Levelling | Learning | Experience - noob confusion

[Offshore]

What is the difference between learning a skill, like alchemy, from an alchemist (Pay for 5 levels with gold) vs spending perks on the skills tree?

For example, I paid Arcadia gold to learn 5 "levels" of alchemy,

My alchemy "level" is 26 but I am 0/5 on the first rung of the skills tree.

So what did I pay for? To go from a low number to 26? What benefit does that have if I am still 0/5 "Alchemist"?

Thanks.

[Varanus]

Ok, so........You level up, by leveling skills. Every point increase, within a specific skill does 3 things.
1: Increase the potency of that skill. For alchemy, your potions are stronger. I believe 1% per point. But I could be wrong.
2: Allows for higher tier skills within that tree to be gained with perk points. The perks can either make that skills stronger, or have a new functionality.
3: Increase your progress to the next level.

Buying training doesnt give you perk points. It gives you skills points. You overall alchemy skill was 21/100 before training. Now its 26/100. So your potions are 5% stronger. And the experience to your next level increased slightly.

[xybolt]

Each skills can be "trained" by getting experience points. These are "Skill XP". This is rewarded by "executing" this skill.

note: all numbers aren't accurate and is explantory
Example for alchemy:
You brew a potion: +20 experience points.
You're planting something: +15 experience points.

In order to level up your alchemy skill from 5 to 6 you need to collect 50 experience points. For that, brewing three potions gives you 60 experience points. This will level up your alchemy to 6 and put the other 10 points to the "next level bar". Let's say, for leveling from 6 to 7, you need another 60 points. You already have 10, so you need 50 more. That is brewing three potions again. With that, you will level up to alchemy 7.

Each skill level gives you a slightly bonus. Like your brewed potion will be stronger when your alchemy level is 50. Instead of giving you +10 health for a health potion at lvl 10, you can get one with +40 at level 50, with the same ingredients!

When you start to fight, you aren't getting alchemy experience points but in other categories such as "one handed" if you are using a one-handed weapon.

With each skill level up, you get "general" experience points. This goes to your current level. If you are at level 10 and you want to go to level 11, you need to get 100 "general" points. By leveling up your skills, you are getting "general" experience points.

Starting from the above example, leveling your alchemy from 5 to 6 has given you 70 "general" experience points. 6 to 7 gives you another 70 points. Congratz, you have leveled up.

With each level up, you get a perk point. With this perk point, you can invest in one of your skill trees. Like alchemy, put one point in "alchemist" will give you an extra bonus on top of your skill level bonus: +20% stronger. So your health potion you have brewed at level 50 is giving you +48 instead of +40 (see above) now.

You can see those perks as a "booster" of your skills.

[Offshore]

In theory, could I keep increasing skill points without getting any of the perks in that skill tree? Just by endlessly "doing" that skill over and over again - like for example, spend the entire game in sneak mode but not spend a single perk on the Sneak perk tree?

Or does the skill progression cap out at a certain point if you are not adding perks?

[Varanus]

Originally posted by Offshore:

In theory, could I keep increasing skill points without getting any of the perks in that skill tree? Just by endlessly "doing" that skill over and over again - like for example, spend the entire game in sneak mode but not spend a single perk on the Sneak perk tree?

Or does the skill progression cap out at a certain point if you are not adding perks?

You can absolutely do that. Its quite common for people to do actually.

[xybolt]

Originally posted by Offshore:

In theory, could I keep increasing skill points without getting any of the perks in that skill tree? Just by endlessly "doing" that skill over and over again - like for example, spend the entire game in sneak mode but not spend a single perk on the Sneak perk tree?

Or does the skill progression cap out at a certain point if you are not adding perks?

Yes. It is becoming more difficult to level up once you're past 30. There are 180 perks to choose from. Even if you train all skills (and become level 80ish), there are still more perks to invest on.

You have to select which perk you want to invest to. A hint, stick to three or four skill trees to make it more "role playing". Like you can be a nordic warrior with an axe and a shield. You don't practice magic (not that you are forbidden to do that). In this role-playing sense, you only invest in "one handed" (to support your axe), "block" (to support your shield), "heavy armor", ... In another playthrough, you can opt for being a mage character. For this, you only invest in magic related perk tree. Etc

Other skill trees, especially sneak and speech are leveling up naturally, allowing you to level up a bit to get more perk points.

