DAR, FNIS, Nemesis?

[Vlad 254]

Which one or combination are you using?

https://strawpoll.com/okga39677

I'm running this same poll currently on reddit (and yes, I cleared this with Steam)

you do not need to reply as you simply use the link

[KNDY | No Toxicity!]

Originally posted by Alstack:

Nemesis had another Engine update today. V 3555-8002, was 8000 yesterday. That is not exactly abandoned. IMO
I am doing a little more unscientific experimenting with Nemesis today. Will update you with the results.

Isn't this localized? Seems different for everyone.
The T posing on first load is inevitable sadly. Most likely due to having conditions for animation triggers.

Anyways. Using DAR and Nemesis. (Voted in link but idk I feel like replying too)

[Alstack]

This is my unsolicited, unscientific delve into Nemesis and DAR. This is not a condemnation of FNIS. I have used FNIS for years. It is great. Before I go any further I am a Modding Hobbyist. When I mod Skyrim SE it is usually me just trying out something new. So all of you more, or less well-meaning critics who feel the urge to post “Walls” of “Alstack, you are an ingrate who is not modding the way I do” don’t. This is not a how it must be done, just my look at Nemesis and DAR.

Thanks in advance.

Here is the technical information for my laptop for Skyrim SE:
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4700MQ CPU @ 2.40GHz 2.40 GHz
Installed RAM 12.0 GB
System type 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor
Operating System: Windows 10 Home, 64-bit
DirectX version: 12.0
GPU processor: GeForce GT 740M
Core clock: 980 MHz
Total available graphics memory: 8154 MB
Dedicated video memory: 2048 MB DDR3
Shared system memory: 6106 MB

NEMESIS Engine Version 3555 - 8002
Animations Counted by NEMESIS 19,622 (NEMESIS maxes out at 20,000 animations)
Animations Listed by Vortex 71
For additional animations manipulation, I have installed FNIS Creatures and Spells.
My base build was created using Vlad’s excellent guide.

Every animation I packed in NEMESIS has worked without any issues that I have observed. The only non-seamless quality I have observed is the “Hesitation” of animations when the game first loads. From what I have read this is apparently a DAR issue.

Any mod I have downloaded that caused a NEMESIS error when running NEMESIS was easily solved with Cathedral Assets Optimizer and Creation Kit, per the instructions from Cathedral Assets Optimizer.

Once the NEMESIS engine updates itself and you run NEMESIS returning no errors. You are good to go. I would not be concerned or afraid to use NEMESIS and DAR instead of FNIS. They all seem to do the same thing returning a very good set of smooth animations.

Like any other well working Utility or Mod there may not be much of a reason to update them, IMO. Yes some mod authors are not very forth-coming or timely in responding to questions and/or possible issues, especially when the same question has been asked and answered a number of times.

So there you have it. Use whatever floats your boat. Like the old commercial said,” Mikey! Try it you’ll like it”

[Vlad 254]

Well so far there have been just over 50 responses to the poll and it's showing about what I expected. Most are using Nemesis, Dynamic Animation Replacer 2nd, with FNIS 3rd. That's considering that many are using a combination of 2 or even all 3 which means Nemesis could be and is part of the equation say for example with DAR.

All 3 are great and work as advertised and all 3 have MA's who are or seem to be off the grid so to speak. One must also consider the fact that Nemesis is Open Source which gives it an even brighter future. Again, choices are good.

[KNDY | No Toxicity!]

Originally posted by Alstack:

SNIP

I don't think anyone in this thread disputed anything you said before. LOL
Nemesis has worked well for the most of us here. I myself use it with DAR too.

The only thing is that the version update isn't an engine update by the mod author. It's just localized update depending on your current animation mod. Specially those that include a nemesis patch ticker. That will be one of which that makes the engine " update " but not by the mod-author.

For example, my version of Nemesis is at 3002 and not 8002 like yours. It changes when you add mod that includes nemesis patch.

Just want to make sure we're all on the same page.
Not telling you how you need to mod either. Just providing accurate info.

