Gleba is not hard with logistics bots/trash unrequested checkbox

[Entropy]

Thank me later^^

[Zhardoz]

same with the "recycling" world

[Neferneith]

At any point past the space science, there is a *screw that, i'll use logibots* solution to your problem. Not always the most elegant or glorious but you can call it *temporary solution* and come back later or never.

[Nero]

Originally posted by Neferneith:

At any point past the space science, there is a *screw that, i'll use logibots* solution to your problem. Not always the most elegant or glorious but you can call it *temporary solution* and come back later or never.

I like to call this a „permanent temporary measure“ because just like at IRL work, crude temporary measures often stay as permanent, inefficient atrocities

[Entropy]

Originally posted by Nero:

Originally posted by Neferneith:

At any point past the space science, there is a *screw that, i'll use logibots* solution to your problem. Not always the most elegant or glorious but you can call it *temporary solution* and come back later or never.

I like to call this a „permanent temporary measure“ because just like at IRL work, crude temporary measures often stay as permanent, inefficient atrocities

Well if you have robot speed 10+ it can carry you until ultra late game 240 item belts so^^... Robots are more efficient when it comes to design speed and faster scaling. So you deal with other stuff. They are also space efficient until you have stack inserters

[Entropy]

Originally posted by Zhardoz:

same with the "recycling" world

Recycling world has no problem. Over use splitter filters and recyclers. Recycle when certain item count is above and that is it. There is neither space nor design problem

[Torham]

Until you land on Aquillo...

[Das Trojanische Pferd]

Originally posted by Torham:

Until you land on Aquillo...

high quality bots work but are still a pain

[mrxak]

I've been saying it, Space Age is really trying to force us all into bot bases. It's just obviously so massively optimal, I don't know what they were thinking if they didn't intend us to play as just bot bases and ignore belts pretty much completely. Trains are also especially bad now. Belts beat them, but then bots are better than belts.

[Entropy]

Originally posted by mrxak:

I've been saying it, Space Age is really trying to force us all into bot bases. It's just obviously so massively optimal, I don't know what they were thinking if they didn't intend us to play as just bot bases and ignore belts pretty much completely. Trains are also especially bad now. Belts beat them, but then bots are better than belts.

Trains are needed on Fulgora definitely. Also first tungsten will deplete quickly, if second is not near you need it trains for Vulcanus too. On Gleba it is better to keep farm areas away from your main base at startup for defending so still dunno if it is better to use trains on Gleba or not.

[Neferneith]

It's (mostly) a single player game. No one is forcing us to follow any meta. I like bots to feed my mall or maintain a wall but I came back from mining/smelting with a bot swarm. It was just aesthetically unpleasant.

[mrxak]

Originally posted by Chastity Belt Enjoyer:

Originally posted by mrxak:

I've been saying it, Space Age is really trying to force us all into bot bases. It's just obviously so massively optimal, I don't know what they were thinking if they didn't intend us to play as just bot bases and ignore belts pretty much completely. Trains are also especially bad now. Belts beat them, but then bots are better than belts.

Trains are needed on Fulgora definitely. Also first tungsten will deplete quickly, if second is not near you need it trains for Vulcanus too. On Gleba it is better to keep farm areas away from your main base at startup for defending so still dunno if it is better to use trains on Gleba or not.

Okay, scrap trains on Fulgora, I'll grant you that. But that's really only until you get to Aquilo and unlock foundation. I may still continue using scrap trains, but I'm producing absurd amounts of stuff and science on Fulgora from just two fields, and with 8% depletion epic big mining drills and repeatable science, I think it will legitimately be a year of game play before I actually need to add more scrap mines to my Fulgora base, which is running on exactly two trains that are traveling very short distances. The only reason I didn't just run belts initially is because I hadn't unlocked foundation yet.

I haven't used a single train on Vulcanus and just run 240/s belts from my original patches of everything except coal. As soon as the stuff reaches my base area, it's all bots or very short running belts (less than 20 distance, no main bus for anything). I found the worms were trivial to kill, so I wasn't doing any guerrilla mining with elevated rails, as Wube and some LAN playtesters were suggesting was important technique. No, I just went and killed half a dozen worms within an hour of landing, with a tank and some uranium cannon shells.

Gleba I am exclusively bots. I tried to set up a belt system for nutrients and realized it was a big waste of my time and abandoned it. I also don't bother with bacteria and stuff, and import basically everything I need from Vulcanus, basically for free. Rockets are so cheap and lava costs nothing. It would be a waste of my time setting up a proper Gleba base that does anything but make Gleba science and stack inserters for export. Absolutely pointless to invest any time in doing anything there in an organized and attractive way.

I have some belts on Nauvis as a legacy from when I was starting out trying to main bus my way to space before I had logistics, but other than upgrading those lines speed up my basic 6 Nauvis sciences, I used nothing but bots to handle scaled up circuit production and module production and all of the quality manufacturing. I don't even make all 6 sciences on Nauvis anymore. I produce purple science on Vulcanus now and ship it back. I'm offshoring yellow science to Fulgora next.

I use bots on Aquilo exclusively. It's not that hard to keep them charged and flying. Things are mostly pipes there anyway. Literally the only place I have belts is for Kovarex process on my recycled depleted fission fuel so I don't have to import as much to keep my nukes running (haven't bothered with fusion yet).

