Team Suddenly Not Performing

[TWO WORLD WARS ONE WORLD CUP ヅ]

Hi,
I'm not here for the "you should manage them better comments" I am actually really confused.

Basically I have been managing Southend for 3/4 seasons now. First season I got sacked as Wigan manager, taken over Southend. Avoided relegation, pushed for playoffs in the last 2 seasons now.

Now, in my fourth season I have some money and good players. I have signed, i would say, low championship level-top league one players. Players who have played for championship teams, been promoted from league one, team of the year, most assists, most goals scored.

These players aren't performing? I sit 23rd in league one after 15 games with 3 wins?
Last season my team were winning the games i expect to win and losing against the top 6.
I bought players to build on this and none of my players are performing now.

I had the leagues top and another top scorer. Team of the year players and most assists. Added with the other players I have bought. No tactics have changed.
I normally play 4-4-2, 4-4-1-1, 4-2-3-1 or 4-1-4-1. But, nothing is the same.

It is like the defenders have forgot how to defend. My team can attack and attack, next minute the ball is hoofed forward and the opposition has scored. Own goals happen regualary? Sloppy passes etc etc

I wasn't hoping to take this game by storm and I have played since FM15 but I don't know whats going on?

Me being a bad manager?
Freak run of bad form???

[Bradley Cooper | Erosdaiou]

i would say something perhaps stupid but possible how about the way player are constants in their matches when you send your scout they sometimes tell you this player may lack of consistency which result of him not player at his best every games this little thing might not be visible in the lower league but when you reach a top rank one with player you still had for few years it might be a reason and this is one of the hidden stats you can't be aware of how good they will be a good example for this is the player kuki from malaga who is called a wonderkid from a lot of player but i remember my scout telling me he willl not perform good cause of that thing and it was the only scoring like 8 time in 40 match for a striker of his caliber but maybe i m wrong i mean it s fm it could be anything

[TWO WORLD WARS ONE WORLD CUP ヅ]

All the articles in the world, will not prove Football Manager is scripted or not. They will never admit it.

Personally, I dont think it is and you have to find out as a good manager why they are playing so bad.

I found out one season they were playing bad becaause of training, I sacked my fitness coach and hired a new one. They played better!
They didnt like a player playing behind the striker, i started with two up front or a CDM, they played good!

Im constantly learning about the game as this is the first one I have taken seriously. The only issue i have encountered is the team not performing.

But, I can't get my head round how suddenly my keeper is palming it into his goal, my defenders are passing it back and my strikers are shooting from my own half!!

Before I posted this i 22nd in League one with Southend. They sacked me, now I am first in league with Walsall and have maintained it for over half a season. It's a really funny game

[razorG]

Did you say you have only had this dip in form since you brought new players in? Could that not be the problem?? How many new players have you brought in? Could it be that they need time to settle in and you have upset the rhythmn of the team?

I feel your pain though. The amount of times I have raged in the past with this game!

[Kegbelly]

Originally posted by razorG:

Did you say you have only had this dip in form since you brought new players in? Could that not be the problem?? How many new players have you brought in? Could it be that they need time to settle in and you have upset the rhythmn of the team?

I feel your pain though. The amount of times I have raged in the past with this game!

this happened to me . my team on one save qualified for the euro cup and i kinda went over the top trying sign players to compete and ended up nearly relegated =/ . it kinda makes sense but totally sucks for the fun factor and a totally unecessary modifier for solo play . i understand it for online games but for someone like me who plays exclusivley single player it sucks the fun right out the game

[fourfourtwo79]

What does bad management have got to do with multiplayer though? Squad gelling is a slightly factor for all teams in each save. It's one of the reasons why the human player staying at the club in case of success has it progressively easier, as he eventually has a fully gelled squad that fully respects him (various players listing him as their favorite personell too), whilst AI managers are sacked regularly or change clubs when an offer comes around, as tends to happen in real football. The point of the game is to simulate football management, not Fifa. If that sucks that "fun" out of it go Touch. Personally I found older iterations worse, as you could apply as an unknown at Camp Nou, put Messi into the reserves, let Iniesta go on a frewbie to Madrid and replace the entire setup with nothing in the game reacting, but that is preference. Additionally sloppy passes can be an ungelled team. Attack attack attack only for the opposition having it easy to hoof forward and score sounds like an unprotected backline. You can't have the ball all the time.

