the easier grand battles, atleast for the confeds, im sure its harder for the union

Not by a long shot :)
http://steamcommunity.com/app/502520/discussions/0/152391995424877590/

[Chubbsmasta94]

Get as many 24pdr as possible and other good short range arty. Just camp there. When you get reinforcements, have them go to Stony Ridge instead of Henry Hill. The only objective is to hold that Ridge. The Union AI likes to attack at 2 out of 3 points. Most likely they will attack the Center and your right flank. So therefore move most of your arty and inf to support the center and right. Have 1 unit of inf or skim, watching your left flank.

[Specky4eyes]

I found the 1st day a very close run thing but survived by just holding the right wing and waiting for the pressure on the left wing to ease then moving 1 or 2 brigades to the centre.

On the 2nd day i shortened the 1st corps lines let the union build up in the center.The 2nd corps i split 60/40 with the smaller portion smashing into the Union left causing mayhem and then launching the 1st corps in a general advance.The larger portion of the 2nd corps i rushed below the town grabbing the flags and then hitting the Union army from behind.

[Speedkermit]

I recommend allocating all the arty in your army to the corps that is to defend stony ridge. station this artillery close behind your defending brigades and break up the enemy charges with canister.

The other thing to watch is supply, as many people run out before reinforcements arrive. Take the maximum amount you can. Also put your artillery on hold fire until the enemy brigades start getting close.

[76561198345797500]

put some of ur infantry brigades on the edge of the map before final stage。。so u can capture the Henry hill easily

[uhamster9]

Originally posted by fhs1206:

put some of ur infantry brigades on the edge of the map before final stage。。so u can capture the Henry hill easily

That's kinda cheesy, like putting cavs on top of skirmisher spawning points in Union Rendezvous mission :)
http://i.imgur.com/UICtjAK.png

By the way, 2nd Bull Run Union cheese is very much reproducible.
http://i.imgur.com/ryEB7RC.png

[I Like Potatoes]

When I try I don't know if others have the same problem but for me the Union puts almost all their units on my left flank. They use every single one to charge and I don''t have nearly enough to defend against it because they do put 2 or 3 brigades down along the rest of my front to keep my brigades occupied. Anyone else having this problem?

[IrateQuaker]

The charge mechanic is broken right now and hopefully will be fixed soon. Normally they mass on my left flank, their right. That's locks them in place but if you can somehow manage to survive until your reinforcements show up you'll be flanking their lines automatically.

[Aurion]

Yeah, you're probably going to want your best corps for the first day's fight, with the AO to field either a 16- or 20-brigade outfit. If you only have 4 per division, something like 12/4 infantry/artillery is good. If you have the AO for 5 per division, you can throw in a couple brigades of skirmishers or cavalry and a bit of extra infantry to flavor.

The AI likes to hit the CS left- so having reserves in that sector is crucial. In addition to the earthworks you're provided, the farms and fields stretching down from your left to your center provide good cover.

If you get pushed back from those, making a stand in the woods along the ridge and counterattacking out when you see an opening is better than fighting for every last inch

Historically, Jackson's corps used this strategy- the line bent where hit and snapped back with counterattacks rather than simply holding a static position. It's all up to personal preference really.

I usually try to have three lines of infantry in that sector (something like a 2 (earthworks)- 2 (close support) - 1 (reserve) arrangement with lots of artillery close by. Swapping brigades in and out of the frontline as they take casualties or get condition depletion from melee is always a good idea.

On day two, if you don't counterattack with your second corps (or second and psuedo-third for supply and flexibility if you have the AO) right away the AI will actually take another poke at the Stone Ridge line more often than not. Once you've bled the AI to your satisfaction, your reinforcements can sweep down through Groveton (the small town) and sweep over the First Manassas battlefield if you want.

e: Also, on day one, particularly early on, you might have some good chances to capture an AI supply wagon or two or harass artillery that deploys more towards your center without a lot of infantry support. Doing that makes the hold much easier because supply starts to become a major issue later on- historically, at least some troops from one brigade (Stafford's, IIRC) were reduced to throwing rocks when they ran out of ammunition.