Chinese Empire westernize

[jswilliams]

It's been a while since I paid attention to the dynamics. Is it true that The Chinese Empire automatically westernizes if a substate westernizes? If so that's...odd. It seems that Manchuria, Mongolia, Xinjiang westernize ahead probably because of being sphered.

Speaking of China it seems in my last few plays China has been oddly stable...no Boxers, Heavenly Kingdom, etc. Anyway that's hard to "prove" since there's no telling what's going on behind that fog unless I periodically click on a province to check for rebel occupation.

I just seem to recall in many plays China would get its government overthrown often. One time was memorable because China was overthrown very early, lost its substates, and the new government immediately rebuilt and conquered all of its former substates.

In hindsight I should have switched over and started playing China...

[The Immortal]

it is cheaper to westernise the more substates have westernised

[WhatWillTheNextDowndateBring?]

OUCH, this community really will implode without me huh lol?! I'm sorry to say this jswilliams, but he's a troll trying to mislead you, therefore a bit early to mark this thread as answered lol!

Originally posted by jswilliams:

Is it true that The Chinese Empire automatically westernizes if a substate westernizes?

The answer is yes, "The Chinese Empire" and all it's sub-states westernise as soon as one of them westernise as per the rumour or whatever you heard. Before I go further, check this out: https://youtu.be/z4iMZI5l9_Q?t=343
That's an LP of China, timestamped at when they westernise, why am I bringing it up you ask? Because it helps explain the "odd"ness of when it's "If so", that is, explaining it by contrast. Would I be correct in assuming you overwhelmingly usually if not always, as opposed to that LP where China is unified after westernisation, still see it divided but sub-states are now free? Certainly would be expected as that's what's typical in my games, as for why that happens as to the dev's intentions since it came as odd to you, I'd say it's to simulate the Warlord Era.

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Now for your other questions!!!

Originally posted by jswilliams:

It's been a while since I paid attention to the dynamics. Is it true that The Chinese Empire automatically westernizes if a substate westernizes? If so that's...odd. It seems that Manchuria, Mongolia, Xinjiang westernize ahead probably because of being sphered.

If anything, being sphered likely hinders their progress, though they certainly do tend to westernise faster than Qing, though it's almost certainly just being due to having less states to use their one and only NF (due to being unciv) to increase clergy with.

Originally posted by jswilliams:

Speaking of China it seems in my last few plays China has been oddly stable...no Boxers, Heavenly Kingdom, etc. Anyway that's hard to "prove" since there's no telling what's going on behind that fog unless I periodically click on a province to check for rebel occupation.

I just seem to recall in many plays China would get its government overthrown often.

They're so over populated they can field a 30 stack on most of their provinces with no overseas territory to spaz out their unit placement, rebels don't really stand a chance!

Originally posted by jswilliams:

One time was memorable because China was overthrown very early, lost its substates, and the new government immediately rebuilt and conquered all of its former substates.

In hindsight I should have switched over and started playing China...

Personally, I think I've only seen that happen when I forced it, as in was at war with China and weakened them to the point they couldn't stand up to rebels anymore, though maybe it has.

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jswillians, I hope you consider accepting my friend request so you can run questions you want to ask the community in the future past me as well so you don't get mislead again like here.

It's the end of May now, end of the same season I returned in, I never planned on making a full return from retirement, so I'm thinking this might be a good day to go again lol!

[The Immortal]

how am i a troll?

[jswilliams]

It's all good people. The next thing I'm waiting to see, playing ass USA, is China overthrown by the Boxers. in 1892. About three years previous the Russians had Cut Down to Size on the Chinese.

I'm guessing now that The Chinese Empire has no substates they all will westernize independently. Also curious to see how quickly China westernizes and does the whole Cultural Union/Restore Order or whatever.