[Altbert]

Everything about leveling can be found here: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Leveling

[Offshore]

Thanks - yeah I'm following a natural course of what I feel like. So two-handed sword, over one-handed and shield. Sword over hammer or axe.

I love the bow so use it often and will level it up.

Love the magic staffs I've found - shout is awesome so will "level" that up.

Will get deep into alchemy to make healing potions and poisons, and make super expensive ones to sell, and farm the ingredients and sell all that too for passive income!

Will boost smithing to make my awesome sword and get to dragon armour level.

Also focus on enchanting of said awesome sword and armour.

[Offshore]

Skill Tree - I have 2 unused perks

On Alchemy, I am 0/5 with option to use perk

But on Smithing, it just says "smithing - can create steel weapons" etc but there isn't an option to use a perk on it! No 0/5 or anything - what's that about?

And I'm only level 16 on smithing - is there something I need to do first in the game?

[mikk011]

Smithing perks are 1 perk per armor type. Just click on Steel Smithing to apply the perk.

As you noted, some perks have several tiers (like Alchemy). Click on the perk and if your skill is not great enough, it will show the requirement to take the perk. For alchemy, you can apply 5 perk points (one every 20 points of skill 0 through 80).

Eligibility for perks is calculated from unbuffed skills. For example if you needed skill 40 to take the next tier of One-handed and you only had skill 36, you couldn't bootstrap yourself by wearing gloves with One-handed +10.

Mods, of course, can alter/mess up any game mechanics. It is on you to know what your mods do.

For most basic questions like this, the wikis are the quickest and most concise way to learn this sort of thing. https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Skyrim

[Offshore]

I actually don't see anything in that wiki related to "skills"?

And when I click on "Steel Smithing" as I say, nothing happens - it doesn't say "want to use a perk?" there is simple no option.

On the subject of smithing, all I want to do is make a steel ingot! I have iron ingots, I just got some iron ore.. and I have an ingot of Morendium or whatever it's called - how come it needs Moredium ore but a pure block ingot won't so? That doesn't maker sense.

[Altbert]

You need Corundum to make steel. Yes, that's a bit weird. Normally you create steel with iron and carbon.

[Ihateeverybody]

Originally posted by Altbert:

You need Corundum to make steel. Yes, that's a bit weird. Normally you create steel with iron and carbon.

If I ever went back to Vanilla I would probably be lost in a second. Have had immersive Jewelry so long and just used to their recipes.

[mikk011]

Originally posted by Offshore:

I actually don't see anything in that wiki related to "skills"?

And when I click on "Steel Smithing" as I say, nothing happens - it doesn't say "want to use a perk?" there is simple no option.

Re: Wiki. For heaven's sakes on the link I gave you under "Character Information" there are subheadings Attributes, Leveling, Skills and a bunch of others. Also, you could just type Smithing, or Perks, or Skills into the search box at the top of the left hand column of that webpage and get useful results.

Are you certain you haven't already taken the perk? Are you certain you have an available perk point (Perks to Increase 1, or more)?

If you have an available perk point, you meet the skill requirement (which clicking on the perk should tell you) and nothing happens your game may be messed up. Look in the pinned topic Helpful Links and References and search through the guides for instructions to validating (or verifying) your game files.

[Da_Higg]

You need to be at least level 20 smithing to take the steel smithing perk

Iron ore + Corundum ore = Steel Ingot. Most games would use coal as the second material to make steel but Bethesda decided to be different and use a form of Aluminium Oxide instead.

Solid corundum ingots are used in some later smithing recipes

[Offshore]

Originally posted by Da_Higg:

You need to be at least level 20 smithing to take the steel smithing perk

Iron ore + Corundum ore = Steel Ingot. Most games would use coal as the second material to make steel but Bethesda decided to be different and use a form of Aluminium Oxide instead.

Solid corundum ingots are used in some later smithing recipes

And the winner is this post. Thanks.