Psijic order are some strange folks.

[Saber]

so as it should be known by anyone who has played a mage build and in particular played the college of winterhold qeustline, this is a intresting part of it, however if you for some reason haven't done this qeustline and you don't want spoilers, don't read this next part, on the second ecounter with Quaranir (the Psijic order guy), he says he must leave, and he is a man of his word and does so, or does he? if you follow this man after he leaves the arch mage qaurters he actually just goes to the tavern and stands still, no new dialogue is opend and you cannot pickpocket him, Nor can you even hit him, thats right, attacks go right through Quaranir, From what i've seen he cannot be hit, probably to avoid glitches later on in the qeust line, However its quite odd that they chose to make him completly intangible from attacks, for exsample even children in skyrim can be hit with a melee weapon, however this man it just goes right through, to the best of my knowledge this is a unique property only found within this NPC, I might be wrong on that though, a theory i have is that he physically doesn't own a hitbox since bethesda probably didn't think the Dragonborn would actually follow him and try to hit him, which is kinda an oversight since he wears unique armor and any collector would wanna try to get that, But I digress.

[Rez Elwin]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Ihateeverybody:

No one can leave the order? Ah. Memory may be playing tricks on me, but I am PRETTY sure that was how the Mages Guild Got founded. ?Galerion book?, or Origins of the Mages Guild should have more.

Well I don't think you're supposed to due to security concerns, Vanus Galerion left only because they chose not to do anything about Mannimarco, he left to deal with it and his answer was the mages guild. As far as I am aware only those two left the Order permanently.

[alexander_dougherty]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

A psijic has never been self-interested enough to sell a secret.

Self interested enough to sell a secret???
You are aware they have no need of money and can provide themselves with every luxury desired? if they so choose....

[Magic Spazm]

I think the psijics might do things in such weird ways to influence the future events of the world with as little direct influence as possible. As if they have a timeline they're trying to achieve or something that leads to their ultimate goal of whatever.

[Gun Slinger]

You know I was frozen for two hundred years my wife killed and my son stolen. Now I'm chasing down a race of synths. Who can teleport at will it seems. I think the two groups are connected.

[GoreTiger]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

Incredibly strange folks... Instead of going the same path as the mage's guild where magic is opened up to the average person, they guard their secrets and stay hidden.... AND YET SOMEHOW HAVE 1,000 TIMES MORE POWERFUL MAGIC.

Does that make sense to you, because it doesn't to me. You'd think that magical collaboration would be a thing, thereby a smaller order of wizards would have more work when it comes to magical research, yet somehow the psijics seem to be the most powerful wizards in Tamriel despite their secrets and alienation, what am I missing?

It does make sense actually, Considering the nature of the magic.

The order likely wields powerful magic and artifacts that they consider could be easily abused or would lead to destruction if the knowledge got out openly. They're essentually the Brotherhood of steel in Elder Scrolls. Just look what the Eye of magus almost did when someone tried to harnass it's power for themselves on selfish reasons.

It's also likely the Order knows some kind of time travel magic. As we've seen they're able to stop time. It's highly likely they either know time travel magic, Or they have a very powerful elder scroll in their posession.

[alexander_dougherty]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

Incredibly strange folks... Instead of going the same path as the mage's guild where magic is opened up to the average person, they guard their secrets and stay hidden.... AND YET SOMEHOW HAVE 1,000 TIMES MORE POWERFUL MAGIC.

Mages guild was created by a Psyjic APPRENTICE, one who had barely begun to learn their secrets..... Not even the most talented Psyjic apprentice at that....

The Psyjic Order had many more powerful secrets even before the Mages Guild started, and they have probably removed dangerous secrets from the world since. If the Mages Guild had continued for another 5,000 years they might have reached the level of the average Psyjic agent, but would have had a long way to go before becoming as powerful as the Psyjic masters, let alone the Psyjic Grandmasters.

Now if Galerion and Mannimarco had mastered themselves to Journeyman level...... Mind you the Psyjic's attention to detail does leave a lot to be desired, Mannimarco manage to kill and twist fellow apprentices before he was discovered by Galerion.... The higher ups were too focused on esoteric matters and failed to notice their apprentices were dwindling in number..... Thank goodness Mannimarco never became a full Psyjic.....

[Eriane]

lol this is interesting, wish I had seen this before but it's funny that after a decade after its release, people are still finding new things about the game which tells a lot about a game's depth.

Skyrim unfortunately was released partially completed. There was so much left to do in the game where they didn't really get the chance of doing. Pretty much almost every major side quest is incomplete in some form. Even the civil war questline was significantly shortened with features removed / incomplete. I think the civil war mod re-enables / completes these things? Been a few years...

[Saber]

Its intresting to see how Discussions about skyrim, and the elderscrolls as a whole still are livley and fascinating, I would like to point out this discussion was started because i saw some intresting NPC behavior with the psijic order member who appears in this qeustline, The elderscrolls community is truly a wonderful place filled with people with different perspectives on pieces of lore in a game about a man yelling so hard things catch a flame, A whole civilisastion dissapearing off the face of the earth, Elfs taking over all of tamriel, and Volcano's errupting causing mass chaos, Please pardon any spelling issues on this comment, Thank you.

[Jubala]

Any Enb Series users? Can you help me on how to disable the bunny that shows up infront of the sun rays?

