Is Blocking Worth it?

[Uscari]

I'm not talking about the Block Skill, which has some unique perks such as bashing, elemental protection, shield charge, I'm talking purely about blocking in combat.

I've been playing with a Two-Handed build lately and I have difficulty incorporating blocking into my combat style in a way that nets me more damage relative to the health I'm losing.

It seems like in Skyrim, at least with humanoid opponents, they recover from a successfully blocked attack a lot faster than in Oblivion, which means if you go for a counter attack, it seems like they'll get the hit on you regardless. It doesn't seem like they lost any damage in the exchange.

Sure you're reducing damage on the hits you do block, but if the enemy isn't losing any hits they normally would have landed on you, are you really accomplishing anything?

You can use blocking to regenerate stamina and magika, so I guess that's a factor depending on your build.

So how do you use blocking? Do you just hold M2 and power attack hoping for a stagger? Do you find that one-handed weapons synergize with blocking better than two-handed (ignore the difference between using shield vs weapon to block, I'm talking about weapon function times and combos).

[Uscari]

Publicado originalmente por grab these bandages:

If you don’t have ussep, you can invest 1-2 points into first block perk and have 10-20% phys reduction with any weapons, including torch. So yes, blocking worth it, especially if you fight vs dragons or 2h enemies.

I'm not asking if it reduces damage, I'm wondering if the damage reduction really does anything to help you win the fight, if you can't counter attack in time before ultimately getting hit.

I'm just trying to compare how effective blocking + attacking is compared to just straight up attacking.

[toasty frosting]

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

I just feel like unless I use bashing, blocking with Two-Handed just ends up giving them free hits, although I do regenerate magika and stamina.

It certainly feels that way. Especially with creatures; the weapon-block formula is weird and uses the ENEMY's weapon (which creatures don't have) instead of your own. Plus they often start to go Kenshiro on you as you've probably noticed. Might as well take advantage of your extra reach instead.

[deuceyd]

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

Publicado originalmente por grab these bandages:

If you don’t have ussep, you can invest 1-2 points into first block perk and have 10-20% phys reduction with any weapons, including torch. So yes, blocking worth it, especially if you fight vs dragons or 2h enemies.

I'm not asking if it reduces damage, I'm wondering if the damage reduction really does anything to help you win the fight, if you can't counter attack in time before ultimately getting hit.

I'm just trying to compare how effective blocking + attacking is compared to just straight up attacking.

Blocking is not really worth it no. If you go two handed don't even bother blocking OR doing power attacks if you mean to maximize time to kill. The recovery time it takes after doing a power attack to be able to follow up with another attack results in less damage than just using regular swings. A very strong combo is combining alchemy and two handed, craft an ample supply of restore health potions and just bind them to a key. Swing wildly with a two handed weapon (battleaxe has the highest dps since it has the same swing speed as greatswords due to a bug) and use healing potions whenever needed.

Honestly negates the need for armor as well as blocking. Pump all levels into health, get enchanting and get more health until you are comfy. Works just fine on legendary.

As far as one handed blocking, same problems. Not worth it to block because lower time to kill. Also blocking has a lot of bugs in general. The freeze time perk sounds really good and if it wasn't bugged would actually make blocking serve a purpose and be worth taking. The whole bash tree of perks, terrible.

[kharille]

wonder if block does anything for paralyze enchantment?....

[Vlad 254]

Publicado originalmente por Deucey D:

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

I'm not asking if it reduces damage, I'm wondering if the damage reduction really does anything to help you win the fight, if you can't counter attack in time before ultimately getting hit.

I'm just trying to compare how effective blocking + attacking is compared to just straight up attacking.

Blocking is not really worth it no. If you go two handed don't even bother blocking OR doing power attacks if you mean to maximize time to kill. The recovery time it takes after doing a power attack to be able to follow up with another attack results in less damage than just using regular swings. A very strong combo is combining alchemy and two handed, craft an ample supply of restore health potions and just bind them to a key. Swing wildly with a two handed weapon (battleaxe has the highest dps since it has the same swing speed as greatswords due to a bug) and use healing potions whenever needed.

