Does anyone know how Random Encounters are Decided.

[Ihateeverybody]

I am interested in the actual mechanics of how an encounter is generated at the Encounter points. Lets take two examples of Whiterun Encounter spots (ES).

1. ES between White River Watch and Grey Winter Watch - This seems to be an EVENT type spawn point. Mostly its a stationary event. Ice and Fire Mage Battle, Vigilent and Skeliton battle. Stupid Idiot trying to raise dead wolf, 3 pit wolves and the Bouncer, Barsomone looking for ingrediants for the Gourmet. Essentially staying put. Though I have had 2 Bandit chiefs and 2 Bandits encounters there (which are mobile) but I can't say for certain they spawned there as they look to come from up the road near Gray Winter.

2. ES Between Battleborn Farm and the Eastern Whiterun Watch Tower. This seems to be a mobile spawn point. Animal spawns, Farmer with Cow, Random Non aggro Giant, Imperial, Stormcloak, thalmor Patrol. Prisoner escort. Essentially moving stuff. Have had the 2 Chiefs and 2 Bandits spawn here also.

So those are not complete lists, but am using to describe what I THINK those areas do.

But I can't see what the mechanics of the Determination factor of how the game chooses what is there at any given time. I don't know where/how to look or understand it if I saw it.

Does anyone else know or point me in the right direction.

Reason I am asking is every once in a while I get a crash approaching a spawn point. I am thinking I can use this to determine what might be the cause of the crash as in my experience the spawns come in patterns (I usually see patrol type followed by another Patrol type or Prisoner escort followed by other type Prison Escort).

[dexter]

https://elderscrolls.fandom.com/wiki/Random_Encounters_(Skyrim)

The only way to really know what is crashing your game from that list would be a crash logger and seeing what the crash log points to as the likely cause.

[dexter]

You could probably check the creation kit and look around the cell that's crashing your game. There's probably random encounter markers that'll tell you what events can happen there. From there you could whittle down the list of causes

[Ihateeverybody]

Interesting list. I can see a few I don't recall ever seeing (and they have no pre requisite stage completion listed).

Definately interesting reading. Thanks!

[Corinze]

Yeah enabling papyrus logging would be the best bet. Hopefully it would pin point something useful to investigate within the CK.
Just remember papyrus logs are not a crash log, it just provides what's happening script wise before the crash.
If you think you have it pinned down to certain areas and when encounters occur, you'll need to load all those mods with the Creation Kit to get a true picture. Sadly it's normally something silly like double stacked spawn markers or a navemesh issue.

[Altbert]

On this page[en.uesp.net] you will find a complete overview of all random (and non-random) encounters, called World Interactions.

The page gives some explanations, but for details you should check out all the WI script files.

[smr1957]

Everyone keeps going on about crash logs, but unless a person knows how to read them (and even often if a person does), they are worse than useless - worse because a person ends up wasting a LOT of time whereas if they had tested their build in the following manner, they would have solved it in less time than they spent trying to analyse the log. Following this general outline is the best way to troubleshoot CDT issues caused by a mod:

Troubleshooting Your Load Order
https://steamcommunity.com/app/489830/discussions/0/3109142236155416522/
(from PINNED TOPIC Helpful Links and References, Section 5 - General Troubleshooting)

[Ihateeverybody]

I am most interested in how the encounter is determined (Why does it spawn, this encounter at this time vs another, Reloading or restarting the game will generate a different encounter. However if hitting points subsequently it often chooses the next encounter on the list instead of a totally unrelated encounter at another place on the list).

I suspect there is a bug with Immersive Creatures and one of the spawn types I disabled, but It could just be script overload if I haven't saved and exited in a while, depending on what I have been doing. No reason it can't be both; a combination of both; or totally unrelated.

Around Whiterun though is where it is most likely to happen, as it is a happening place.

I looked through the WI quest a few weeks back (I think I was looking on how to trigger someone else taking over the Bannered Mare if she dies (without actually killing her). Turns out Mikail takes over. ) but I can't say as I understood anything in it.

[Altbert]

Originally posted by Ihateeverybody:

I am most interested in how the encounter is determined (Why does it spawn, this encounter at this time vs another, Reloading or restarting the game will generate a different encounter. However if hitting points subsequently it often chooses the next encounter on the list instead of a totally unrelated encounter at another place on the list).

Some of the encounters are not randomized, but depend on quests, player level. Others are randomized. Sometimes, getting near a spawn point, you may not have an encounter and sometimes you may have the same encounters a couple of times in a row. I haven't checked how this actually works. It may be some randomizer in the scripts, quests or even the SM Event Nodes. I have seen the same encounters a couple of times, so it may even be time related (a register for single update).

