What does vassalizing a faction actually do?

[Buddy Holly]

I am in the late game of a Stainless Steel campaign as Portugal and have recently vassalized England. What does this actually do? It says the whole thing with giving up independence or whatever, but does that mean that they have to do whatever I say? Can I tell them to attack any other faction? Do I get their taxes? Can they still backstab me? Do they still get a king?

[Inardesco]

Gaining a vassal essentially says; I will protect this vassal more fervently than I protect my military allies.

A vassal state is essentially an extension of your own empire though keeping it's own flag.

Now, there are various different states of vasselage. In Medieval 2, a Vassal simply becomes your military ally with military access and trade routes. The vassal in question also gives up a portion of it's income to the protector nation.

The vassal can still backstab you in Medieval 2 and there's no benefit due to not gaining any control over their armies or cities. Best to just whipe 'm out instead,

However, in Rome 2, there are vassals/cient-states and satrapies. The difference between vassals and satrapies, in Rome 2, is primarily that a vassal state has it's own diplomacy whereas all diplomacy for a satrapy, is done by the protector nation. The main examples in Rome 2 are the Seluecid Empire, which has satrapies, and Carthage, which has vassals.

[Buddy Holly]

I see. It feels as if they should have made it more like puppeting nations from games like HOI4. Thank you for your response!

[Inardesco]

You do realise that Hearts of Iron 4 has been released this year and that Medieval 2 is a game from 2006 and that they can hardly copy a game that's been released 10 years later?

[comedy]

Calm

[EoNightcore]

I wish they could have done something similar to Hyrule Total War's (a M2TW Kingdoms mod) minor faction mechanic, in which the player could ally a minor faction, hold that alliance for several turns, and then recieve the option to annex that faction and gain their units and the ability to build those units.

Of course, that idea probably didn't come to them at the time, and it would likely be alot of work having to create so many skins and debug alot more coding.

[Buddy Holly]

Originally posted by Inardesco:

You do realise that Hearts of Iron 4 has been released this year and that Medieval 2 is a game from 2006 and that they can hardly copy a game that's been released 10 years later?

I understand that, of course. I'm just commenting on games who did systems like this better. I'm talking of the general sense of control which M2TW is lacking in it's Vassal system.

[Inardesco]

You can't really comment on games on how they could've done things when they are 10 years apart.

[brianhawes]

Originally posted by Inardesco:

You can't really comment on games on how they could've done things when they are 10 years apart.

Ya but they could have done LIKE THAT Holly is not saying THAT and I think you know that but still. The devs of m2tw could have been like "ya how about we make this system something more than "you are under attack? I'll help."
It feels stupid and completely under developed

[Mekkermann]

In Denmod you can directly control your Vassal thanks to LUA scripting, https://www.moddb.com/mods/medieval-ii-denmod . This is a relative new feature for medieval 2 but with the time it will spread to other mods as well.

[Inardesco]

Originally posted by brianhawes:

Originally posted by Inardesco:

You can't really comment on games on how they could've done things when they are 10 years apart.

Ya but they could have done LIKE THAT Holly is not saying THAT and I think you know that but still. The devs of m2tw could have been like "ya how about we make this system something more than "you are under attack? I'll help."
It feels stupid and completely under developed

2006.

You fail to understand a massive key component in software development back then: The insane hardware limitations that are virtually non-existant today.

Originally posted by random ass pc in 2006:

1gb RAM DDR400 (probaly 2x512mb in dual channel)
2.8GHz
socket 775 800FSB mobo
128mb DDRII 450mhz Grfx Card @ 75hz 1024x786, AGP BUS
17" TFT VGA
120gb Ultra-ATA HD
DVD RW+- 16

Intel socket 775 p4 @ 3.4ghz, 2gb DDR400/pc3200 (2x1gb dual channel), motherboard with 800FSB, 250Watt PSU.

This is a build someone was asking about in 2006 ( http://vbcity.com/forums/t/133493.aspx ) whether or not it was good and it was called SOLID at the time.

Can you imagine releasing a game in 2023 that would only require 1gb of RAM and a 128mb GPU?

They could've done more. Sure. But they couldn't. Because the hardware of the day wasn't capeable of doing that on a consumer basis. Likewise devs can create solid AI's nowadays but 100% of consumer pc's wouldn't be able to have the processing power required to run those AI.

[Buddy Holly]

Originally posted by brianhawes:

Originally posted by Inardesco:

You can't really comment on games on how they could've done things when they are 10 years apart.

Ya but they could have done LIKE THAT Holly is not saying THAT and I think you know that but still. The devs of m2tw could have been like "ya how about we make this system something more than "you are under attack? I'll help."
It feels stupid and completely under developed

lol thank you for defending high school me, I was probably wrong though

[OldMemes.biz]

Originally posted by Buddy Holly:

Originally posted by brianhawes:

Ya but they could have done LIKE THAT Holly is not saying THAT and I think you know that but still. The devs of m2tw could have been like "ya how about we make this system something more than "you are under attack? I'll help."
It feels stupid and completely under developed

lol thank you for defending high school me, I was probably wrong though

No you had a valid point that is still valid today.

It's just some people in this community can't tolerate ANY criticism of M2TW, whether it's valid criticism or not doesn't even factor in with them. It's just impulsive fangirling.

[EoNightcore]

Eh, the Total War series was never that great in regards to its diplomacy gameplay; the game with the best diplomacy in the series I reckon was Three Kingdoms; and for the other games, I feel they just don't really bother trying beyond importing the most basic of features from the last game.

Now, if someone really wanted to play a game with diplomacy in it, they'd play Europa Universalis or Crusader Kings. Those games are filled to the brim with diplomacy.

[OldMemes.biz]

Originally posted by EoNightcore:

Eh, the Total War series was never that great in regards to its diplomacy gameplay; the game with the best diplomacy in the series I reckon was Three Kingdoms; and for the other games, I feel they just don't really bother trying beyond importing the most basic of features from the last game.

Now, if someone really wanted to play a game with diplomacy in it, they'd play Europa Universalis or Crusader Kings. Those games are filled to the brim with diplomacy.

lmao as it happens I'm currently in a CK2 session right now.