Honestly negates the need for armor as well as blocking. Pump all levels into health, get enchanting and get more health until you are comfy. Works just fine on legendary.

As far as one handed blocking, same problems. Not worth it to block because lower time to kill. Also blocking has a lot of bugs in general. The freeze time perk sounds really good and if it wasn't bugged would actually make blocking serve a purpose and be worth taking. The whole bash tree of perks, terrible.

Yep.

I haven't blocked much in a long while unless I want to have some fun, maybe some bashing time or if I feel like leveling a bit later in the game. Blocking is not a priority for many of the reasons stated in this thread.

[Terratrox]

Publicado originalmente por Vlad 254:

Publicado originalmente por Deucey D:

Blocking is not really worth it no. If you go two handed don't even bother blocking OR doing power attacks if you mean to maximize time to kill. The recovery time it takes after doing a power attack to be able to follow up with another attack results in less damage than just using regular swings. A very strong combo is combining alchemy and two handed, craft an ample supply of restore health potions and just bind them to a key. Swing wildly with a two handed weapon (battleaxe has the highest dps since it has the same swing speed as greatswords due to a bug) and use healing potions whenever needed.

Honestly negates the need for armor as well as blocking. Pump all levels into health, get enchanting and get more health until you are comfy. Works just fine on legendary.

As far as one handed blocking, same problems. Not worth it to block because lower time to kill. Also blocking has a lot of bugs in general. The freeze time perk sounds really good and if it wasn't bugged would actually make blocking serve a purpose and be worth taking. The whole bash tree of perks, terrible.

Yep.

I haven't blocked much in a long while unless I want to have some fun, maybe some bashing time or if I feel like leveling a bit later in the game. Blocking is not a priority for many of the reasons stated in this thread.

Blocking, not so much. But shield bashing has a very, VERY high stun factor and can easily interrupt even the nastiest attacks.

On Legendary, I use it to interrupt Dragonsbreath and the bite attacks when I'm fighting Dragons. Like to the point that as soon as they can be stunned again, they get stunned again.

You can effectively stunlock enemies by shield bashing if you want to, completely negating all incoming damage for the duration of the fight. All for the low low cost of like 2 points in the tree.

Blocking isn't effective for 2 handing, but I use it sometimes when 1 handing when I know the attacks are really dangerous, like some of the Lurker attacks on Solstheim, or Draugr Death Overlord attacks on lower level characters.

You also assume that you're staying in melee range to get smacked again. But blocking is effective when you're engaging or disengaging in melee, where you can get smacked without being able to retaliate (Blocking those bastard Death Overlords with the Ebony Bows, for example)

[alexander_dougherty]

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

Publicado originalmente por alexander_dougherty:

Yes, you can land a hit, then just about bring the shield back into position... you can't afford to wait too long, but you can do it.

I feel like that might be the case with one-handed power attacks, which have a very fast animation, but I'm not so sure I can do that with Two-Handed power attacks or One-Handed regular attacks.

I often have better luck relying on the superior range of Two-Handed weapons and hoping to get stagger.

I just feel like unless I use bashing, blocking with Two-Handed just ends up giving them free hits, although I do regenerate magika and stamina.

Ah, power attacks, no you don't have long enough for one of them, just a regular attack

[alexander_dougherty]

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

Publicado originalmente por grab these bandages:

If you don’t have ussep, you can invest 1-2 points into first block perk and have 10-20% phys reduction with any weapons, including torch. So yes, blocking worth it, especially if you fight vs dragons or 2h enemies.

I'm not asking if it reduces damage, I'm wondering if the damage reduction really does anything to help you win the fight, if you can't counter attack in time before ultimately getting hit.

I'm just trying to compare how effective blocking + attacking is compared to just straight up attacking.

