Night Surface Attacks On Convoys 1939-1941

[Mundzuk]

Night surface attacks on convoys were frequently used during the early years of the war. Are they possible in UBOAT, or is the AI too "good" at detecting them?

[The cursed Jäger]

In the current version, night surface attacks are not really possibile as the AI can detect you even in the darkests of nights.

[DECAFBAD]

They spot you when you surface inside the convoy. I wonder if this can be changed through modding!

[old.school]

What kind of distances did U-Boats usually attack from when doing surface torpedo attacks?

I know that they do it, but i just dont know the actual distances. Reason i'm asking is because i'd be willing to give it a few tries in game to see how the AI behaves.

[tequilatibbs]

Not possible within the convoy in the game. You can attack on the surface and get away from outside but not inside. Within the convoy you can’t keep your smallest profile towards every ship.

Ships in the convoy are around 1000 apart and detect you at that range.

You cannot mod the nighttime detection down without reducing the daytime sightrange which is already too weak for warships.

Would love it they would adjust this. Let’s see I guess. More people mention it the better

[Mundzuk]

Originally posted by old.school:

What kind of distances did U-Boats usually attack from when doing surface torpedo attacks?

I know that they do it, but i just dont know the actual distances. Reason i'm asking is because i'd be willing to give it a few tries in game to see how the AI behaves.

I have read 1000 to 1200 meters

[SpaceBikerV]

Pre radar-equipped escorts, i attacked ships surfaced at night, but the detection meter starts going up when you get closer than 2km of the target, i think

[No Toilet Paper | Boy]

The main caveat is whether you aim torpedeos manually or have the AI aim them.

AI Aim Torpedos
Pre-radar (1942/1943) you can 100% attack ships on the surface at night with torpedeos. The default max range at night is roughly 3km. However, if you have red lights, he alarm set and other leaders with men at the "Command Station" the range is even further.

Get 100% accuracy at a close to 90 degree angle and fire. If they are not taking avoiding action you will hit the ships. When shooting at Corvettes you may want to have the Magnetic firing mechanism in case the impact angle is not great/the torpedo slightly misses the boat.

The advantage of attacking surfaced is you can escape faster. The max speed of a surfaced uboat is faster/same speed as a corvette. Destroyers are a lot faster though.

Manual Aim
It's do able but you have to get your calculations right and likely launch multiple torpedoes with a wide spread. That said if you are submerged and get within 2km then there is the chance of being detected on sonar.

The only way to attack within a convoy on the surface at night is if the weather is really bad. That said the AI will instantly know your exact position when they are alerted. In real life there would be a lack of information and communication issues, which is difficult to fully factor into a game.

[tequilatibbs]

Originally posted by No Toilet Paper | Boy:

The main caveat is whether you aim torpedeos manually or have the AI aim them.

AI Aim Torpedos
Pre-radar (1942/1943) you can 100% attack ships on the surface at night with torpedeos. The default max range at night is roughly 3km. However, if you have red lights, he alarm set and other leaders with men at the "Command Station" the range is even further.

Get 100% accuracy at a close to 90 degree angle and fire. If they are not taking avoiding action you will hit the ships. When shooting at Corvettes you may want to have the Magnetic firing mechanism in case the impact angle is not great/the torpedo slightly misses the boat.

The advantage of attacking surfaced is you can escape faster. The max speed of a surfaced uboat is faster/same speed as a corvette. Destroyers are a lot faster though.

Manual Aim
It's do able but you have to get your calculations right and likely launch multiple torpedoes with a wide spread. That said if you are submerged and get within 2km then there is the chance of being detected on sonar.

The only way to attack within a convoy on the surface at night is if the weather is really bad. That said the AI will instantly know your exact position when they are alerted. In real life there would be a lack of information and communication issues, which is difficult to fully factor into a game.

Nah. easy to manual aim on surface at night using historical methods from outside the convoy and get away undetected (i have historical duds so launch two becuase 33% chance one will fail (no pre heat)). Fire from 1- 1.5 when making the dogs course to your target then move 45 degees from convoys course as soon as youve fired. You get away undected and move into a position for another attack.