I'm basically at a 1.x megabase now, producing almost as much science per minute as my biggest vanilla game before Space Age. While I'd like to be using belts, and I planned initially on using trains and doing a fully train base on Nauvis and hopefully other places as well, there's just no benefit to it anywhere. Bots are so good, each planet is specializing for exports and landing pads are best dealt with by bots anyway, and everything else feels too punishing.

It's actually pretty sad. When I first started playing Space Age I spent so much time working out new train blueprints as soon as I could because I was so excited for the new train stuff, and they're just sitting, gathering dust. I have a completely unused elevated rail network all over Nauvis I built in anticipation of my scale-up and not a single train has run on it.

If anyone is actually using trains for a 20k+ SPM base, I'd like to hear about it. I'd like to see screenshots. I'd bet, if they are, they're only using trains to move molten metal from mining outposts to their factories.

[POWER WITHIN USER]

Originally posted by mrxak:

Trains are also especially bad now. Belts beat them, but then bots are better than belts.

Someone who hasn't seen beaconed large drills outputting straight into cargo wagons.

[mrxak]

Originally posted by POWER WITHIN USER:

Originally posted by mrxak:

Trains are also especially bad now. Belts beat them, but then bots are better than belts.

Someone who hasn't seen beaconed large drills outputting straight into cargo wagons.

The only good thing trains were for in 1.x was throughput. Throughput was needed because productivity was so low. You could move more stuff over long distances with trains vs. blue belts. Well now we have green belts, 4 high, and when that stuff gets where it's going it's probably going to be put into a 175-300% productivity building, which means that whatever you produce is coming out in much bigger quantities on the other side, where it'll be used immediately by several more high productivity buildings. Do you try and put all of that into more trains? No, that's crazy, there aren't enough trains in the world to put all that stuff into.

[Entropy]

Originally posted by mrxak:

Originally posted by Chastity Belt Enjoyer:

Trains are needed on Fulgora definitely. Also first tungsten will deplete quickly, if second is not near you need it trains for Vulcanus too. On Gleba it is better to keep farm areas away from your main base at startup for defending so still dunno if it is better to use trains on Gleba or not.

Okay, scrap trains on Fulgora, I'll grant you that. But that's really only until you get to Aquilo and unlock foundation. I may still continue using scrap trains, but I'm producing absurd amounts of stuff and science on Fulgora from just two fields, and with 8% depletion epic big mining drills and repeatable science, I think it will legitimately be a year of game play before I actually need to add more scrap mines to my Fulgora base, which is running on exactly two trains that are traveling very short distances. The only reason I didn't just run belts initially is because I hadn't unlocked foundation yet.

I haven't used a single train on Vulcanus and just run 240/s belts from my original patches of everything except coal. As soon as the stuff reaches my base area, it's all bots or very short running belts (less than 20 distance, no main bus for anything). I found the worms were trivial to kill, so I wasn't doing any guerrilla mining with elevated rails, as Wube and some LAN playtesters were suggesting was important technique. No, I just went and killed half a dozen worms within an hour of landing, with a tank and some uranium cannon shells.

Gleba I am exclusively bots. I tried to set up a belt system for nutrients and realized it was a big waste of my time and abandoned it. I also don't bother with bacteria and stuff, and import basically everything I need from Vulcanus, basically for free. Rockets are so cheap and lava costs nothing. It would be a waste of my time setting up a proper Gleba base that does anything but make Gleba science and stack inserters for export. Absolutely pointless to invest any time in doing anything there in an organized and attractive way.

I have some belts on Nauvis as a legacy from when I was starting out trying to main bus my way to space before I had logistics, but other than upgrading those lines speed up my basic 6 Nauvis sciences, I used nothing but bots to handle scaled up circuit production and module production and all of the quality manufacturing. I don't even make all 6 sciences on Nauvis anymore. I produce purple science on Vulcanus now and ship it back. I'm offshoring yellow science to Fulgora next.

I use bots on Aquilo exclusively. It's not that hard to keep them charged and flying. Things are mostly pipes there anyway. Literally the only place I have belts is for Kovarex process on my recycled depleted fission fuel so I don't have to import as much to keep my nukes running (haven't bothered with fusion yet).

I'm basically at a 1.x megabase now, producing almost as much science per minute as my biggest vanilla game before Space Age. While I'd like to be using belts, and I planned initially on using trains and doing a fully train base on Nauvis and hopefully other places as well, there's just no benefit to it anywhere. Bots are so good, each planet is specializing for exports and landing pads are best dealt with by bots anyway, and everything else feels too punishing.

It's actually pretty sad. When I first started playing Space Age I spent so much time working out new train blueprints as soon as I could because I was so excited for the new train stuff, and they're just sitting, gathering dust. I have a completely unused elevated rail network all over Nauvis I built in anticipation of my scale-up and not a single train has run on it.

If anyone is actually using trains for a 20k+ SPM base, I'd like to hear about it. I'd like to see screenshots. I'd bet, if they are, they're only using trains to move molten metal from mining outposts to their factories.

Hmm understood. yeah 240 item per second per belt is easier to setup and handle than trains. I am still tech-rushing currently and will go into megabase and probably will follow your route.

[Entropy]

1 wagon equals to 6 block, 2 wide, 2880 with belts vs 4800 wagon itself(will change depending on stack size). Still easier to setup and handle than trains.