hedgehogs

[EquinsuOcha]

Ive been playing since sept 2019 and i think the last time i played was in February. Are there any plans to add Hedgehogs to the game?

[cato]

Yes

[RimmerA]

There are references to it in the game files so presumably it's on the list to be added.

[EquinsuOcha]

Originally posted by RimmerA:

There are references to it in the game files so presumably it's on the list to be added.

man i hope so... it would suck so bad to fight them

[El Rushbo]

It would be interesting to go up against a FIDO. More properly known as the Mark 24 "mine".

[Lanzfeld]

Originally posted by El Rushbo:

It would be interesting to go up against a FIDO. More properly known as the Mark 24 "mine".

Not much interesting about it.
You are dead.

[RimmerA]

Originally posted by Lanzfeld:

Originally posted by El Rushbo:

It would be interesting to go up against a FIDO. More properly known as the Mark 24 "mine".

Not much interesting about it.
You are dead.

Hedgehogs were kind of like that as well. Usually one detonating against the hull meant "lights out" for a U-Boat.

[Robthebob]

Originally posted by Lanzfeld:

Originally posted by El Rushbo:

It would be interesting to go up against a FIDO. More properly known as the Mark 24 "mine".

Not much interesting about it.
You are dead.

Probably one of the best summaries I have heard. Did have a good laugh at that.

[Arizona Breeze]

Originally posted by Lanzfeld:

Originally posted by El Rushbo:

It would be interesting to go up against a FIDO. More properly known as the Mark 24 "mine".

Not much interesting about it.
You are dead.

I think it would add an interesting feature: if you go quiet, it can't track you any more, since it's acoustic. Part of the reason it worked so well was that German captains didn't know about it, and dove while cranking their engines up to maximum power, to try and avoid what they thought was an unguided depth charge. So in game, you'd have to decide between immediate all-quiet at the risk of getting pummeled by a depth charge you could've avoided, or trying to dodge the DC and hoping it doesn't home in on you. Supposedly FIDO sank 37 U-boats and damaged 18, so it wasn't necessarily a 100% kill, but I would imagine it would be a serious damage control challenge for the player.

Fun fact: they cost $1800 each, which was only $240 more than the cost of an M2 .50 caliber machinegun in 1945. The whole production run of 4000 "mines" only cost $7.2 million USD, which was less than the cost of a building single Sumner class destroyer (without even counting its armament).

[Ghoul]

Originally posted by Arizona Bob:

Originally posted by Lanzfeld:

Not much interesting about it.
You are dead.

I think it would add an interesting feature: if you go quiet, it can't track you any more, since it's acoustic. Part of the reason it worked so well was that German captains didn't know about it, and dove while cranking their engines up to maximum power, to try and avoid what they thought was an unguided depth charge. So in game, you'd have to decide between immediate all-quiet at the risk of getting pummeled by a depth charge you could've avoided, or trying to dodge the DC and hoping it doesn't home in on you. Supposedly FIDO sank 37 U-boats and damaged 18, so it wasn't necessarily a 100% kill, but I would imagine it would be a serious damage control challenge for the player.

Fun fact: they cost $1800 each, which was only $240 more than the cost of an M2 .50 caliber machinegun in 1945. The whole production run of 4000 "mines" only cost $7.2 million USD, which was less than the cost of a building single Sumner class destroyer (without even counting its armament).

Thanks for that info!

Cheers

[athenian]

Why? Hedgehogs would mean near certain death for the U-boat. If the devs were accurate about it, in 1943, when the hedgehogs were implemented throughout the escort fleets, there would also be a much better Asdic. Not even Asdic anymore, but nearing true sonar. In other words, with multiple escorts attacking with hedgehogs, the chances of a Type VIIC escaping are 20%. And even less, depending on the crew.

[EquinsuOcha]

Originally posted by athenian:

Why? Hedgehogs would mean near certain death for the U-boat. If the devs were accurate about it, in 1943, when the hedgehogs were implemented throughout the escort fleets, there would also be a much better Asdic. Not even Asdic anymore, but nearing true sonar. In other words, with multiple escorts attacking with hedgehogs, the chances of a Type VIIC escaping are 20%. And even less, depending on the crew.