Whats being discussed is operating WITHIN the convoy, a la Kretschmer. That isnt possible

[No Toilet Paper | Boy]

Originally posted by tequilatibbs:

Originally posted by No Toilet Paper | Boy:

The main caveat is whether you aim torpedeos manually or have the AI aim them.

AI Aim Torpedos
Pre-radar (1942/1943) you can 100% attack ships on the surface at night with torpedeos. The default max range at night is roughly 3km. However, if you have red lights, he alarm set and other leaders with men at the "Command Station" the range is even further.

Get 100% accuracy at a close to 90 degree angle and fire. If they are not taking avoiding action you will hit the ships. When shooting at Corvettes you may want to have the Magnetic firing mechanism in case the impact angle is not great/the torpedo slightly misses the boat.

The advantage of attacking surfaced is you can escape faster. The max speed of a surfaced uboat is faster/same speed as a corvette. Destroyers are a lot faster though.

Manual Aim
It's do able but you have to get your calculations right and likely launch multiple torpedoes with a wide spread. That said if you are submerged and get within 2km then there is the chance of being detected on sonar.

The only way to attack within a convoy on the surface at night is if the weather is really bad. That said the AI will instantly know your exact position when they are alerted. In real life there would be a lack of information and communication issues, which is difficult to fully factor into a game.

Nah. easy to manual aim on surface at night using historical methods from outside the convoy and get away undetected (i have historical duds so launch two becuase 33% chance one will fail (no pre heat)). Fire from 1- 1.5 when making the dogs course to your target then move 45 degees from convoys course as soon as youve fired. You get away undected and move into a position for another attack.

Whats being discussed is operating WITHIN the convoy, a la Kretschmer. That isnt possible

In the original post there was no mention of operating within the convoy or Kretschmer, only attacking at night, hence my answer. Not all night attacks were done within the convoy.

[wolf310ii]

Originally posted by old.school:

What kind of distances did U-Boats usually attack from when doing surface torpedo attacks?

It depended on the weather, in a moonless night and not to calm sea they could get as close as 400-500m.

[El Rushbo]

Originally posted by No Toilet Paper | Boy:

In the original post there was no mention of operating within the convoy or Kretschmer, only attacking at night, hence my answer. Not all night attacks were done within the convoy.

He was something of a daredevil at that. Attacking within the convoy was considered extremely bold and not many commanders would risk it. Realistically it was effective because the enemy generally expects an attack from outside the convoy, not from within. The development of ASDIC made the Allies confident that they could detect and stop a U-boat attack easily. However, since ASDIC is useless on the surface, nighttime surface attacks were very effective since U-boats were difficult to spot due to their low profile. Ideally they would get within 1000m to reduce transit time for their torpedoes plus the chance to miss is also reduced. Of course then came radar and the whole game changed.

[MOTA]

I have read on more than one KTB that on occasions, they had to run all engines full back not to ram the other ship. From what we read in those logbooks, attacks at nnight within 1.200 meters were common.

[Von Adder]

I have just been spotted at periscope depth by a destroyer in pitch black night in a storm while trying to flank a convoy. The destroyer was on the other side of the convoy and just came straight at me after I raised my scope. Immersion broken, uninstalled.

[SpaceBikerV]

Originally posted by Von Adder:

I have just been spotted at periscope depth by a destroyer in pitch black night in a storm while trying to flank a convoy. The destroyer was on the other side of the convoy and just came straight at me after I raised my scope. Immersion broken, uninstalled.

You sure you weren’t being loud?

[Martala--]

Originally posted by Von Adder:

I have just been spotted at periscope depth by a destroyer in pitch black night in a storm while trying to flank a convoy. The destroyer was on the other side of the convoy and just came straight at me after I raised my scope. Immersion broken, uninstalled.

Dont cry my friend, we find a solution for you. ITS EA! I waiting for the release. But you need to learn how you attack. I never ever had this Problem. I think you do somthing really really Bad wrong. 🤣