Add option for head tracked locomotion for Oculus.

[Kurtino]

Most games either default at head tracking for directional movement, or have it as an option. Hand tracking for directional movement is very bad, since any action with the left hand causes you to stop moving the direction you want. I'm right handed, so I can't hold my gun and reach for the map behind my head with my left map without my character walking backwards or standing still. Can't do anything with my left hand and walking other than keep it locked actually if I want to move in the same direction.

Please add this as an option.

[falkenbbs]

Hand tracking for directional movement is not very bad. You are just very bad at it. I would absolutely hate head tracked locomotion, I hate that vomit inducing style of game play. But if that's how you play, there should be an option for you too. But Hand tracking is not bad just because you can't make use of it. How long have you been playing this game?

[Kurtino]

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

Hand tracking for directional movement is not very bad. You are just very bad at it. I would absolutely hate head tracked locomotion, I hate that vomit inducing style of game play. But if that's how you play, there should be an option for you too. But Hand tracking is not bad just because you can't make use of it. How long have you been playing this game?

It's objectively worse because you lose functionality of the left hand which is the same hand you use to move. Just because you cant handle the motion of head movement doesn't make it a worse option, or me bad at hand movement.

I've been playing this game for a while and it's not like the hand tracking stops me from doing anything special, it's just annoying to have to holster my gun which I'm holding with my right hand to perform other actions while I'm running, or to temporarily hold the gun in my left hand while I use my right hand to do other things. Or of course, sway instead of running the precise angle I want to run with the analogue because I'm moving my hand to grab a pistol, or a grenade, injection, map, etc. Also reminding you that the majority of people are right handed, and will be holding their gun that way.

You could tell me you think teleporting isn't bad and that I'm bad for not being used to a inferior movement system as well because it gives you motion sickness, but it doesn't make it any less restrictive. If you've played Oculus games you'd realise that head tracking is the #1 option, and hand tracking is almost always secondary.

[50andBad.ttv]

steer with your head ? mate, have you banged yours?

[Kurtino]

Originally posted by QQQQ:

steer with your head ? mate, have you banged yours?

I don't see what's so complicated, are you new to VR?

You could either disable tilting altogether, relying only on right hand rotation, which would still be better than left hand directional movement, or you make it so your forward direction is always whereever you are looking. So you hold forward and you will move forward based on the axis of your head, aka slight tilts in your head will make the forward shift along with you.

Otherwise your left wrist controls tilt. So if you move your left hand left or right your character moves. This makes it so you can't accurately move and operate anything with your left hand, because your forward momentum is effected. If you try to reach for the map behind your back, you'll actually walk backwards instead.

Vive users might not grasp this concept because originally they had no movement options at all other than moving their bodies for direction, but Oculus released VR without touch controllers meaning that all Oculus games originated with only head directional movement. When touch controllers came out they added hand direction as a secondary option, but still defaulted to head rotation.

[falkenbbs]

Originally posted by Kurtino:

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

Hand tracking for directional movement is not very bad. You are just very bad at it. I would absolutely hate head tracked locomotion, I hate that vomit inducing style of game play. But if that's how you play, there should be an option for you too. But Hand tracking is not bad just because you can't make use of it. How long have you been playing this game?

It's objectively worse because you lose functionality of the left hand which is the same hand you use to move. Just because you cant handle the motion of head movement doesn't make it a worse option, or me bad at hand movement.

I've been playing this game for a while and it's not like the hand tracking stops me from doing anything special, it's just annoying to have to holster my gun which I'm holding with my right hand to perform other actions while I'm running, or to temporarily hold the gun in my left hand while I use my right hand to do other things. Or of course, sway instead of running the precise angle I want to run with the analogue because I'm moving my hand to grab a pistol, or a grenade, injection, map, etc. Also reminding you that the majority of people are right handed, and will be holding their gun that way.

You could tell me you think teleporting isn't bad and that I'm bad for not being used to a inferior movement system as well because it gives you motion sickness, but it doesn't make it any less restrictive. If you've played Oculus games you'd realise that head tracking is the #1 option, and hand tracking is almost always secondary.

I do play onward games. Head tracking is not the #1 option IMHO, it ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ sucks. It makes me sick. But if that's your style then good for you. I would absolutely bet that the majority of onward players would prefer the hand tracking. I am right handed and have no issue at all with movement and controlling my weapons.