I googled and found this below. I think it would be hard, make survival difficult, and make planning that more important.

During WWII out of 5,174 British depth charge attacks there were 85.5 kills, a ratio of 60.5 to 1. In comparison, the Hedgehog made 268 attacks for 47 kills, a ratio of 5.7 to 1.

[athenian]

Originally posted by EquinsuOcha:

Originally posted by athenian:

Why? Hedgehogs would mean near certain death for the U-boat. If the devs were accurate about it, in 1943, when the hedgehogs were implemented throughout the escort fleets, there would also be a much better Asdic. Not even Asdic anymore, but nearing true sonar. In other words, with multiple escorts attacking with hedgehogs, the chances of a Type VIIC escaping are 20%. And even less, depending on the crew.

I googled and found this below. I think it would be hard, make survival difficult, and make planning that more important.

During WWII out of 5,174 British depth charge attacks there were 85.5 kills, a ratio of 60.5 to 1. In comparison, the Hedgehog made 268 attacks for 47 kills, a ratio of 5.7 to 1.

But that's a matter of statistical representation. If there had been 5,174 hedgehog attacks instead of only 268, the kill ratio would much greater than 5.7 to 1. The main advantage of the depth charge over the hedgehog was the psychological effect on the U-boat crew, which the hedgehog lacked.

[EquinsuOcha]

Originally posted by athenian:

Originally posted by EquinsuOcha:

I googled and found this below. I think it would be hard, make survival difficult, and make planning that more important.

During WWII out of 5,174 British depth charge attacks there were 85.5 kills, a ratio of 60.5 to 1. In comparison, the Hedgehog made 268 attacks for 47 kills, a ratio of 5.7 to 1.

But that's a matter of statistical representation. If there had been 5,174 hedgehog attacks instead of only 268, the kill ratio would much greater than 5.7 to 1. The main advantage of the depth charge over the hedgehog was the psychological effect on the U-boat crew, which the hedgehog lacked.

Maybe the ratio would of increased, maybe it would of gone down too. We don't have a crystal ball... best we can do is stick with that number. for every 5.7 hedgehogs systems fired one uboat sunk

[athenian]

Originally posted by EquinsuOcha:

Originally posted by athenian:

But that's a matter of statistical representation. If there had been 5,174 hedgehog attacks instead of only 268, the kill ratio would much greater than 5.7 to 1. The main advantage of the depth charge over the hedgehog was the psychological effect on the U-boat crew, which the hedgehog lacked.

Maybe the ratio would of increased, maybe it would of gone down too. We don't have a crystal ball... best we can do is stick with that number. for every 5.7 hedgehogs systems fired one uboat sunk

Fair enough but you cannot compare to depth charges unless you a have a similar number of hedgehog attacks

[Grumpy Old Dude]

Originally posted by athenian:

Originally posted by EquinsuOcha:

I googled and found this below. I think it would be hard, make survival difficult, and make planning that more important.

During WWII out of 5,174 British depth charge attacks there were 85.5 kills, a ratio of 60.5 to 1. In comparison, the Hedgehog made 268 attacks for 47 kills, a ratio of 5.7 to 1.

But that's a matter of statistical representation. If there had been 5,174 hedgehog attacks instead of only 268, the kill ratio would much greater than 5.7 to 1. The main advantage of the depth charge over the hedgehog was the psychological effect on the U-boat crew, which the hedgehog lacked.

Yeah, the main adv of teh depth charge was damaging Uboat crew morale. Thats nice. The man advantage hedgehogs had, was KILLING Uboat crews.

Dc's were dropped off the stern of the destroyer, after passing over their last known contact. The DD is dropping blind, because they lost contact as the target moved out from in front of the DD. Hedgehogs OTH, were fired FORWARD of the DD, WHILE the crew maintained contact with the sub. FAR, FAR more accurate and likely to result in a kill. Especially given that DCs explosions at a depth less than the subs, did little damage since most of the explosive energy went upward.