Here's ShikyoKira explaining that same thing 2 years ago :

Originally posted by ShikyoKira:

So.. in order to support new version of Ultimate Combat (just an example), Fore has to update FNIS every time a new version that has modified the behavior is out. Nemesis has nothing of that. Each user's nemesis has its own engine version (note: Engine version /= tool version). This engine version will change according to the changes in behavior extraction as well as upon detecting the presence of new behavior extraction. So if a user has installed certain mod that comes with Nemesis formatted extraction, it will prompt user to update the engine that takes less than 1 min to finish. And you are good to go. No need to wait for me to update this tool in order to support it.

Source:
https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/aw1an5/nemesis_ultimate_behavior_engine_why_should_i_use/

[Vlad 254]

Yes, that's the post I found this afternoon when I was poking around for more info. That post explains much, it all makes sense. Thanks for that KNDY.

[Alstack]

Excellent info KNDY. Learned something new today and I wasn't even trying. Thanks for the link!

[Doom Sayer]

I cant believe so many people still use FNIS. All the best animation/combat mods work on Nemesis and or use DAR. Even the adult mods been moving.

[DinoSplash]

Just use all of them.
Fnis - animal/non-humanoid animation
DAR - mostly combat animation
Nemesis - Humanoid animetion/behevier
only problem is DAR can only support 16258 animation per sex before it will be broken.
Fnis and Nemesis still work fine 50000+ animation anyways.

[Vlad 254]

Originally posted by Doom Sayer:

I cant believe so many people still use FNIS. All the best animation/combat mods work on Nemesis and or use DAR. Even the adult mods been moving.

FNIS is still a great mod and works for many people. Mods like Nemesis and DAR seem to be the future. Not necessarily those two but more will come like them and/or since Nemesis is open source it may be advanced further thus around much longer. Either way Fore, the author of FNIS, has done much for the modding scene as far as animations are concerned and it is he that led the way.

All that said there is some truth to what you say as some who use FNIS are using it with Nemesis. Then DAR is also used together with Nemesis to a higher degree than FNIS. I think it's pretty much agreed that Nemesis is the clear leader right now.

[Paragon Fury]

DAR and Nemesis.

DAR because it is needed for some cool animation mods, and Nemesis because it is better than FNIS and needed for a bunch of animation and gameplay mods.

[Doom Sayer]

Originally posted by Vlad 254:

Originally posted by Doom Sayer:

I cant believe so many people still use FNIS. All the best animation/combat mods work on Nemesis and or use DAR. Even the adult mods been moving.

FNIS is still a great mod and works for many people. Mods like Nemesis and DAR seem to be the future. Not necessarily those two but more will come like them and/or since Nemesis is open source it may be advanced further thus around much longer. Either way Fore, the author of FNIS, has done much for the modding scene as far as animations are concerned and it is he that led the way.

All that said there is some truth to what you say as some who use FNIS are using it with Nemesis. Then DAR is also used together with Nemesis to a higher degree than FNIS. I think it's pretty much agreed that Nemesis is the clear leader right now.

Ik I am not particularly intending to be insulting to mod authors. Without previous proliferation of mods i doubt we would get much better mods that do same thing. Without something there already its harder to iterate and improve on it.

[Age]

Three of them, but I admit, I've started using DAR/NEMESIS more. Those swimming and underdog animations are actually quite good compared to the vanilla. I hope there is more animations soon, that'd be fun to try.

[Vlad 254]

Originally posted by Doom Sayer:

Ik I am not particularly intending to be insulting to mod authors. Without previous proliferation of mods i doubt we would get much better mods that do same thing. Without something there already its harder to iterate and improve on it.

you weren't at all. I just added the info regarding Fore more or less as an aside as I do have high regard for him.

[Vlad 254]

Originally posted by Age:

Three of them, but I admit, I've started using DAR/NEMESIS more. Those swimming and underdog animations are actually quite good compared to the vanilla. I hope there is more animations soon, that'd be fun to try.

Agreed. Oh, and you can bet there will be more

[Alstack]

Here is a tiny tidbit and personal observation. I am building a new playable game. I choose FNIS and DAR just for s**ts and giggles.

Interestingly from my perspective the multiple character animations appear much more pressie. They seem to line up much better. With an overall clearer look.

Just an observation.