[Dazven]

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

Originally posted by Kurtino:

It's objectively worse because you lose functionality of the left hand which is the same hand you use to move. Just because you cant handle the motion of head movement doesn't make it a worse option, or me bad at hand movement.

I've been playing this game for a while and it's not like the hand tracking stops me from doing anything special, it's just annoying to have to holster my gun which I'm holding with my right hand to perform other actions while I'm running, or to temporarily hold the gun in my left hand while I use my right hand to do other things. Or of course, sway instead of running the precise angle I want to run with the analogue because I'm moving my hand to grab a pistol, or a grenade, injection, map, etc. Also reminding you that the majority of people are right handed, and will be holding their gun that way.

You could tell me you think teleporting isn't bad and that I'm bad for not being used to a inferior movement system as well because it gives you motion sickness, but it doesn't make it any less restrictive. If you've played Oculus games you'd realise that head tracking is the #1 option, and hand tracking is almost always secondary.

I do play onward games. Head tracking is not the #1 option IMHO, it ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ sucks. It makes me sick. But if that's your style then good for you. I would absolutely bet that the majority of onward players would prefer the hand tracking. I am right handed and have no issue at all with movement and controlling my weapons.

Same way here, as an Oculus user and right handed the controller movement is much more preferable to head movement. I have much more find control when it comes to movement and is far more comfortable.

Not saying I am against having options, but head directional movement is just much more inconvenient and inferior to me. It's like getting rid of free look in ARMA, Squad, sims, etc when you choose head directional movement.

[Kurtino]

Well getting rid of freelook is a downside I agree, but I think it outweighs the movement functionality of your left hand. Also, you can still freelook if you turn the analogue stick by the degrees opposite to where you are looking, just like you can with hand tracking, but it's a lot easier to do that with your head than hand as your head movement should not be anywhere near as fast as moving your hand unless you're snapping your head and possibly hurting yourself.

I mean they could just add an option for non-influenced movement as well, which would be the most efficient as you'd not lose functionality on anything. I'd rather have non-influenced than hand imo.

Still, I stand by the statement that head-tracking is the usual default for Oculus users. I have a lot of VR games, but this is the first one that not only defaulted to hand following, but made it mandatory.

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

I would absolutely bet that the majority of onward players would prefer the hand tracking.

Of course they would, since there's no alternative :P.

[Kobold]

+1 Kurtino

I was about to start a tread like this, please developers add headtracking locomotion instead left/right hand only.

I had some problems with handtracking in the past and headtracking would fix it... a good sample is suburbia with the house opposite the spawn house, just crouch and look up and your movement is always going in the wrong direction (mirror walk) after a certain angle... when you aim with your weapon to the top.

@Falkenbbs
If some people keep playing with hand tracking fine, no one want to replace it!
Devs can just add headtracking to option, just dont use it if you dont like.

90% of the time the handtracking locomotion is working, but there are trade offs and i would prefer headtracking locomotion.

[falkenbbs]

Originally posted by Kurtino:

Well getting rid of freelook is a downside I agree, but I think it outweighs the movement functionality of your left hand.

I mean they could just add an option for non-influenced movement as well, which would be the most efficient as you'd not lose functionality on anything. I'd rather have non-influenced than hand imo.

Still, I stand by the statement that head-tracking is the usual default for Oculus users. I have a lot of VR games, but this is the first one that not only defaulted to hand following, but made it mandatory.

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

I would absolutely bet that the majority of onward players would prefer the hand tracking.

Of course they would, since there's no alternative :P.

Why can't they base their decision off of using that feature in other games. I know From other Suns has that option and I hate it there too.

How do you strafe with head movement? Do left and right sidestep?

[falkenbbs]

Originally posted by Kobold:

+1 Kurtino

I was about to start a tread like this, please developers add headtracking locomotion instead left/right hand only.

I had some problems with handtracking in the past and headtracking would fix it... a good sample is suburbia with the house opposite the spawn house, just crouch and look up and your movement is always going in the wrong direction (mirror walk) after a certain angle... when you aim with your weapon to the top.

@Falkenbbs
If some people keep playing with hand tracking fine, no one want to replace it!
Devs can just add headtracking to option, just dont use it if you dont like.

90% of the time the handtracking locomotion is working, but there are trade offs and i would prefer headtracking locomotion.

At what point did I suggest that it sohuldn't be an option? That's precisley why I said "If that's the way you play, there should be an option for you" My only issue was in the statement that headmovement was the aboslute best way to play period.

[Kobold]

I own From other Suns and i love this game and the options to move in the game.

