Mae's "Mental Illness" (SPOILERS)

[Analog]

I remember once asking my Psych professor why Psych, specifically, wasn't taught much earlier than college level. It seemed, to me, something fairly important that should be discussed much earlier. She had a biased opinion, of course, but all she could do was shrug her shoulders.

Funny anecdote, I was one of very few dudes in Psych classes. Garner what you will from that.

Anyway, the amount of threads talking about Mae and her “mental illness” are both troubling and encouraging.
Players want to chalk the whole thing up to DiD or whatever they they might have gleaned from perusing the DSM in their spare time.

Here's the deal, IMHO: This is a vidya world. IRL rules don't apply.

The Black Goat honed in on Mae. For unexplained reasons.
“I lost it.” right? A convenient narrative trick, that thankfully doesn't take away from the story.

The Black Goat was influencing her perception. She isn't suffering from mental illness. Because, in her world, Lovecraftian space goats can reach through a tear in the cosmos and try and suck you in.

Vidya geams!

This isn't DiD (because that's a real thing) this isn't Bi-Polar (because that's a real thing – and Gregg likely has it... and rulz) this isn't blah blah blah you stopped reading...

Nevertheless, the fact that you're curious? Maybe pick up a Psych book before you're 19; couldn't hurt. Pay particular attention to the onset of schizophrenia. It might stop a school shooting or two.

[TemmieNeko]

she doesnt have an illness.
the kickstarter page says she has paranormal abilities.
stop trying to make her out liek some damaged tumblrite

[Analog]

Originally posted by TemmieNeko:

she doesnt have an illness.
the kickstarter page says she has paranormal abilities.
stop trying to make her out liek some damaged tumblrite

So agressive! You know my post agrees with you, right?
Well, except for calling the mentally ill damaged tumblrites, but still...

[RENDERMODE_NONE]

I don't think I understand the point you'e trying to make. Why does being a work of fiction rule out the possibility of Mae suffering from emotional and mental problems? I don't think many people are trying to attribute the events of the game exclusively to mental illness, and there are a couple of explanations besides mental illness or outright paranormal activity hinted at in the game. I'm not going to try to be an armchair psychologist, but I've studied psychology (not to a professional level by any means) and can think of no reason that many of Mae's issues can't be attributed to mental and emotional problems. The whole "shapes" thing resembles symptoms of depersonalization-derealization syndrome as far as I can tell.

I don't think most people are interested in the idea of Mae being mentally ill in the weird glorification sort of way some tumblrites do, rather seeing it as a really interesting case study of a character who's already interesting in her own right.

[Analog]

Originally posted by Truck "Spike Boy" Gloshi:

I don't think I understand the point you'e trying to make.

Okay, I'll spell it out for you. This is a narrative fiction. It's entirely made up. Everybody aside from the main toon was playing the part of the "Maybe you're just mentally ill" compatriot. However, at the same time, we are traveling with Mae. Our allegiance, as readers, is concrete. How dare you question it!?!? WHY DO YOU HATE MAE!?!?

If you don't see the "red flags", I don't know what to tell you.

Its like the cop always dying. Its that cliche.

But Serisously, trying to work legitimate IRL mental illness into a story like this is the same as the folks who ponder why there's real-world cats in a world with anthro cats. Also, it's disrepectful to folks who actually suffer from these real-world mental illnesses. However, i doubt the internet cares about that.

Anyway. Either you're new, or just like to argue. End of story.

That's not a bad thing, necessarily. I like to argue, too.

And given the spoiler tag, I was talking about post game.
During the game thinking "****, is she ******* carzy?' is part of the fun.

[RENDERMODE_NONE]

I still don't follow. Your argument seems to be that since we're viewing the work through the eyes of Mae, her reality is the only reality. If someone has done worldbuilding for the whole setting and somewhere has written down exactly what is actually happening, does that invalidate the whole argument? What about the segment where you play as Gregg or Bea? If a sequel is released focused on a different character with a different perspective on the events in NITW, what does that mean? Do we just say that the developers are wrong about their own worldbuilding and that these different games depict different realities?
Unless I'm misunderstanding you, you're predicating your whole argument on the basis that this game is a work of fiction. It seems disingenuous to base your argument on what I'm understanding as "it's fiction, therefore taking it at anything but face value is stupid."

