Loneliness - Asking the players [MASSIVE SPOILER]

[Mad]

Hello, everyone, Ivan's here! First of all, as always, sorry for my bad english: I'll try to make all of this understandable.

If you're reading this then that means you completed the game for real (or you're just a peeper).
First of all, thanks to everyone involved in the feedback given onto this forum: with your help I managed to fix every little thing here and there, so thanks a lot!

Anyway, there's a thing that is bugging me a lot: Loneliness. And with Loneliness I'm talking about the last section, about what remains after you erase the curse of White Face.


That last section is obviously made to keep you there forever. If you remove the malevolent entity from a "rough" game that loves messing with you, then what remains is that "rough" game itself.
A lot of people already know that messing with .ini files is what you need to do in order to play again, and obviously we're breaking 4th wall's 4th wall there: I love seeing how much people wants to play IMSCARED again and I'm really suffering inside for customers that diss the game for not being replayable without messing with .ini files.
I do see the problem... After all, this is not a freeware game anymore and maybe "risky" things like making the player stuck in Loneliness is not a great thing to do.
It's just that I love how things goes in my game: I made it to like this to reach the player in a certain way, to make the player think about all the things happened. It's the ending I always strived for, an ending that leaves a mark impossible to erase (without obviously deleting the .ini files).

And, just as I gave you the burden to Choose at the end, now I'm filled with that burden myself: should I give the player the opportunity to reset the game after Loneliness? Or should I follow my own heart (and that heart is screaming "Hey, that's the cool thing of IMSCARED ending, what are you doing?).

The thing is, I really respect my customers for purchasing and playing my creation and I really don't want to do something that annoys them that much.




tl;dr, I'm considering the idea of giving a reset option in Loneliness and that wall of text is the big Why

[Zergem]

I think it's fine as it is. If the player made it to the very end, then there's not really anything they'll get by replaying the game. These things in the game were effective the first time around, but afterwards it's just a case of repeating everything you've done in the exact same way.

And if they really want to, it's not that hard to just delete all the game files to start fresh.

(Not to diss the game. I had a fair amount of fun working out the meta-puzzles with a friend, and the ending was satisfying enough.)

[Allie]

The Loneliness ending is honestly one of my favorite things about the game! (as horrifying as it is! Haha... ) When you remove whiteface's heart, you take the "heart" out of the game. There are no more scares, cool ambient music, spooky areas or effects, immersion-necessary black fog... your fear/hate/curiousity for whiteface's end is realized, and because whiteface is almost the entire experience, what you end up with is a game without any sort of atmosphere whatsoever. And you deserve that.

Do I think you should make it reversible, in the sense that you don't need to change game files for it? No, I don't. Games having permanent effects is a really niche and cool thing that you don't see very often (the few examples I can think of are games built around this, like the flash games 7 Days and One Life To Live, or Undertale, which is a whole 'nother discussion. And Imscared, of course.)

If you really feel the need to make it this way, to produce a better product (though again! I feel no need to) I think what might work best is a middle ground. For example, players could choose the door, go through all of that, then maybe have some 'hidden' decision right before deleting the heart. Like waiting a really, really long time without doing so. I feel that way, you could reward truly remorseful players who were just curious and are willing to stick it out and wait to see if anything happens, and also keep the permanence of death. But, one last time: I feel how the game is already designed is perfect.

Final word in my doctoral thesis of a response: Why I rolled back and mess with that .ini file. What encouraged me to do so wasn't that I was upset or merely curious and wanted to play the game again, or discover any secrets. (Looking for secrets came later :P) The reason why I found the files was because I felt awful. Having given whiteface the flower a few times, I really, really liked him. Honestly, I may never have chosen the door if friends didn't want to see what would happen. I just wanted him back. I personally continue to mess with the .ini because that's just who I am; every game I've ever loved and have had an opportunity to peek through game files or levels, I have. It's really interesting, and I love it, to see hidden stuff or understand how data relates to other data in games.