[Rez Elwin]

Ursprungligen skrivet av ScepticalSnicker:

Any Enb Series users? Can you help me on how to disable the bunny that shows up infront of the sun rays?

That's the defualt sun-ray used, it is meant to be replaced by a preset. You can delete it though. In the directory you installed it to and find "enbsunsprite.bmp" deleting that will remove the bunny.

[alexander_dougherty]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

Ursprungligen skrivet av alexander_dougherty:

Self interested enough to sell a secret???
You are aware they have no need of money and can provide themselves with every luxury desired? if they so choose....

So, they're like Starfleet, only Starfleet has people who go against the mission sometimes.

More akin to an isolated kingdom that uses a different currency, Starfleet mixes with other cultures and lets them in from time to time....

Psyjics have no need for money because their homeland is isolated so no traders, and they are self sufficient so can produce anything needed. So Money is only of intellectual interest, they notice what people will do for it, but have no use for it themselves.

[alexander_dougherty]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

I get it, they work differently than every culture that has ever existed and are incorruptible. Yeah, well written...

They protect the Sword and Goddess of Mana from the promised land.

I don't know about incorruptible, they did train Mannimarco, and while they probably learned lessons from that, it does allow for the possibility of them being corruptible.

It's more that we have nothing they want particularly, but it's always possible that they could be seduced, or if you have something they want, and they can't get around your security, then maybe you can bribe one of them.... maybe...

[alexander_dougherty]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

Sorry, I just finished reading the thirteenth chapter of art of war and a book about how MI6 operated during WW2. It makes all this very hard to believe.

MI6 was in the real world, Psyjics are fantasy, the two don't really compare.... MI6 along with it's other MI counterparts used every dirty trick in the books, and then invented a whole load more. If you've been reading about them, you'll have been seeing the exploitation of every weakness in the human psyche. Makes a group that wants nothing you have very unbelievable..

[alexander_dougherty]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

That's the thing, everyone would want what the psyjics have, and the Daedra would probably be looking to tear them down; and yeah this is fantasy but it is dark fantasy, and most of the tropes are about corruption. Even the most benevolent characters from TES history have a dark side - except for the incorruptible monolithic psyjics. Even the Greybeards with their message of peace had their 'technology' taken and used for war.

The Thalmor are using some real world espionage tactics in the fourth era, and the lore tries its best to flesh out these factions and give them character. I don't think 'it's a fantasy' is a valid argument when speaking towards how people operate and how they are driven, otherwise it wouldn't be a story worth reading at all.

(except of course for the fantasy driven curses and spells one might find themselves under.)

As I said, we don't have anything they want.
The Daedra might have something they want, but they are all too aware of the risks of consorting with Daedra. I'm sure some of they do get corrupted, but the rest take them down before they do any real damage.

I'm not using It's fantasy to say they are incorruptable, I'm just saying you can't use MI6 (or any other MI department that existed, we only have MI5&6, but MI1-8 existed during ww2) as a comparison.

The Psyjics exist in a pocket dimension that is at least partially in a different timestream (it's in ESO) and are totally self-sufficient. The only things they appear to want are fresh recruits (to bolster their numbers) and dangerous artifacts (to lock away). The recruits are probably gathered at an early age, to limit exposure to political corruption, and by the time they go out into the world they are indoctrinated with the Psyjic philosophy.

This makes it extremely hard to figure out what psychological manipulations will work on them, since they don't explain why they are doing things, if you even notice them to begin with..

[Saber]

Ursprungligen skrivet av alexander_dougherty:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Gazing Pete:

That's the thing, everyone would want what the psyjics have, and the Daedra would probably be looking to tear them down; and yeah this is fantasy but it is dark fantasy, and most of the tropes are about corruption. Even the most benevolent characters from TES history have a dark side - except for the incorruptible monolithic psyjics. Even the Greybeards with their message of peace had their 'technology' taken and used for war.

The Thalmor are using some real world espionage tactics in the fourth era, and the lore tries its best to flesh out these factions and give them character. I don't think 'it's a fantasy' is a valid argument when speaking towards how people operate and how they are driven, otherwise it wouldn't be a story worth reading at all.

(except of course for the fantasy driven curses and spells one might find themselves under.)

As I said, we don't have anything they want.
The Daedra might have something they want, but they are all too aware of the risks of consorting with Daedra. I'm sure some of they do get corrupted, but the rest take them down before they do any real damage.

I'm not using It's fantasy to say they are incorruptable, I'm just saying you can't use MI6 (or any other MI department that existed, we only have MI5&6, but MI1-8 existed during ww2) as a comparison.

The Psyjics exist in a pocket dimension that is at least partially in a different timestream (it's in ESO) and are totally self-sufficient. The only things they appear to want are fresh recruits (to bolster their numbers) and dangerous artifacts (to lock away). The recruits are probably gathered at an early age, to limit exposure to political corruption, and by the time they go out into the world they are indoctrinated with the Psyjic philosophy.

This makes it extremely hard to figure out what psychological manipulations will work on them, since they don't explain why they are doing things, if you even notice them to begin with..

I agree with this statement as a whole, Im sorry I don't have too much to add to this discussion anymore folks even though i started it, I haven't gotten too far into ESO yet so I haven't enough knowledge to quite keep up with you on this.