Is all Bethesda game glitchy and full of bugs? And why is it so?

[hello wods`]

title

been fixing a lot of bugs and glitches here and there lol

[Shawnf1273]

Escrito originalmente por Halcyform:

It's because Betathesda is lazy.

They pump out half finished games because they can get away with it. People pay to turn themselves into beta testers. It's why I don't preorder, don't pay full price for stuff and generally wait until I feel the game won't be too much of a disaster when I get around to buying it.

-yes, yes i thought that i was the only one that does that, i never pre-order and all ways wait on a sale
-the Skyrim Anniversary upgrade for the PS4 was only thing that i ever paid full price for because i got tired of waiting Sony to put it on sale

[Yellowbeard]

"Writing, audio, music, graphics art...and the ability to mod it to your liking.

The bugs were so players could make a one time payment for the game and won't have their relationship with the publishers and in turn the developers soured by 'Minority Report' level marketing.

Made cheap...made great...DIY after initial sale.

In the beginning...the bugginess was a result of pushing the tech a bit much...like E.T. for the Atari 2600...but able to be modded. Later...as the tech became more stable...that bugginees level was only reduced slightly...just enough...

...and then the 1.6+ 'Stadia conversion' mess began." - Chris Claremont

https://i.imgflip.com/8ws76z.jpg

[Shawnf1273]

Atari 2600, wow you sound like you're round about my age
lol, you ever had a colecovision gaming console
i wish i knew how to mod, i have so many ideas for so many games

[Ghost]

They have previously stated that they don't do things because the community will do it for them. They have gotten increasingly lazy and the games increasingly shallow.

Escrito originalmente por R4ndomG4mer:

Stop blaming Bethesda. By themselves, their games are pretty stable and I (and most people) have had very few problems over the years. The people who complain about the games being excessively glitchy, are invariably the ones who mod the game to the point where it isn't even recognizable, then choose to blame their personal decisions on Bethesda. If you add dozens of custom programs into the game, its obviously going to be far less stable, but y'all choose to shift responsibility.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvuhWyOW_HU

[Altbert]

I think it's more like "because the community already did it for them". Just look at all the released patches for Skyrim Classic and Skyrim Special Edition. Bethesda gave us the Creation Kit (Skyrim) and the Construction Set (Morrowind & Oblivion) for free, and we were capable of modding the hell out of those games, both creating mods and adding mods to the game. LOOT already solved the load order issue to some extend (at least for the smaller load orders, in my case about 200 to 250 mods). We have some proper tools available since Morrowind, such as xEdit and Wrye Bash. Various good fixes have been released like the Unofficial Patches by Arthmoor (whether you like them or not) and SSE Engine Fixes.

Using mods is a responsibility of the user, not Bethesda. Just READ the mod's description page about requirements, install instructructions, incompabilities, etc. Probably for many TLDR.

I have run stable games since Morrowind, by being careful which mods to add to my game. And, if my game had a CTD, it was always my own fault!

I don't blame Bethesda for not solving issues, the community has already solved. It's better to solve issues not covered by the community.

[Ghost]

Escrito originalmente por Altbert:

I think it's more like "because the community already did it for them". Just look at all the released patches for Skyrim Classic and Skyrim Special Edition.

Which makes sense from a business point of view, but I'm talking about during development and before release of the various mods and patches.

[Zero McDol]

There's a lot that goes into Bethesda games, from what I can tell. Of course, I only have Skyrim and Fallout NV, but from what I can see when I play, a lot of work was put into immersion.

Naturally all of this immersive value requires coding, and I'm pretty sure that Bethesda did a ton of it. The more code, the more potential bugs that can result.

[Ghost]

Escrito originalmente por Zero McDohl:

There's a lot that goes in to Bethesda games, from what I can tell. Of course, I only have Skyrim and Fallout NV, but from what I can see when I play, a lot of work was put into immersion.

New Vegas was made by Obsidian, Bethesda were the publishers.
---
Yes, there's a lot that goes into them, and they tend to look nice in comparison at their time of release, but they're shallow. They're good at the feel, but when you take a minute to think about things or peel back the curtains slightly, you notice all the cracks.

When your lead developers are talking about all these cool ideas they have and then going '♥♥♥♥ it, the fans will mod it in anyway' instead of doing it - that's a problem.
When they throw logic and basic storytelling out the window - that's a problem.
When they know about soft-locking and potentially game-breaking bugs and don't fix them because 'the community will do it for us' - that's a problem.
When you market the game as an RPG and then say "We don't make RPG's, we make dungeon crawlers" - that's a problem.

[Altbert]

Escrito originalmente por Ghost:

Escrito originalmente por Altbert:

I think it's more like "because the community already did it for them". Just look at all the released patches for Skyrim Classic and Skyrim Special Edition.