I love Imscared, it is certainly one of my five favorite games I've ever played. I loved it from when it came out in 2012 and I couldn't be a Tag Master because my 2005 laptop's shift key was broken; I loved it in 2014 when I had a working shift key and could play through the whole game; I loved it a few days ago when I found out it was rereleased on Steam; I love it now. I poke through the files because I love it (but if it really is distressing you, I will stop!). It is a unique experience and I don't think it should change.

TL;DR One of the most unique and enjoyable games I've ever played, doesn't need to change, but if you feel like it should then try to find a third option.

Now that you know how little of a life I have, in order to put out that many words on this game, best of luck dealing with this problem!

[Natoriouspig]

Don't change it. If they killed White Face, it was their choice, and they should pay for it. If they truly want to play the game again, then they can go through the forums to find out how, but i believe your ending is the best one.

[tipsyConfection]

This ending still makes me feel pain in my heart.
But, you know, it's a simple yet hard choice: "IT'S YOU OR ME", "KILL OR BE KILLED" and so on.
I, personally, feel myself awful for doing what i had to do, but it was a choice, my choice, and i have to live with it.
The choice shouldn't be undone, what's done is done. Leave everything as it is.
And, you know, i wish this game couldn't be hacked into playing again, so it would be trully the final choice... but, oh well, at least we have what we have.
I will never play this game again, as i will never play Undertale again, for the same reason. I made a choice.
...I'm sorry, White Face. Kill, or be Killed.

p.s.
Man, i hope you will make something even greater than this.
It's the future of gaming, i'm sure of that.
Or, at least, i hope to see some version of Calm Time again, but greater, bigger, better.

[Natoriouspig]

Originally posted by Tentacle Monster:

This ending still makes me feel pain in my heart.
But, you know, it's a simple yet hard choice: "IT'S YOU OR ME", "KILL OR BE KILLED" and so on.
I, personally, feel myself awful for doing what i had to do, but it was a choice, my choice, and i have to live with it.
The choice shouldn't be undone, what's done is done. Leave everything as it is.
And, you know, i wish this game couldn't be hacked into playing again, so it would be trully the final choice... but, oh well, at least we have what we have.
I will never play this game again, as i will never play Undertale again, for the same reason. I made a choice.
...I'm sorry, White Face. Kill, or be Killed.

p.s.
Man, i hope you will make something even greater than this.
It's the future of gaming, i'm sure of that.
Or, at least, i hope to see some version of Calm Time again, but greater, bigger, better.

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥! He made calm time too?! Wow, you are awesome. If you made an add on to IMSCARED which incorporated the story of calm time into the story of imscared that would be the greatest indie horror on steam. It would be pretty easy too, after the door option, the woman from calm time appears in the hub and starts to change ♥♥♥♥ up, with the killer making an appearance too, wow, please Ivan, make that.

[Amanita]

the game's amazing as is, but i'm sure that story implications of an "in-universe" way of resetting the game outside of messing with .ini files would make it worth it if you did add such an option.

[Allie]

Originally posted by Tentacle Monster:

But, you know, it's a simple yet hard choice: "IT'S YOU OR ME", "KILL OR BE KILLED" and so on.

I didn't know I was in the Flowey Fan Club forums ;P

Originally posted by Abaddon:

the game's amazing as is, but i'm sure that story implications of an "in-universe" way of resetting the game outside of messing with .ini files would make it worth it if you did add such an option.

This is the real reason I'm making this reply, because it made me think of something. If whiteface is data, technically we'd be making a new whiteface each time we edit the init file, wouldn't we? We aren't resurrecting the poor fella, we're just making a new one. We're still murderers! Maybe that's as "in-universe" as it gets? Whatever. I can't put my thoughts straight, but there they are.

[Natoriouspig]

Originally posted by Allie:

Originally posted by Tentacle Monster:

But, you know, it's a simple yet hard choice: "IT'S YOU OR ME", "KILL OR BE KILLED" and so on.

I didn't know I was in the Flowey Fan Club forums ;P

Originally posted by Abaddon:

the game's amazing as is, but i'm sure that story implications of an "in-universe" way of resetting the game outside of messing with .ini files would make it worth it if you did add such an option.