It depends on the enemy, some enemies you are better kiting around them and dodging, some you are better blocking and using the pause for a swing or two... mostly it's not worth it, but sometimes it is, and that's why I said Yes it was worth it...

[jss1138]

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

I'm wondering if the damage reduction really does anything to help you win the fight

It keeps you alive longer, so...yes. Yes it does.

[Liquid Inc]

blocking can work, depending on your combat mods. "Timed block" from wildcat for example can stun the attacker, and it can be done with a one-handed or two-handed weapons, not just a shield so such a thing is useful i find.

i will generally try to bash/stun an NPC with a two-handed especially so if it has it raised - high chance of it being knocked back and therefore an easy kill.

However, vanilla wise? it was a skill i barely even remember existed, let alone used.

[fmalfeas]

The best defense is a Daedric Greatsword tempered to Legendary and enchanted with Absorb Health.

[RadCon One]

Publicado originalmente por alexander_dougherty:

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

Is half a second long enough to land a hit and block before they can strike again?

I feel like in my experience it isn't, although maybe it depends on the type of weapon you use, and whether you're using a power attack or normal attack.

Yes, you can land a hit, then just about bring the shield back into position... you can't afford to wait too long, but you can do it.

In Vanilla? No, you can not, as blocking does not slow them in any way, and many times causes their attacks to rebound back even faster than if you did nothing. MAYBE a dagger's normal attack is enough, but even a sword can't slip an attack in after a block and be back at the ready before the next.

Blocking in vanilla is a purely thematic choice, unless you are taking a companion and acting as the group tank and just blocking and chugging potions.

This is best solved by not having a vanilla experience, and luckily Skyrim has one of best, if not the best, modding communities out there.

[HazakTheMad]

They do get staggered slowing them enough to hit them once or twice.
It can on occasion have the sorta block repeatedly in quick succession that doesn't stagger, but that doesn't always happen, for me it happens rarely.

[Uscari]

Publicado originalmente por jss1138:

Publicado originalmente por Uscari:

I'm wondering if the damage reduction really does anything to help you win the fight

It keeps you alive longer, so...yes. Yes it does.

Sure it keeps you alive longer, but if you have to trade an equal or greater amount of damage you could have done to the enemy by staying alive longer, aren't you making harder for you to ultimately win the fight?

Like you live longer, but so does your enemy because you're blocking instead of attacking.

Publicado originalmente por Liquid Inc:

blocking can work, depending on your combat mods. "Timed block" from wildcat for example can stun the attacker, and it can be done with a one-handed or two-handed weapons, not just a shield so such a thing is useful i find.

i will generally try to bash/stun an NPC with a two-handed especially so if it has it raised - high chance of it being knocked back and therefore an easy kill.

However, vanilla wise? it was a skill i barely even remember existed, let alone used.

I'm playing vanilla, I don't really like to mod the game.

Publicado originalmente por RadCon One:

Publicado originalmente por alexander_dougherty:

Yes, you can land a hit, then just about bring the shield back into position... you can't afford to wait too long, but you can do it.

In Vanilla? No, you can not, as blocking does not slow them in any way, and many times causes their attacks to rebound back even faster than if you did nothing. MAYBE a dagger's normal attack is enough, but even a sword can't slip an attack in after a block and be back at the ready before the next.

Blocking in vanilla is a purely thematic choice, unless you are taking a companion and acting as the group tank and just blocking and chugging potions.

This is best solved by not having a vanilla experience, and luckily Skyrim has one of best, if not the best, modding communities out there.

Yeah blocking itself seems ineffective from a pure Damage/HP trade off standpoint.

However, what do you think of bashing, elemental protection, or the shield charge perk? Do you think those make blocking potentially viable?

Maybe the idea behind block was that if you're a build that incorporates magic like healing spells into your combat, you'd have more time for magic to regenerate.

[HazakTheMad]

Blocking, as a skill and an fighting technique is quite viable, the fourth most powerful build is sword and shield.