Mod that kills followers ? (SOLVED)

[Obi-Wan]

Followers get on their knees and revive after the combat is over. I don't like it, I want them to die if they get to zero health.

I tried all the famous follower mods to get rid of the protected status for followers and none of them accomplishes to do it (even though they promise to doing so in their descriptions). Tried so far

1. Extensible Follower Framework
2. Nether's Follower Framework

Does anybody know of a mod which accomplishes it bulletproof and tested ?

[Wizard]

Originally posted by obidogo:

Interesting results. But the bleedout bothers me.

I took him to fight a giant too, and he was one hit killed, no bleed out. I wasn't able to screen shot the body, cause I was running from giants.

Keep in mind this is the very beginning of the game when enemies are doing the least amount of damage. I'd imagine as the game progresses and enemies hit harder or use powerful spells, you'll see less bleedout and more instant death.

Some times folks get injured but not straight up killed. Bleedout in certain circumstances seems appropriate and realistic. I have encounted situation with my all guard party where an especially nasty orc with a warhammer kills several of my men without me being able to do anything about it. Subsequently, there's situations in Dwemer ruins, where a spinning blade trap that can't be turned off and must be avoided will kill your whole party unless you just leave them to wait there and return to get them later. Very inconvenient.

If the very possibility of bleedout happening from a nonlethal hit it just too unacceptable for you, I think you might be asking too much. But to each their own.

[Wizard]

Originally posted by obidogo:

Originally posted by Wizard:

I tested him both being killed from an arrow from a bandit, and death by a trap.

In my testing with AFT there is not even bleeding. They drop like rocks straight away....only to resurrect after 2 minutes

I think you're putting too much faith in AFT. It hasn't been updated in over 2 years. Nether's is still being developed and it the current standard of follower mods. Heck, you might even want to consider posting on his nexus page or forum to see if he has any insite on the issue.

[Wizard]

Originally posted by obidogo:

Well that explains a lot. What happens there is a so-called overkill. Even vanilla kills them for overkill damage.

That's not sound logic. There's no "overkill". When a character drops below a certain level of health they go into bleedout. NPC's do it. Enemies do it to.

If someone has 100hp and you hit them for 90hp, they go into bleedout.

If someone has 100hp and you hit them for 100hp, they die.

I'm not sure you're understanding the mechanics at work.

If a npc is "essential", no one can kill them. If a npc is "protected" only the player can kill them. Any npc or enemy can go into a bleedout state.

[Wizard]

I guess I'm confused then. Or maybe we've gotten off track. If the goal if to have followers that die, is that not what's happening?

[Wizard]

Originally posted by obidogo:

Originally posted by Wizard:

I guess I'm confused then. Or maybe we've gotten off track. If the goal if to have followers that die, is that not what's happening?

No no I think you misunderstood somewhere along the lines. How to explain..


I test Faendal against the draugr lord in the bleek cave. The draugr can never kill Faendal in one shot. What has to happen is that the Draugr does not disengage from Faendal when he reaches low health but the draugr lord has to finish him off and drop him flat dead the ground. Only then he can re-engage me. And it is done but ... like I said we have a aftereffect...Faendal resurrects like 2 minutes after.

Ok, I get where you're coming from.

My experiment with Faendal was against the 2 bandits at the beginning of the bleek cave. You are correct, when he went into bleedout, the bandit no longer targeted him. His death occured as he was coming out of bleedout, had just stood up, was retargeted by the bandit, took and arrow in the head, and died.

I can't say for sure if anything in the bleek dungeon is capable of one hitting though from full to death.

Something interesting to me though is how you say he popped back up after 2 minutes. Really that shouldn't be. I read that a named npc death is hard coded into your save, and that's why you get the letter from the courier, etc. I can try to find the post if you're interested.

That aspect makes me think that must be a feature of ATF, to simulate death for essential characters, but i'm not sure, it's been awhile since I used ATF. When your follower "dies", and before they "resurrect", are you able to search them?

[Wizard]

Here's that tidbit of info regarding death, from a thread from 2017. Might prove interesting giving the discussion. I sent you a friend request too, btw.

https://steamcommunity.com/app/489830/discussions/0/1319962329027247416/

[Wizard]

Originally posted by obidogo:

Thanks for the friends invite but I have no friends only enemies and I trust nobody

I wanted to discuss something I saw on another site that might be relevant to what we're discussing, but I'm not willing to discuss it here. But that's fine, to each his own.

