One Last Drink... how does this count as an ambush?

[BlackDragon]

It's just a little, optional side-quest, but this thing is pissing me off... I don't have the Finesse or Sense to do anything clever, but I DO have Røskva along, and she warns me about the poison. So I throw down the horn, accuse my host of trying to poison me, and grab my axe. Everybody reaches for their weapons...

...aaaaand then the assassins get a full round of wailing on me for free while I can do nothing to defend myself. I've yet to find any way to avoid at least one of my Hird getting knocked down during that round. They'll very sensibly pick an easy target, and then focus all their attacks on him or her, while hitting other members with Stuns. In those kinds of extremely close quarters, surrounded by foes, there's no way to avoid them, no way to play it tactically. The situation is simply stacked against you to a ludicrous degree.

Which I could accept if I'd actually walked into that ambush blind, but I DIDN'T! I NOTICED the poison! (Or, well, Røskva did and warned me, but same difference.) I basically INITIALIZED the battle! Why the HELL does it count as an ambush? WHY do the enemies get to attack me like that, while I'm left defenseless? It makes no sense!

At the moment, it seems like all I CAN do is play the battle over and over until I luck out, and whichever Hirdman gets dogpiled manages to come through without permanent injuries... which is just stupid.

[CreamTheCheeks]

You are in his house and they were ready to attack at tge drop of the hat. Roskca can whisper that to you but your hirdmen didnt know and havent situated themselves to respond.

[BlackDragon]

Oh, don't give me that... there's even an interval after I throw down the horn/gauntlet where the host has a little motive-rant. Plenty of time for everyone to be on an equal footing. What's more, SITUATING themselves is apparently the only thing they ARE capable of doing, what with the way the so-called 'Surprise Round' works.

Ugh... it wouldn't be such a big deal except I'm far from Skjern and Hulda's free healing, and since I only found OUT about that recently, I already used up all my medicine and then some healing injuries from the first couple of battles the hard way.

Look, the point is, the 'Surprise Round' is fine on large, tactical maps, where you've got room to position yourself, and the enemy is likely to spend most of their turn moving towards you as well. You'll catch a few arrows, perhaps, but that's fair. Doing it in such a tiny, tightly-enclosed battlefield, with that many foes, is just sadistic - the kind of tactical situation that should be reserved for when you're TRULY caught flatfooted, as might've been the case if I hadn't brought Røskva, or hadn't heeded her warning.

[CreamTheCheeks]

Originally posted by BlackDragon:

Oh, don't give me that... there's even an interval after I throw down the horn/gauntlet where the host has a little motive-rant. Plenty of time for everyone to be on an equal footing. What's more, SITUATING themselves is apparently the only thing they ARE capable of doing, what with the way the so-called 'Surprise Round' works.

Ugh... it wouldn't be such a big deal except I'm far from Skjern and Hulda's free healing, and since I only found OUT about that recently, I already used up all my medicine and then some healing injuries from the first couple of battles the hard way.

Look, the point is, the 'Surprise Round' is fine on large, tactical maps, where you've got room to position yourself, and the enemy is likely to spend most of their turn moving towards you as well. You'll catch a few arrows, perhaps, but that's fair. Doing it in such a tiny, tightly-enclosed battlefield, with that many foes, is just sadistic - the kind of tactical situation that should be reserved for when you're TRULY caught flatfooted, as might've been the case if I hadn't brought Røskva, or hadn't heeded her warning.

Do you really expect to start the round as the ambusher inside someones home who prepared said home to ambush you?

[BlackDragon]

*sigh* I suppose that's a fair point. Problem is, the way the system works, there's no 'equal footing' option. Either I get the first hit, or they do. So, considering the tactical situation in this case, I daresay the AI-enemies would complain LESS about the unfairness if THEY got the short end of the stick. (Besides, it's not like he had THAT much time to set up the ambush. We only just met on the marketplace, and it's not like he was expecting to find me there!)

[screeg]

The way I finally beat that one was to leave Roskva behind. With her I could only beat them with two men standing, without her it was a wipe, even though I drank a bit of the ale anyway.

[[__h.stickeye_]]

all i can say is that this was th easiest fight. I dont get how everyone whinges about how hard this game is. I was literally savouring how hard normal would be.

[BlackDragon]

Originally posted by screeg:

The way I finally beat that one was to leave Roskva behind. With her I could only beat them with two men standing, without her it was a wipe, even though I drank a bit of the ale anyway.

Um? How did that work? Does the fight somehow work out better if you don't get the warning and go ahead and drink some of the mead? >_> That makes even less sense...

[CreamTheCheeks]

Originally posted by BlackDragon:

Originally posted by screeg:

The way I finally beat that one was to leave Roskva behind. With her I could only beat them with two men standing, without her it was a wipe, even though I drank a bit of the ale anyway.

Um? How did that work? Does the fight somehow work out better if you don't get the warning and go ahead and drink some of the mead? >_> That makes even less sense...

You have more fighters

[BlackDragon]

...and no healers whatsoever. >_> I'm not sure I see the logic.

[screeg]

The drink isn't "poison", it's just a mild drug. I had a drink, figured it out and started the fight. Turns out Roskva was holding me back by being a crap fighter. You don't need a healer if you kill everyone straight away.

Of course it also helps that I'd done the fight twice by that point, and knew where to position my crew such that no one was killed in the first round, and my archer was shielded from melee.

@Black Dragon: Positioning is everything. Every battle is full of choke points and opportunities, so many that it disadvantages the enemy AI. They really don't know how to use the field. From reading your different posts I think you need to take a closer look at unit positioning, cover, and which fighting skills compliment each other. After losing (by which I mean too many injured) the same fight once or twice I always figure out a better way.

[[__h.stickeye_]]

all i read was "cant be bothered learning how the game works so Ill whinge and whine instead".

[Oleczek]

Originally posted by __h.stickeye_:

all i read was "cant be bothered learning how the game works so Ill whinge and whine instead".

yeah, nah. its just like one or two hours into gameplay and for that level of expertise its stupid hard. did re run to that point just to clear when developed character properly.
Also ty OP cuz i thought its only me who suck and that gave me hope ;D

[Gustuv Wynd]

In case any one is wondering...for me this game is the best defense is a good offense. This isn't some MMORPG where opponents are hitting each other and who ever has the better healer wins...it is a kill or be killed game. Defense only goes as far as starting combat with a shield, but I typically switch it out on the first turn.

I try to bring along a healer so I can level them up faster, but I find most use out of them in the camp healing wounds. Kill first...heal later. That mentality has made me win a lot of fights that I would loose with a healer around.