[Analog]

Originally posted by Truck "Spike Boy" Gloshi:

I still don't follow. What about the segment where you play as Gregg or Bea?

Okay. I'll try harder, cause you seem like a nice guy.
At what point, specifically, does Mae's narritive contradict any of the other main toons'?
The only time they don't belive or question her is when they aren't personally there.
Even Gregg (who rulz) is questioned by his boyfriend. Angus question himself. Everybody wants to find the most logical reason for whats happening. That's the ******* story!

In the end, what happens? They're staring at the Murderdads that killed Casey. The Murderdads vidicate Mae's perspective ("I know you've heard him, girl") in front of the other three.

AT WHAT POINT DO YOU SAY "I THINK SHE MIGHT BE BI-POLAR" ?!?!

IT DOESN'T FACTOR IN!

[thisisaudo]

I mean, even putting aside the stuff towards the end of the game and the dream sequences and stuff, it's like... pretty obvious Mae suffers from mental health issues. That's like a core theme in the game, and she isn't the only one? She's clearly dealing with depression and anxiety. Gregg likely has bipolar disorder, and so on.

I do think it's iffy for everyone to try and explain away every single thing and action as mental health issues, but it's also bad to sweep the entire thing under the rug the opposite way, too. Mental Health issues is a clear theme in the game.

"uh yeah i mean all of us in the core team have been open about our mental health issues in the past and it's a massive theme throughout the game."-NITW's lead writer

It's something they intentionaly worked into the story. It being "fiction" is just, whatever. Now whether mental health stuff explains the ending or how much is "actually happening" in re: the God or not (there's also the issue of gasses in the mine that cause hallucinations as mentioned in the newspaper clippings) is left purposefully ambiguous.

[Analog]

Originally posted by thisisaudo:

purposefully ambiguous.

There ya go. But... putting aside the stuff towards the end of the game? Why?
What, specifically, are the mental-health issues she obviously suffers from that aren't caused by The Black Goat?

Just being depressed and being clinically depressed are two seperate things... or so I've heard. I'd love for folks who know more about that to chime in, because I think there's a dearth of knowledge.

[thisisaudo]

Originally posted by Goat:

Originally posted by thisisaudo:

purposefully ambiguous.

There ya go. But... putting aside the stuff towards the end of the game? Why?
What, specifically, are the mental-health issues she obviously suffurs from that aren't caused by The Black Goat?

But just being depressed and being clinically depressed are two seperate things... or so I've heard. I'd love for folks who know more about that to chime in, because I think there's a dearth of knowledge.

I honestly don't believe we're led to think that the Black Goat is the cause of Mae's mental health issues before the game begins. Maybe in the hands of devs who don't have mental health issues and are just using it as a narrative tool, but this game was all made by people who are very familiar with mental health issues, and I don't see them really doing that.

So, to that end, I think it's pretty clear that Mae suffers from depression and anxiety. Possibly derealization. And then the goat's interfence, if you believe in its influence and existence, made these things even worse, starting with the dreams and stuff. But, no, I don't think the Goat had anything to do with Mae's issues during college, for example.

And, you know, the implication in the game's epilogue is that Mae still deals with these mental health issues past the ending.

Basically, I don't think it's "either or". It's a mixture. Mae already had these issues, but the Goat made them worse. They tie into each other, but one isn't the sole cause of the other.

And, again, mental health issues is a big overall theme for the entire game, and it isn't just Mae who suffers from them.

[RENDERMODE_NONE]

Originally posted by Goat:

There ya go. But... putting aside the stuff towards the end of the game? Why?
What, specifically, are the mental-health issues she obviously suffers from that aren't caused by The Black Goat?

Just being depressed and being clinically depressed are two seperate things... or so I've heard. I'd love for folks who know more about that to chime in, because I think there's a dearth of knowledge.

Magic and mental illnesses aren't the only explanation for the Black Goat if you do some digging in the game.

To my understanding depression can refer to grief or sadness in the traditional sense, while the term clinical depression is just to specify depression in the sense of a mental illness.

I suspect we're agreeing on most of the facts but aren't really arguing about the same thing.