A final word of warning: Only bad players who know zero how this game works go the "game is rigged" route so that they can rationale their lack of consistency. There hasn't been one decent player who has a reasonable grasp of this that goes that route when giving advice. Upon uploading their saves/matches, the conspiracists are exposed by the latter bad. I sympathize as the feedback and manual is lacking to bad. I stop if somebody persists, as it a) makes it hard for others to learn and b) distracts from the the bugs. In spite of all, almost everything described here sounds like football... including missed chances (Arsenal missed 70% of their Opta big chances), the away tables (match day 31 of Bundesliga, 2 teams have won 6+ away matches) and the runs, which in football are influenced by fixture lists and luck already. Only that managers are a) schooled and b) can't blame virtually *all* on a game. Some of it might be the game, there are bugs. For some, everything is a bug, at least when it doesn't go their way (every exploit tactic that ever allowed bad teams to achieve *hinges* on bugs). If looking for help, links were provided. Will help guaranteed, even moreso if you would open a thread and outline your issues.

[Kegbelly]

fourfourtwo . if you dont get my solo game does not affect anyone else exept me im not going try explain how realism interferes with fun . online its differant because your actions have a direct effect on other participating players in the game

but does anyone honestly give a damn if on my solo game i sighned to many players and caused a gelling modifier to go mad , unlikely

what it did do however is make me hate the game for a season and make me want to quit . now i know my 39 bucks is small in the big picture but if enough people who are just trying to have fun without pvp get roasted that falling income for SI

i totally understand why the modifier is there to maintain pvp balance but it makes absolutley no sense if im just trying to have fun in single player


and any comment on how this games realistic is is in your imagination , there noway ever that a sports PC game can ever properly simulate real life football

maybe in 100 years time and people in time are having fun in star trek like holo suites =p

[fourfourtwo79]

Originally posted by TheExile:

i totally understand why the modifier is there to maintain pvp balance but it makes absolutley no sense if im just trying to have fun in single player

This has nothing to do with pvp. This has to do with the game trying to simulate football management. New players take time to gell, it always has and does for every single team, AI too. Same as your previous tactics complaints, which were answered and ignored. This has naught to do with you getting adapted to either. That doesn't happen, it's similar bad myth spread by everybody who has no idea. Has to do with the game trying to simulate management. Therefore, different teams approach opposition differently, as that happens in football. You don't see Burnley all out attacking Chelsea away, whilst Bayern likely won't park the bus at home to Darmstadt. That's not PVP, that's football. AI teams line up differently even in Fifa/PES. They have different formations, drop deep or press. They also have different players with different strengths. If that wouldn't happen here, 1/10, fail.

It's not rocket science once sussed, as at the bottom line this is a game rather than management. However, at such rates you won't crack it, and end up with the guys spreading the bad myth.All one can try is show you the door. You have to walk through yourself. If that's not enjoyable, there's simpler management games, though FM may be the most casual game I've ever had depending on which. Technically you can let the assistant do everything, plus the next download is but a click away. Once you're through that entry barrier of bad myth, info dumps whilst still lacking crucial feedback, occasionally opaque game UI and little official documentation, you may wish for much improved AI opponents and more (tactical) options in no time, particular long-term. That is, if you at all belong to the target audience of this. Fun is an entirelly subjective affair.