This is the real reason I'm making this reply, because it made me think of something. If whiteface is data, technically we'd be making a new whiteface each time we edit the init file, wouldn't we? We aren't resurrecting the poor fella, we're just making a new one. We're still murderers! Maybe that's as "in-universe" as it gets? Whatever. I can't put my thoughts straight, but there they are.

I see potential for a great undertale-like moment here, where if after you reset the game using the .ini files, the game would read it through your steam achievements and there would be a secret dialogue between the player and White Face, something about resurrection or something else creepy like that. That would be really cool.

[Timothy]

I LOVE loneliness the way that it is...it gives me a sense of frisson that very few games achieve.

If people really want to play through your game again, they'll figure out how to manipulate the game's .ini files anyhow--if anything, doing so would be in the spirit of the "gameplay" in that regard.

AT MOST I would provide some unique dialog during a new runthrough for people that do so, as others have mentioned. You did someting pretty unique, and it willl cause some backlash from mainstream customers regardless.

I recommend looking up an old flash game called "One Chance" where you only get one try at saving the world before the game locks you out forever (unless you modify your computer's data.)

That game really stuck with me through the years... having "permanent" choices and consequences in gameplay is something I'd like to see explored more from game developers, and I feel that your game is bringing this vision on the right path.

[Natoriouspig]

Originally posted by Captain Howdy:

I LOVE loneliness the way that it is...it gives me a sense of frisson that very few games achieve.

If people really want to play through your game again, they'll figure out how to manipulate the game's .ini files anyhow--if anything, doing so would be in the spirit of the "gameplay" in that regard.

AT MOST I would provide some unique dialog during a new runthrough for people that do so, as others have mentioned. You did someting pretty unique, and it willl cause some backlash from mainstream customers regardless.

I recommend looking up an old flash game called "One Chance" where you only get one try at saving the world before the game locks you out forever (unless you modify your computer's data.)

That game really stuck with me through the years... having "permanent" choices and consequences in gameplay is something I'd like to see explored more from game developers, and I feel that your game is bringing this vision on the right path.

Exactly, don't change your game because people feel bad about their choices. Your game is perfect the way it is, and you have crafted something amazing and original. Don't let other people ruin your view of YOUR game.

[tipsyConfection]

Though, i just had a thought.
If there would be really a way to restore the game in-universe...
White Face wouldn't be happy.
White Face would hate you for what you've done.
White Face would haunt you forever, really trying to make your Scared, like it was before.
And you wouldn't be able to finish the game again.
White Face will just erase the door.
...just a thought, though.

[Banana Slamma]

How about if you make it so we can kind of uh.. Bring White Face back to life?. I know this isn't the subject of the game, the point is that it's kind of a dark storyline. But it would be nice knowing that white face is happy, in a non-psychopatic non-depending-on-the-player way. Or maybe i'm just rambling since White Face is my waifu

[AssimilatedDoggy]

Originally posted by Natoriouspig:

Don't change it. If they killed White Face, it was their choice, and they should pay for it. If they truly want to play the game again, then they can go through the forums to find out how, but i believe your ending is the best one.

When I first renamed White Faces heart I felt bad, but after I anylised the story it seemed like the right thing to do. After thinking for a while I came to the conclusion that White Face was the trapped spirit of the girl who commited suicide, the girl in the picture in the basement at the very begining of the game, the girl who White Face changes to and the girl who White Face refers to in the files as HER.
I personally thought White Face was lonely and cursed to reside in the game, too scared to move on to the afterlife or to finally let death claim them hence it saying I'm Scared.
Anyway that's the story I got out of the experience though I may be wrong.

[vermis]

I think it should stay as it is, by which I mean that you should be able to reset the game by deleting the files.

Maybe you could have a message hinting at this somewhere in the loneliness ending, and put the relevant files in the 'imscared' folder on the desktop. Or maybe you could make it "restart" by creating the heart file again. I think this would fit in the games atmosphere.

After playing through twice, I don't feel bad about ending the curse of white face!

[vermis]

By the way, I liked this game a lot when I played it years ago, and I like it as much now. I haven't heard of Calm Time before, and I'm going to check it out now.