IRL, why are tractors so expensive?

[BanDHMO]

This might be a dumb question to people who understand agricultural machinery, but since we have actual farmers on the board, maybe they can help answer.

A new pickup truck with about 300hp engine can be bought for about $35,000-45,000 in the United States. A used 300hp agricultural tractor costs over $250,000, according to this:

https://www.fastline.com/v100/listings.aspx?Category=Tractors

WHY?! I mean, I get that a tractor is more than just an engine, but ultimately it's not THAT complicated of a machine, is it? It's supposed to grip dirt with big wheels and drag a piece of equipment behind it. It also needs to steer and stop. That's kind of it.

So why does it take so much work/resources to build a tractor?

[Syd Khaos]

Drag a piece of equipment?

No, most implements are powered, by the tractor.

You are only comparing 2 parts of these 2 vehicles...the engine and tires.
You are not thinking of overall fabrication, gearbox, PTO outputs & gearbox, mounts, hydrollics.

Even on the most basic level, the chassis, a tractor is more inticate and more material than a truck. Tractors have box frames, trucks are typically C-stock for the frame.
And everything after that is gonna be more complex (and therefore more costly) in the tractor than in the truck.

Truck is gonna have standard single range gearbox/transmission.
Tractor is gonna have dual-range, high torque gearbox.

Truck engine/trans is powering a single driveshaft and differential to drive tires (2wheel drive)
Tractor is powering 2 driveshafts and 2 differentials (rear one usually locking), hydrollics, and 1-3 PTO driveshafts.

There is a huge difference from a truck and a tractor, the cost difference is justifiable.

[rhwilson1953]

A pickup weighs 4500 - 7000 pounds, a tractor of a size of that would be only a utility tractor that a owner of a large homestead might use to mow grass or weeds and maybe pull a wagon of not much capacity. A 300hp tractor weighs in at about twice as much as a pickup. There is a lot of steel involved in making a tractor.

[BanDHMO]

Originally posted by SydKhaos:

Drag a piece of equipment?

No, most implements are powered, by the tractor.

You are only comparing 2 parts of these 2 vehicles...the engine and tires.
You are not thinking of overall fabrication, gearbox, PTO outputs & gearbox, mounts, hydrollics.

Even on the most basic level, the chassis, a tractor is more inticate and more material than a truck. Tractors have box frames, trucks are typically C-stock for the frame.
And everything after that is gonna be more complex (and therefore more costly) in the tractor than in the truck.

Truck is gonna have standard single range gearbox/transmission.
Tractor is gonna have dual-range, high torque gearbox.

Truck engine/trans is powering a single driveshaft and differential to drive tires (2wheel drive)
Tractor is powering 2 driveshafts and 2 differentials (rear one usually locking), hydrollics, and 1-3 PTO driveshafts.

There is a huge difference from a truck and a tractor, the cost difference is justifiable.

Thanks for the details. Some of the points above, I'm either not understanding, or they apply to trucks as well (at least the trucks I was talking about). The dual range transmission, I'm assuming means the same thing as the 4-Low on 4x4 trucks? Rear locking differential, again, is the same thing as on a truck, or is there something different about tractor ones?

Also, just to clarify, I'm not surprised tractors are more expensive than 4x4 trucks of the same power; I'm surprised that they are almost 10 times more expensive. Sure, a tractor is bigger, heavier, has more features, and I'd definitely expect them to cost over $100K new. But $250K used, seems like a lot.

[Sir Crashalot]

Specialised machinery vs general purpose machinery.

People can buy pick up trucks for general purpose use, so they will sell a lot more.
Tractors cost more to make and your average Joe public has no use for it, so it wont sell nearly as many. The manufacturers have to make a profit from the lower sales, so the price has to be higher.

[BanDHMO]

Originally posted by Sir Crashalot:

Specialised machinery vs general purpose machinery.

People can buy pick up trucks for general purpose use, so they will sell a lot more.
Tractors cost more to make and your average Joe public has no use for it, so it wont sell nearly as many. The manufacturers have to make a profit from the lower sales, so the price has to be higher.

Yeah, that's kind of what I suspected, though one would think a tractor is still a pretty general machine that there would be a big competitive market for them. Scale makes all the difference, I guess.

[(TEAMKILL)]

Dont forget tractors and farm equipment in general aren't made to be throw-aways after 10 years of use.

[Rev Counter]

Originally posted by BanDHMO:

Thanks for the details. Some of the points above, I'm either not understanding, or they apply to trucks as well (at least the trucks I was talking about). The dual range transmission, I'm assuming means the same thing as the 4-Low on 4x4 trucks? Rear locking differential, again, is the same thing as on a truck, or is there something different about tractor ones?

Also, just to clarify, I'm not surprised tractors are more expensive than 4x4 trucks of the same power; I'm surprised that they are almost 10 times more expensive. Sure, a tractor is bigger, heavier, has more features, and I'd definitely expect them to cost over $100K new. But $250K used, seems like a lot.

A lot of tractors have very complex shift-on-the-go boxes (like Massey Ferguson's 4-speed Dyna-shift), or ones with variable ranges (CVT), whereas a truck will have four ranges at most and none of these.

Then you have to consider that a lot of large modern tractors have masses of electronics that allow them to be computer controlled. Everything on a tractor has to be built many times heavier and stronger than on a pickup truck, as they need to cope with huge stresses.

