Trying to decide Second mastery for Ice shard

[Wolfchild]

I have narrowed it down to rune (for ease of equiping non staff cold damage boosts, potential dual wielding stat sticks, menhirs and energy armour) or dream for mana regen, total speed, DA, and resist reduction from nightmare, can people who have tried these options chime in?

[Myrador]

I'm not sure that Runes fit perfectly for what you try to do. As far as i can see there is no ice damage bonus on anything Runes have.

The only things i see use for on a Ice Shard mage is:
Rune of Life (1/10)
Menhir Wall (?/10)
Energy Armor

I'd rather take Nature for: Heart of Oak, Briar Ward, Earthbind, Refresh
and Plague (which lowers the enemy resistance against elemantal(including cold) extremely

Another good option IMO is Earth for: Heat Shield, Stone Form, Ring of Flame

Dream is always nice for: Temporal Flux, Trance of Convalescence, Distort Reality for Stun

Spirit is good to slow melee attackers and basically make them totally useless

TLDR: Good Options IMO are Spirit, Earth, Dream and Nature. If you want mostly survivability and damage support from the 2nd Mastery i would take Nature which has the best debuff in the game.

[Wolfchild]

I already know nature is great but i really don't want to take the time to cast plague, and rune was primarily in contention because it could allow me to use strength gear (like persephone's caress) with cold bonuses using less strength. Did not consider that angle for spirit though i had mostly considered it for the blood sacrifice thing before. Is ring of flame actually useful to Ice?

[darth.crevette]

I think Rune can work very well with an Ice Shard build.
As you said already, Runeword: Feather will help wielding something like Persephone's Caress, which you can even dual-wield, and you could throw in a few hits with Rune Weapon between casts for the huge increase to Int and elemental damage.
About Plague, Squall+Obscured Visibility should give you enough resistance reduction anyway.

[sarcastic_godot]

Rune should be fine for you, especially if you're going for dual throw. Be informed, though, that Rune dual wield only works for dual thrown - no mixed hybrid there.

Also, Energy Armor is really strong - if you can afford the 3.4k energy points to cast it it's almost 7k extra HP which also work against pierce damage! Energy cost reduction helps a lot there, but ofc there's +%Energy jewelry.

I just hardcored my Thunderer - though I went for lightning focus. I went for more STR to get the Mjölnir set to work, and dual Wisps are nice, too. Even unbuffed they live long, and are nice to keep stuff in your rear busy. Also nice stuns.


Dream has the advantage that the Storm buffs also buff Dream electroburn. Also, the Rank 40 Psionic Beam staff attack is really strong thanks to it's high attack speed. That isn't listed on the skill sheet, and doesn't show on the char sheet, but it still is the fastest attack.

Though I didn't try it out, Dream's Nightmare plus two Wisps (if you care to invest into STR for the Mjölnir set armor) also should rock, even without buff rings...

And ofc, Dream brings Trance of Wrath, which gives extra ResReduction in melee range, does damage, and has Skill Disruption - thereby preventing all melee attackers' special moves.

[slayor3000]

Playing 4 different Rune based toons, 2 in Epic at he moment. Play them "Berserker" style and with Rune Weapon, ThunderStrike and Reckless Offence (even my Dragon Hunter).
Great fun, clear areas really quick.

Not played with Storm yet, but if you do use traps (I am useless with traps) then push points into the wisp as well. "Eye Of The Storm" will give them 100% extra elemental damage.

[Wolfchild]

@ Slayer & Goat, thank you for your advice, but I was considering rune specifically in the case of it supporting the use of Ice Shards.

[chris.ferrantegerard]

Originally posted by Wolfchild:

I have narrowed it down to rune (for ease of equiping non staff cold damage boosts, potential dual wielding stat sticks, menhirs and energy armour) or dream for mana regen, total speed, DA, and resist reduction from nightmare, can people who have tried these options chime in?

Haven't run a Ice Sharder with either of the combos above, through I've done one with Druid and Paladin.

You should be able to make one with Rune but you should have 2x Persephone's Caress to dual wield if you're planning on going that route. Would be a bit of a glass cannon I guess. Energy Armour can provide extra padding but has a massive energy cost as it levels so you'd need lots of energy reduction to make good use of it. Menhirs' Wall provides useful CC but probably not as good as Nature's Briar Ward.

Not sure about Dream for Ice Sharder. I'd probably go a different route for that combo.

[slayor3000]

Thats what I thought.

Pure Ice Sharder is a very difficult build, especially since no other masteries have damage that will help a lot and it does get quite gear dependant.
Cannot see a lot in Rune to support that build.

Do not know if you have seen this build - Paladin Ice Sharder - (chris.ferrantegerard (used xmax))
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2308956152

From looking at the few things you would like to help your build, consider Hunter and forget all about Marksmanship and the Spear tree's.
Wood Lore 222 DA maxed (not incl +skills or all the DA from the dex it provides), Herbal Remedy +6 HP regen and 72 poison resist (not incl +skills),
Art of the Hunt extra damage against beasts, 100% less entrapment time, faster movement speed, 25% avoid projectiles.
Flush Out -36% damage and elemental resistances.

Trouble with the build is the amount of energy needed to spam Ice Shards, as you already mentioned Dream helps with that a bit and later in Epic can find Epic/ Legendary jewellery that adds +10 or +15 to energy regen.

Did try a similar build once but stopped as I felt I had become addicted to energy potions. lol.

[sarcastic_godot]

Originally posted by Wolfchild:

@ Slayer & Goat, thank you for your advice, but I was considering rune specifically in the case of it supporting the use of Ice Shards.