[Wizard]

Well, I've contributed what I've been able. Good luck finding your solution.

[madgamer2]

after trying different things I cane to the conclusion to go solo except for particular quests. In the game I am playing now I gave up using them all together. I have found that my Lt. armor sneak style best works for me. I never did really like having some some computer run character messing up my combat so my advice jest get rid of them altogether ...works for me

[DrNewcenstein]

If you want combat-effective followers, take a look at my Improved Housecarls and Hirelings mod from the in-game mod browser.
There are also demo videos for each follower on YT under DrNewcenstein

If you want them to be non-essential, open the mod and untick the Essential boxes for all followers, then save it. Works with AFT, which works fine despite not being "updated in 2 years", a point which I find quite moot since Skyrim SE hasn't been updated in at least 3 years, but whatev.

Sneaky followers that have good sneak will have good sneak, though they do still obey vanilla sneak rules. I took Faendal through Volunruud at about level 25 and we both snuck past the entire first half without being detected, and he wasn't wearing super-jacked Sneak gear, just whatever you can buy at Warmaiden's at level 25 - Hide Boots of 12% better Sneak, IIRC, if that.
He was also wearing Elven armor, so noise.

However, there are only a few followers who fit the Stealth Assault playstyle. You're not going to get Mjoll past anyone.

I think perma-death for followers was one of those things they patched out in Oldrim, along with dragon attacks in cities, because of the crybabies, some years ago. I distinctly remember one of my earliest revisions of Improved Housecarls and Hirelings where Uthgerd died in combat because I forgot to set her Essential flag.

[cfs111]

Unable to replicate, Feandal died by Draugr Death Overlord and stayed that way. Followed your steps from post #21 Video uploading to youtube now, will post a link when it finishes.

Modlist.txt
+PrivateProfileRedirector SE - Faster game start (INI file cacher)
+ENB Helper SE
+More Informative Console
+SSE Engine Fixes (skse64 plugin)
+Alternate Start - Live Another Life
+Amazing Follower Tweaks SE
+SkyUI
*DLC: Dragonborn
*DLC: HearthFires
*DLC: Dawnguard

Loadorder.txt
Skyrim.esm
Update.esm
Dawnguard.esm
HearthFires.esm
Dragonborn.esm
SkyUI_SE.esp
AmazingFollowerTweaks.esp
Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp

[cfs111]

https://youtu.be/enob-EueByo

[cfs111]

Same result, dead Feandal. Not overkill this time, his health is -5.
https://youtu.be/rsyyS1AgFoM

[DrNewcenstein]

Originally posted by obidogo:

@DrNew Maybe I should check your mod too.

But on the crybabies...there is certain reasoning that it is not a good idea to kill followers. Although it annoys some people like me and @Wizard that the followers are like gods, it also is true that on some difficulty mods the enemies will waste the followers very easily. Even on adept.

So it becomes counter-productive to have followers in the game but make them so fragile and killable.

It is the ages old dispute of difficulty and realism of Skyrim.

Hence my mod gives them a fighting chance by giving them skills, and many of them are leveled above the player, since you start the game as a 30-something nobody with base-15 in all Skills, and most of these followers, such as Hirelings and Housecarls, have been doing this sort of thing for quite some time (except for Erik, obviously), or otherwise have had some specialized training from a young age (Illia).
Essentiality is just an extra bonus which any user is free to edit.

However, not all followers are going to be suited for all situations, so you'll have to pick the best one for the job. Unless you get a Housecarl, in which case you get a walking death machine. With AFT's 5-follower limit, you can build a Housecarl Death Squad with Lydia, Iona, Jordis, Rayya, and Argis.

Or you can build a more traditional RP'ing party with a Pure Mage who has no melee, an Archer who has limited melee, and a melee who does little or no archery.

[DrNewcenstein]

Ok, so I just tried this issue, and both Faendal and Cosnach were dead. I was able to loot them both.

Either you have another mod that is interfering with them remaining dead, or your AFT settings are causing them to recover. Under Tweak Options/Settings, make sure you don't have the option enabled to recover during combat in the All Followers section.