Additionally, the fact is that a used tractor is not like a used truck, the engines are designed to work way harder for way longer, and that's why they are measured in work hours, not miles. Any modern tractor will retain a lot of value if it has been properly serviced and cared for.

[Spec]

A tractor is the best thing since the wheel was invented. Absolutely the handiest tool you can have for outside work.

[GramClan]

Also, remember that a 150 hp tractor could tow a LOT more than a 300 hp truck, and that is reflected in the price of the transmission parts.....

[Vaupell]

The claas "plastic" tractors are rougly halfpriced of Case/JohnDeere
- Also New hollande are usually 20% cheaper than C/JD ^^

But Tractors in general are "BUILDT TO LAST" they actually last and they maintain their
value for many years, compared to a car, a tracktors price is dropping at a much lower rate than a car.
After 20 years a car is usually worth 0$€$KR...
While a tracktor af 20 years often is worth 100.000$€£KR...

Quality is most likely the main factore, regardless of the brand.
High quality parts, mechanics and heavy duty buildup makes them last, but using these parts is also very exspensive.

Compared to modern electronics that last 1-5 years, which is also why it's cheap, unless you like to pay extra for a brandname or design.

BTW.. i was at AGROMEK 2016, in denmark. and they have "cheap/low cost tracktors"
See this image. (it's in Danish kroner)

Plastic tractor..
649.000Dkkr. rougly $100.000 us..

http://i.imgur.com/cmccnv6.jpg

But hey,, noone exspect them to last.. :p

[Syd Khaos]

Originally posted by BanDHMO:

Thanks for the details. Some of the points above, I'm either not understanding, or they apply to trucks as well (at least the trucks I was talking about). The dual range transmission, I'm assuming means the same thing as the 4-Low on 4x4 trucks? Rear locking differential, again, is the same thing as on a truck, or is there something different about tractor ones?

Also, just to clarify, I'm not surprised tractors are more expensive than 4x4 trucks of the same power; I'm surprised that they are almost 10 times more expensive. Sure, a tractor is bigger, heavier, has more features, and I'd definitely expect them to cost over $100K new. But $250K used, seems like a lot.

You said for $35-45k...not sure where your from, but around here (south Texas, on the coast) you aint getting no diff-locking 4WD for that price. And trucks of all kind are kinda a rampant commodity around here.

Dual range gearboxes on a tractor are NOTHING like shifting in 4LOW on a 4WD truck.
The gearboxes in most tractors are more akin to the split-range transmissions of big-rig trucks ( those using NON allison style transmissions) than your average 4WD truck.

The locking differential is also very different.
In you average 4WD truck the locking mechanism is tab on the outter gearthat locks into a cradel on the inner gear. This is not super stong...and I have persoanlly broken this, on a couple vehicles.
On most tractors the ENTIRE outter gear will cradel into the inner gear for the lock. Not to mention the mechanism is larger and more durable.

Take a look at this for example:\
http://www.hlavinka.com/equipment/case-ih-equipment/tractors/Puma-Series/Puma-4
This is the Case Puma 150....much smaller then the Puma series tractor we have ingame.

This tractor contains about 4 times the amount of steel as a 4WD single cab 4WD truck.
Not to mention probably 3 times the electronics (as most modern tractors are computer controlled with onboard GPS).

I assure you, if you actually had a 4WD truck and a decent little tractor sitting in your driveway you could disassemble you would see plain as day there is prudent justification for the price difference.

[BanDHMO]

Awesome details in responses. Thank you, guys. Like I said, I don't know much about agri machinery, and it's a lot of fun to learn!

Originally posted by SydKhaos:

You said for $35-45k...not sure where your from, but around here (south Texas, on the coast) you aint getting no diff-locking 4WD for that price. And trucks of all kind are kinda a rampant commodity around here.

This piece I'll respectfully disagree with, though. Perhaps Texas is much more expensive for trucks, I don't know. I live in a rather average state. Not the overpriced NY or CA, but also not the inexpensive ones in the South or Midwest. And here you can get a brand new 2016 Toyota Tacoma Off-Road TRD (278hp, 4x4, rear locker and all that) for under $40K.

[BanDHMO]

By the way, since you guys explained the difference between light trucks and tractors in technical terms so well, can we talk about what it means in practice?

What would happen if you fixed a small plow to a 300hp truck and tried to crawl it in 4-low very slowly across a field?

I'm assuming it wouldn't have a problem power-wise, though the plow would have to be pretty small. After all, if one horse could drag a small plow, surely a truck can also.

I'm guessing if you do it for too long the truck would overheat? Maybe transmission problems? Or would it simply not have the traction necessary to use all that engine power, even with 4WD, unless you put absurd tires on and lift it up?

I'm really wild-guessing here and trying to make sense of it all. From what was discussed above, obviously, the truck is no substitute for a tractor, but at the same time it seems counter-intuitive that a 4000lb machine, which can drag itself up a steep incline over broken rocks would have trouble pulling a simple implement to overturn earth.

[(TEAMKILL)]

Gear'ing and traction are going to be totally dif between trucks n tractors. Having driven both, I can say with great confidence... About all they really have in common is both have an engine and both have wheels. But even those two "commonalities" arent even the same....

Apples and marshmellos man, apples and marshmellos.

[BanDHMO]

LOL, check out this guy plowing with his Dodge:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EByMcmA9lGo

If you watch how much the tractor covers in a pass and how much the truck does, the difference becomes very obvious. Not to mention, I bet his truck wouldn't last long if he ran it for 10 hours a day like this.