[Analog]

Originally posted by thisisaudo:

I honestly don't believe we're led to think that the Black Goat is the cause of Mae's mental health issues before the game begins.

I love your take on it, I do, but I disagree.
We aren't led to believe about the Goat's influence because that realization is the peak of the story. It would suck if you know who killed so-and-so from the beginning because... well, surely I don't have to explain that.

If the devs have said they are sensitive to mental health issues, then fine, but it's niether here nor there.

But yes, It's my opinion that that The Black Goat was the cause of Mae's issues from the start (on the baseball field "back in the day") when she smashed homeboy's face in. I also belive that he/she/it was the cause of her issues at college and also when (and why) she came back home. She had the "glimmer". "It" took a shine to her.

Originally posted by Truck "Spike Boy" Gloshi:

I suspect we're agreeing on most of the facts but aren't really arguing about the same thing.

Seems possible. People clearly don't like me. I'm a trash mammal.

[thisisaudo]

Originally posted by Goat:

We aren't led to believe about the Goat's influence because that realization is the peak of the story.

I meant nothing in the Goat realization made me think otherwise.

If the devs have said they are sensitive to mental health issues

I mean they didn't just say they are sensitive to it, they all HAVE mental health issues themselves, and thus would be very careful of sending a message of, like, "the only reason mental health issues exist is because of interference by malevolent gods" lol.

But, you know, the purpose is to be ambiguous and people will have different interpretations I guess. I just really can't agree with the reading that the Goat was the sole cause of Mae's issues, especially after she completely left town for over a year. But, i think this is the end of the discussion for me. I can't see this going anywhere but an endless back and forth lol.

[Analog]

Originally posted by thisisaudo:

I mean they didn't just say they are sensitive to it, they all HAVE mental health issues themselves, and thus would be very careful of sending a message of, like, "the only reason mental health issues exist is because of interference by malevolent gods" lol.

UGH! You and I need to have drinks and pizza.
Seriously dude....
I love the fact that you think that, but I don't think my fingers are strong enough to type all the things I want to say to that.

Originally posted by thisisaudo:

But, you know, the purpose is to be ambiguous and people will have different interpretations I guess.

i agree wholeheartedly.

Originally posted by thisisaudo:

I just really can't agree with the reading that the Goat was the sole cause of Mae's issues, especially after she completely left town for over a year. But, i think this is the end of the discussion for me. I can't see this going anywhere but an endless back and forth lol.

She left town to go to college... endless back and forth? IS THAT ALL I AM TO YOU IS AN ENDLESS BACK AND FORTH

j/k, bye.

[wolfknight]

Ok look she was depressed about loseing her grandfather wich must have amplyfiled her paranormal abilities causing her to "lose it". From what paranormal research has shown over the year (whether its real or not) that depressed or very ill people seem to have a stronger connection with the paranormal.

[Benji, limited edition shitlord]

Basically 'YOURE WRONG IM RIGHT, DEAL WITH IT' here.
Whole in-game world is seen through Mae's eyes, and she has quite a few issues - she has anger issues, anxiety issues (collage story, mirror scene), suicidal thoughts ('Ill burn this room down, with me in it'), keeps doing risky stuff (jumping around on power lines, stealing for the sake of it), not to mention the whole 'shapes' things. Seeing people and objects as shapes surely isnt something healthy person does. And she clearly said she wasnt angry at the person she beat up, but just angry in general.
The reason she dropped out of collage and 'went back home' is she was anxious of new surrounding, place she didnt feel safe in. She comes back home, probably still suffering from the whole collage thing, and it turns out 'home' changed too. Her friends got jobs and have no more time to hang out with her, Bea rejects her, Casey's missing, kids refer to her as 'lady', teenagers as 'adult' - even more stress. Perhaps to a point she starts seeing things?
Im no psychiatrist, but I dont see a reason not to consider the whole thing was actually mostly happening in her head.
Besides, whats wrong with considering whats going on in game as a result of mental illness? Its not really romanticized (unlike on tumblr), and almost gets Mae killed quite a few times. Its no 'depression quest', its not shoving the one true interpretation down your throat. And considering Mae being sick could actually show bad stuff can happen to you or people you know and perhaps make you think about people that are sick in a different way.