...TQ is won on the defense, glass cannons tend to die annoyingly often in this game. Also, one trick ponies tend to have a real issue when they hit mobs that are resistant to that trick (i.e. Cold in your case). Ask anyone who ever played a Brigand through undead-infested areas...

So a great defensive skill like Energy Armor does help you a lot. Or Trance of Wrath. And that is the stuff that will help you get through the Legendary difficulty, so I wouldn't brush that advice off.

Basically, there's only Rune that buffs Elements overall, none of the other Masteries does. And the other thing about the synergies is: Take them when you can. Like the cross-buffing of the pets. Like the buffs your Storm Nimbus gives you for the Trance of Wrath.

Do what you choose, but IMHXp, ignoring the defense leads to frustration galore in the late game.


And if you're adamantly into buffing your Ice Sharding, you should reconsider with Spirit in the mix:

Dark Covenant and Circle of Power skills are real boosts to spellcasting power, even buffing your Elemental damage. Deathchill Aura is an as good defensive aura thing as Trance of Wrath, which will slow the melee types passively. Also if you have Atlantis, it gives you the Life Steal tree, with Soul Drain, the IMHO best ranged AoE nuke, included in the healing package. Vision of Death (mostly underestimated) is helpful against lumps of ranged attackers, and Death Ward never hurts...

[Wolfchild]

I am not opposed to a secondary ability (planing on also using lightning bolt) but slayer at least and I think goat were saying to use rune as an attacker character

[sarcastic_godot]

It is - but one with defensive strengths. namely Energy Armor and Rune of Life.

Still, as a global advice for choosing mastery combinations, the good choices should either synergize well on the offense and/or plug gaps on the defense. Always keep in mind that 0 HP => 0 DPS...

In Legendary, you'll have to compensate for a -100 penalty on all resistances, and while you can do that by scrounging it all up from gear buffs, that'll mean painful choices between resistances and attack power gear. The more resists you need, the more choices you'll face. that's where the good builds (bringing some relevant resists to the table) split from the bad.

And for Rune that's +45% Bleed and +60% Vitality Resistance, plus a factual 100% resistance vs. physical, bleed and pierce damage as long as your 7k HP Energy Armor holds. Oh, and you also get 50% Stun Res... Toss in the 85% "resistance" vs. Cold and Lightning from your Energy Shield, and you're pretty far ahead compared to other builds.

As written above, the Thunderer works well enough to get through the whole game without a single death (well, gear plays quite a part in that, too). Just I didn't go for Ice Shard, but lightning damage base attack / Thunder Strike build. Still, I can recommend it as a safe bet. It should work nicely with Ice Shard, too. Also, in case it doesn't work out, you can still respec all the skill picks, but not your class choices.

And I've already elaborated on Spirit above.

Dream is nice, too, because it's designed that way. You have the Trance of Wrath, which neuters most melee baddies strengths, lowers their resists, and damages them, too - all with one switch-on-and-forget aura. The buffs to speed, OA, and DA given by the Lucid Dream children are a good deal, too. And you get Distort Reality for some nice stuns, and a pinch of - Storm-buffed - Electroburn damage. Distortion Wave is a nice RMB skill to slow the baddies even more, and, again, do Electroburn damage that your Storm Nimbus amplifies.

I'd probably base my choice on the range I want to fight: Rune is more useful at mid to close range, while Dream gives you more advantages in melee range... ...unless you choose to wield a Staff, where Dream's Death Ray Psionic Beam pwns at long range.


TL;DR: Both Rune and Dream are good for you, Spirit is a worthy third contender.


(btw I'm prbly "goat"... ...might come from your childhood with the wolves, plus seeing everything as food )

[Wolfchild]

Sorry about the misreading of your name :P but thanks for that advice, i think I am gonna go rune after that, even without a caress, i do like energy armour (1st character was a melee thunderer)

[slayor3000]

Glad you chose one.
Tried a Dream/Storm at Level 40 Ragnarok for an hour last night. Will not go into a full write up on what I saw.

But,Hopefully a decent bit of advice which may stop you getting a little frustrated sometimes. Energy Leech resistance, make sure you do not ignore that resistance.
There might not be a lot of creatures that use it but when they do you will be left defenceless with your type of build.
I actually use energy leech a lot for dealing damage and when its used against me, a toon build that relies on vast amounts of energy for damage and defence it can be really annoying.

In Ragnarok you should find a shield Rings of Rhine and a throw weapon The Crow not the greatest of defence shields or throw weapon but for builds like this I have used because of there affixes.

Rings of the Rhine
24% Chance to block 266 damage
106 Physical Damage

-15% Recharge
+50% Shield Block Chance
40% Cold Resistance
+300 Defensive Ability
-15% Reduction to all Requirements
+15% Increased Experience

The Crow
103 ~ 110 Physical Damage
20% Pierce Ratio
Speed: Fast

20.0% Chance of +100% Pierce Damage
45 ~ 55 Piercing Damage
20.0% Chance of 40% Reduction to Enemy's Health
240 ~ 360 Energy Leech over 3.0 Seconds
+25% Attack Speed
+50% Defensive Ability
10% Chance to Dodge Attacks
+1 to all skills in Hunting Mastery

i.e even if you character only has 400 DA, those 2 together would bump it up to 1050, plus all the other affixes.

[sarcastic_godot]

On reading Slay0r3000's post, I just remembered this tidbit I forgot in my praise of Rune mastery: Runeword Absorb gives you quite the chunk of Energy Leech Retaliation, and Absorb Spell Energy, which keeps your blue ball nicely topped off. Unless you happen to get swarmed by no-mana trash, that is.