I dont just see a reason to discuss this... or why you defending handtracking locomotion this much, there are alot trade offs... if people like it okay, but Headtracking is alot more precise.

OP is right that you cant move where you want when reach out and grab your granade or tablet when you moving.

There are alot trade offs with handtracking when aiming at the top... and moving too in some kind of scenarios.

[Kurtino]

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

Originally posted by Kurtino:

Well getting rid of freelook is a downside I agree, but I think it outweighs the movement functionality of your left hand.

I mean they could just add an option for non-influenced movement as well, which would be the most efficient as you'd not lose functionality on anything. I'd rather have non-influenced than hand imo.

Still, I stand by the statement that head-tracking is the usual default for Oculus users. I have a lot of VR games, but this is the first one that not only defaulted to hand following, but made it mandatory.




Of course they would, since there's no alternative :P.

Why can't they base their decision off of using that feature in other games. I know From other Suns has that option and I hate it there too.

How do you strafe with head movement? Do left and right sidestep?

You move using the analogue stick just like you normally would, but holding it forward is based on where you're looking.

You strafe using the analogue stick as normal; the stick itself isn't changed at all, but if my body was facing forward and I was looking to my left, holding forward on the stick would move me towards where I am facing which is the left now, but I could still strafe or do anything else normally.

So if there was no hand or head tracking, your character would move forward at a set 90 degree angle and that angle would be manipulated through only the rotation on the right analogue stick, like any normal FPS game.

If there's head tracking, it behaves the same way as I just described, but there's a slight tilt in direction based on where you are looking. So if my head is by default at 90 degrees, within a 180 degrees if I looked towards the left or the right my forward default would be changed slightly as if I was sliding. You can offset this by tilting your analogue stick slightly opposite to where you are walking if you still want free look or your movement to be straight, but it's a lot easier to manage than hand tracking.

The hand tracking follows the 90 degree rule based on the rotation of the controller and is a lot more sensitive. This is fine if you aren't using your left hand, but if you do anything with it your movement direction is rapidly changed. Because it is tracking on the X axis, moving your hand away from straight easily manipulates it. Moving your hand and also keeping it the same direction is very difficult, because your hand needs to be facing forward but grabbing something on your belt or sideways on your chest changes the direction. Grabbing your map not only changes the direction but also flips it, so you are walking backwards as you grab your back if you still held forward on the analogue stick.

Originally posted by falkenbbs:

My only issue was in the statement that headmovement was the aboslute best way to play period.

You misunderstood me. When I said head tracking is the #1 option, I meant that it is the first one that is offered and default, not the best option. Top accessibility games usually give 3 options. #1 Head, #2 Hand, #3 No direction. Oculus games default to head as its default, because the platform was designed around it and front facing cameras before touch controls came out, and Oculus users are used to it. That doesn't mean it's the best.

In this situation, however, I would say hand tracking is objectively a worse tracking method as operating both the left hand and using precise movements is much more difficult. That doesn't mean Head > Hand is absolute; there will be games that don't utilise the left hand, and there are people who get motion sickness so it can't always be better.

[Skidrow]

Sry but head tracking is the worst way to do movement, you always need to look around and that is impossible when they have movement is controlled were you look, always return games that only have that, guess you simple prefer mouse and keyboard games were you dont have to aim up/down to.

[Kurtino]

Originally posted by CF Skidrow:

Sry but head tracking is the worst way to do movement, you always need to look around and that is impossible when they have movement is controlled were you look, always return games that only have that, guess you simple prefer mouse and keyboard games were you dont have to aim up/down to.

If I need to look left while I'm running I can tilt the analogue stick proportionate to the angle I'm looking, it's not hard at all. If I'm running and want to use my left hand with hand tracking on, it's a lot harder to precisely move straight forward without interrupting your speed/angle because your hand movements are a lot faster, a lot more erratic, and it's hard to accurately control your analogue stick when you're doing something like reaching behind your head.

Also I don't see how up and down aiming with a mouse is even relevant to this, since head tracking doesn't effect verticality unless you're doing something like flying/swimming, which this game doesn't have.

I'm all for having no directional movement as well, so not head or hand, only analogue sticks, but I'd like the option for both.

[Kobold]

Originally posted by CF Skidrow:

Sry but head tracking is the worst way to do movement, you always need to look around and that is impossible when they have movement is controlled were you look

Let me think that u never played HMD Locomotion... your comment is not true at all.