[Bradley Cooper | Erosdaiou]

an advize i would certainly give who must have been said already in the previous long comments is during the pre season instead of working on strategy or attack or mostly if you have more than 3 new players in the team focus on cohension this way your team will focus on learning to know each other better and also play better together after remember fm love to bounce you from behind so don't be affradi to have some little moment of bad results

[The Tripods]

This is actually the first FM where I haven't easily managed to get Wrexham in the Prem within 10 seasons. It's insanely difficult now, which it would be in any sane reality

[#LEDGE]

team changes everytime a new update comes out!

[Kegbelly]

fourfourtwo . im not ignoring anyone . ive tried and tested every suggestion made to me over the last few weeks since i came over from FM 2014 , I get that alot of comments are just pure frustration from some people who want alll the cake without challange,
i get that alot of downloaded tactics are exploitative and cant be used long term because of injuries and suspensions they cause and i get it its more fun to invent your own

but what i dont think you get is the target audiance is alot wider than the sim fan and its hurting the game that its trying to be too relistic just look at the games reveiws if you dont beleave me . and no its not all just upset chinese

And before you critize me to much the most fun i get outta this game is getting a good youth pull on a LLM and developing it till i get a big transfer offer . im not whineing cause i dont win titles and trophies

[Kegbelly]

Originally posted by #LEDGE:

team changes everytime a new update comes out!

some people dont like to much real life interferance in there game i never update to new transfers =p

allthough i appreciate how its fun for alot of people

[fourfourtwo79]

Originally posted by TheExile:

but what i dont think you get is the target audiance is alot wider than the sim fan and its hurting the game that its trying to be too relistic just look at the games reveiws if you dont beleave me . and no its not all just upset chinese

Yeah it is. The game's advertised to football fans in general media, therefore it is a wide player base. From my experience a huge amount of frustrated players are still actually massively successful. How they do that is another matter. What they can't take is not winning everything. In parts this is a game vs sim dichotomy. In your typical video game, if you push x, then y will happen. If you have mastered the mechanics, you would never lose a fight / battle in Dark Souls. FM ain't like that. You can lose matches due to bad luck. You can do no wrong and still drop the points. Etc. What then happens is the classic case of cognitive dissonance.

1) I'm good enough to be successful at this, maybe I'm not the best ever, but the results clearly show I'm at least decent. 2) Therefore it follows whenever things go wrong the game is rigged against me in some way. It may get worse when there is hundreds of hours plugged in over the years and somebody suggesting dude, this is none how this works. Then you may follow that believe even more strongly, because the possibility that you wouldn't have learned much about this wholesale at so many hours "wasted" may become too painful to admit. That's not stupidity, it's a common psychological phenomenon. Even the experts who know this inside out are rarely experts in tactics, man management, training, media management and squad building alike.

tbh I've never seen you posting anythingbut "moans". Here's the previous tactic thread where somebody who explained how this works was ignored, you posted something detached from the topic, unless you suggested the game become impossible to lose in (dear lord, please no)
http://steamcommunity.com/app/482730/discussions/0/135512625248818831/ You were even approached by one of the devs. There is no enquiring. For instance, losing to the bottom table regularly, in particular with the amount of goals, that needs a fully-on leaky defensive setup. In FM fixing it that's basically two clicks of a mouse, so much for "realism". One-off anything goes. But not repeatably. I'm not buying that you've ever really tried thus. Least not in the right places, wink wink nudge nudge. It's your frustration and your choice though, shrug.

[Kegbelly]

you say i moan alot but all ive seen you do is WHITE KNIGHT the developer ,any critisism written is all ways slammed as allways the users fault and never the game . this game is not perfect and not even remotley close to the real managment of a football club its all in your imagination

and no im not going to stop criticising where i think its appropiate because of one WHITE KNIGHT

you seriouly sound like an autocrat unable to accept opposition

[TWO WORLD WARS ONE WORLD CUP ヅ]

Update: The team i had the poor form with (Southend) sacked me, I took over Walsall. Finished 7th that season with them from fighting relegation.

Next season I won the league by 8 points but it gets better!

SOUTHEND FINISHED SECOND

THE TEAM I BUILT, FINISHED SECOND! WHAT THE F!CK