Originally posted by Ihateeverybody:

I suspect there is a bug with Immersive Creatures and one of the spawn types I disabled, but It could just be script overload if I haven't saved and exited in a while, depending on what I have been doing. No reason it can't be both; a combination of both; or totally unrelated.

Maybe xEdit's "Check for Errors" could be of help?

Originally posted by Ihateeverybody:

Around Whiterun though is where it is most likely to happen, as it is a happening place.

I looked through the WI quest a few weeks back (I think I was looking on how to trigger someone else taking over the Bannered Mare if she dies (without actually killing her). Turns out Mikail takes over. ) but I can't say as I understood anything in it.

I suppose you are using the unofficial patch. The patch lets Michael take over the Bannered Mare, as Ysolda is destined to take over Belethor's General Goods when Belethor dies.

Around Whiterun could be caused by the timeframe within encounters happen. I've seen Nazeem visit his farm twice on the same day (AI Overhaul).

[Corinze]

I'll concur that Immersive Creatures is buggy. I personally stopped using it, with larger load orders. Even if you patch everything it is still buggy.

[smr1957]

Thinking about this brought to mind an issue I had when I was first creating my current build a couple of years ago. I was also getting CTDs around certain encounter spawn points (those in more heavily modded or populated areas). I use the mod Genesis Surface Spawns - Encounters Unlevelled - https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/12940 , and I tracked it down to the number of NPCs being spawned by that mod - apparently, when multiple NPCs were spawned, it hit the tipping point of what the game was able to handle, and BANG! CTD. So I set the the mod to only spawn one creature or NPC and that solved the issue.

So, it could be that the number of NPCs or creatures being spawned at one time may be a contributory factor in you getting CTDs at those points. Something to consider, anyway.

[Corinze]

That's interesting SMR. I wonder if Actor Limit Fix would help?
Can you post your load order IHEB. Maybe something will stand out.

[Ihateeverybody]

Immersive Creatures has some settings for spawn numbers. Next Playthrough I will take then down a notch or two (animals and Creatures) and see what the difference is. Good Point. I will occasionally get 5 or more Animal Spawns (wolves and bears).

I still remember coming out of swindler's den that one time and seeing over 20 giants.

[Altbert]

I have taken a closer look at those spawn points. One of those spawn points is enclosed within a trigger box and a script attached to the trigger box (WETriggerScript) determines what will happen, but not when the player enters the trigger box. The trigger box contains a certain number of markers, which can be linked to actors far outside the cell with the trigger box, a creature, animal or or any other NPC which may detect the player. The script will then determine which event might take place, if any. If the player is not detected by any of those actors, nothing might happen. If the player is detected by any of those actors, anything might happen. I have seen just a single actor (a hunter or afflicted refugee) and even three hunters fighting a giant and mammoth.

Most probably all spawn points are enclosed in such a trigger box with markers that link to actors close to or far outside the trigger box. Events happening may also depend on the player being detected by hostiles or not.

However, nothing solid yet, but it seems that if you're not detected by hostiles, you will only encounter non-hostiles. Otherwise you may even be attacked by giants and mammoths, which happened to me once.

BTW, WI encounters seem to be fixed, WE encounters seem to be random.

[Ihateeverybody]

Originally posted by Altbert:

I have taken a closer look at those spawn points. One of those spawn points is enclosed within a trigger box and a script attached to the trigger box (WETriggerScript) determines what will happen, but not when the player enters the trigger box. The trigger box contains a certain number of markers, which can be linked to actors far outside the cell with the trigger box, a creature, animal or or any other NPC which may detect the player. The script will then determine which event might take place, if any. If the player is not detected by any of those actors, nothing might happen. If the player is detected by any of those actors, anything might happen. I have seen just a single actor (a hunter or afflicted refugee) and even three hunters fighting a giant and mammoth.

Most probably all spawn points are enclosed in such a trigger box with markers that link to actors close to or far outside the trigger box. Events happening may also depend on the player being detected by hostiles or not.

However, nothing solid yet, but it seems that if you're not detected by hostiles, you will only encounter non-hostiles. Otherwise you may even be attacked by giants and mammoths, which happened to me once.

BTW, WI encounters seem to be fixed, WE encounters seem to be random.

Thanks. That is a lot to digest. Honestly I am having a hard time grasping it. My mind keeps trying to skip over it.