Which makes sense from a business point of view, but I'm talking about during development and before release of the various mods and patches.

Agreed! I always am disturbed about inconsistencies in the game, such as in scripts, but also in quest design. For one, it lacks agreement on programming standards in the scripts.

[Zero McDol]

Escrito originalmente por Ghost:

Escrito originalmente por Zero McDohl:

There's a lot that goes in to Bethesda games, from what I can tell. Of course, I only have Skyrim and Fallout NV, but from what I can see when I play, a lot of work was put into immersion.

New Vegas was made by Obsidian, Bethesda were the publishers.
---
Yes, there's a lot that goes into them, and they tend to look nice in comparison at their time of release, but they're shallow. They're good at the feel, but when you take a minute to think about things or peel back the curtains slightly, you notice all the cracks.

When your lead developers are talking about all these cool ideas they have and then going '♥♥♥♥ it, the fans will mod it in anyway' instead of doing it - that's a problem.
When they throw logic and basic storytelling out the window - that's a problem.
When they know about soft-locking and potentially game-breaking bugs and don't fix them because 'the community will do it for us' - that's a problem.
When you market the game as an RPG and then say "We don't make RPG's, we make dungeon crawlers" - that's a problem.

To each their own.

At the very least, Skyrim is more than good enough -> to me, even vanilla. Sorry, but I just don't share those feelings, especially when I start comparing the little things that I see in Skyrim to other games that I've played. Not that it's a contest, mind you, but the fact that I'm still playing Skyrim whereas I've quit other games of this type, tells me that this game is quite in sync with my taste and preferences. Of course modded Skyrim is better, but the base game is good enough -> imo.

edit:
Also true about New Vegas. I forgot that Obsidan built that one.

[Anvos]

The answer is yes, and Bethesda got lazy because they could rely on modders making unofficial patches to fix their game for them. Also their refusal to upgrade the engine to fix issues that are inherent to the engine.

[dryadsdad]

I'm having some problems to the point I had to research how to use the console and kill two quests because I was unable to move forward. I'm using a vanilla SE I purchased maybe a month ago.

In both cases I suspect the issue was due to the open world aspect of the game. If my further comments are spoilers or not permitted, I hope the mods will delete this post.

In my first problem, I discovered Ancestor Grove while aimlessly wandering. I had a major battle with some spriggens and then entered the area with moths that I thought were butterflies. I didn't see any reason to explore further so left. When I got the quest for real, I got to a point past this area where I was unable to move forward so I finished the quest using the console.

Same thing again when wandering I encountered some dark seducers, had a fight and ended up killing the leader. Later when I got the quest through proper channels, I found the dead leader where I left him but he also had a note added. However, the game acted as if I'd also played the related quest with some golden somethings. I had no idea how to move on so killed that one too.

I'm regularly getting freezes when the scene changes. The only way out is to reboot. I now have at least one and likely more entries to my journal that I can't remove and am afraid to try to play for fear of messing some core element of the game up.

In the moth business above. I had to use the console also to equip some items I was supposed to get at the end. I had hoped to play this through without cheats but here I am doing just that but still have bits and pieces of broken quests in my journal.

[Dale]

They call it BUGS_thesda for a reason. Pizz-poor [incompetent] management with little (or nonexistent) quality-assurance. I've been in the computer industry for 45+ years. Every time I hear "artificial intelligence" - me and my buddies laugh our azzes off. Usually remote controlled drone in a van; a block away. On front cover of Scientific American was a round plate with a cone-shaped pile of salt. Caption at the bottom: when it comes to complexity - try removing ONE grain of salt and see what happens.

When LOTS & LOTS of folks write different parts of the program & use "who-knows-what" purchased subroutines -- they crash into each other. This was demonstrated with the Hubble telescope where parts were made in different countries (some metric & others imperial measurements). AND the reason they had to send up the shuttle to correct the damn thing.

Much has to do with NOT releasing resources (freemain) when acquired (getmain) because there is no coordination. I proved this. I started simply walking from one end of the map to the other (in Fallout-4). 3/4 of the way - CRASH! Then to add insult to injury, Nexus mod has "the UNOFFICIAL patch to fix 400+ bugs". Once they have our money - they let the MOD developers act at their cheap QA.
Some in this thread have said the same thing.

POINT#1: In a BUGS_thesda game, save & exit game & restart every hour!
POINT#2: Wait a year or two, for them to iron out SOME of the bugs before buying.

Other game companies - not so. Witcher-3 & Horizon games crashed only ONCE (or 2) after play hundreds of hours.

[UsernameTaken666]

Yes, yes they are. I love them all the same.

[Ghost]

They're good playgrounds, and that's enough, particularly once the modders start going.
But they could also be so much better.