The Lifespan of a Donkey

[Doh!]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=786809842

Ugh. Donkeys seem to have a short lifespan.

If the game is going to model a donkey's lifespan on that of donkey's living centuries ago in poor areas with harsh working environments, they they need to be cheap and easy to acquire as they were in those environments. (Personally, I'd prefer the 30-50 year model.)

[GZstar]

They really want you to use the ship permanently. That´s hard.

[Nakia]

First of all are the animals donkeys or mules. Please make up your mind Devs as there is a major difference. Based on the size of the animal to the handler I would say donkey.

Second the average age of a donkey in developed countries is 27 years and they can live much longer. In developing countries because of meager food and heavy work load it can be 1/3 that or 9 years.
Source: http://www.saveyourassrescue.org/donkey.html

Trivia note: Amish mules probably live for a very long time. They are gorgeous.

[cstoneburner]

Looking at the animals.csv in Vinay's mod (which I'm not sure if he changed the numbers on), it looks like they live to 45, I assume these are the same 3 years to a year as humans which would make them last 15 game years. If this is the case then it really doesn't scale up since you'll pretty much have to build a port per every two stables to keep them stocked. This is very annoying for mid to late game, unless one is looking to build port cities, at which point I supose it is fun to have an excuse for a bunch of docks (In that case, tho I want some variety in models of both docks and ships) On the upside, it's very easy to mod by adding a zero or two to die age :-)

[GZstar]

I hope for breeding in the end for late game. For the moment you can´t play big settlements anyway. It does not matter as long as this is the case. But smaller stables would be great for smaller villages. On my last map three donkeys did the job easily for the 150 people I was able to fit in the walking radius. They are not really inefficient. The docks you will need for trade or other things in my dreams later on. But with different models I would not mind building more than one harbour also later on.

[Nakia]

Depends on if those animals are donkeys or mules. If donkeys we should be able to breed them once we have a few. This item could be made much more interesting as per above posts.

[Casanova Frankenstein]

I don't get why I need a ship to get donkeys but pasture animals literally spawn from the ether as long as I have a pasture.

[GZstar]

You are right. The ship should bring all animals. But you needed too built the pasture first. Not knowing which animal you get, this is difficult. Same with chicken. Maybe they should be in a cage in the beginning. The other animals could be stored there as well as long as you do not have a pasture after discovering them.

[cstoneburner]

It's one of the mechanics I strongly prefer in Banished. - You buy the livestock from traders (mostly) and a pasture is a pasture is a pasture. You can switch and when they get hit by disease you WANT to.

Now if there were properly medieval, most animals wouldn't be pastured, just hearded on common, uneclosed ground, mostly grazed and if they needed stabling were often just housed in the house with the people.(and it's not like animals don't go in houses in this game - I just followed a moose in one). Admittedly that would make for tricky game mechanics but I'd love to see a game try it some time.

[Nakia]

Years ago I had a game by a German Company where the sheep had a shepherd do just that, take them out and take care of them just like once was done in real life. '

The "pastures" in this game aren't real pastures just pens where the animals are kept.

[cstoneburner]

Oh, fun! I'm glad to know that someone has done it that way. It would be fun to have wandering herds of cattle, swine, geese, ducks and goats as well as sheep, too. Chickens in the fields eating the bugs :)

[Nakia]

Originally posted by cstoneburner:

Oh, fun! I'm glad to know that someone has done it that way. It would be fun to have wandering herds of cattle, swine, geese, ducks and goats as well as sheep, too. Chickens in the fields eating the bugs :)

I agree. Fences around crop fields in real life were there to keep out animals because they did wander.

[Doh!]

By the way, I really wish the stables UI would let me see the age of my donkeys so I can try to time expeditions to replace them:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=789759485

Originally posted by cstoneburner:

It's one of the mechanics I strongly prefer in Banished. - You buy the livestock from traders (mostly) and a pasture is a pasture is a pasture...

I like this model, too. I honestly don't want to spend the money on an expedition that returns me an animal I don't want, especially if it requires a type of field I don't have. I'd even be willing to spend more on an expedition that returns exactly what I want.

[cstoneburner]

Yeah, I am very unfond of the expedition model. It's expensive,slow, erratic, scales up poorly for mid to late game, fails to do what you need for mid to late game and is unrealistic. Unless I'm trying to build a big community and want a) a variety of trees for decorative purposes b) now, donkeys , or am building in a harsh climate and need sheep I seldom bother. Modding livestock makes them a bit more interesting, but honestly not that much, especially since none of the crops offer real improvements over potatoes and apples. I'd love to be able to write a postive review for the game, but I really can't right now and this one of the reasons, especially since there is no good way to mod away thess issue (well I suppose you could make ports cost the same as a small house, ships a barn and expeditions 1/10th the current price and make them 1/10th the current durration. It still wouldn't solve the underlying need for late game external trade.)

[Doh!]

Originally posted by cstoneburner:

Yeah, I am very unfond of the expedition model. It's expensive,slow, erratic, scales up poorly for mid to late game, fails to do what you need for mid to late game and is unrealistic...

I just hit my least-favorite scenario with donkeys. I sent an expedition out because a donkey died of old age (I had not idea any were getting close to old age). The expedition returned with cattle and soon after another donkey died of old age... ahahahahahahaha... again, I had no idea my donkeys were that old.

Originally posted by cstoneburner:

...I'd love to be able to write a postive review for the game, but I really can't right now...

I wrote a positive review because, for me, EA should be all about testing and providing feedback. I like seeing how the feedback affects game development and what new things the develoeprs come up with. Yes, sometimes this kind of environment can be very frustrating, but I have at least a little confidence it will improve over time :)

[cstoneburner]

I'm avoiding doing an offical review until they either address my issues (it's not like I've been quiet about them ) or it goes out of EA or I get too bored with what the game can do and basically stop playing. In the former case I'll be happy to write a postive one, in the latter two we'll have to see where things stand. It doesn't help that Steam requires you either recommend for or against purchase. If I could do one that gave arguments on both sides without a general thumbs up or down I would do one now. I think for some folks it's a good game even as is (obviously I'm having fun or I'd have left and left a review by now), for others who have reason to be interested based on their description and trailer I think it would be a waste of money given the disjunct at several points between the game and the desription. For lots of folks those won't matter, for others they do.