Main Bus question

[SonOfMyst]

What should I keep on my main bus, and what should I make as needed? I don't want fifty belts on the bus, but I'm not sure, as I've only made it to trains, what I can leave out.

[Fel]

You want mostly stuff that are needed everywhere.

So plates (copper, iron and steel) as well as green circuits are usually what you want there.
You can add things like plastic and such if you feel the need for it, liquids like lubricant can also be helpful.

Main bus is a style that works well up to a certain scale (more than enough to launch a rocket), beyond that it starts to not be as good since you need too many belts for it to be worth it.

[Taehl]

Good on bus:
- Iron, copper, and steel plates (you'll probably want more than 1 lane of each)
- Circuits
- Maybe basic transport belts and/or inserters
- Other intermediate items you find yourself needing often (Plastic? Batteries?)

Bad on bus:
- Generally, anything that turns N items into >N items is probably best made locally (eg. Copper Wire)
- Things that are very expensive to make and/or you only need small amounts of, so having them on the bus would be wasteful/inefficient (eg. Engine Units)
- Stuff that you only need in one certain area, not all across the factory (eg. Uranium)

[Cristi]

for me 4 belt of iron plate 4 of copper plate 2 of steel and one of coal, stone, brick
and i produce local what i need for item (science pack for example) usually if you put green circ on the main bus you will run out of it very soon so for me work if i produce local close to where i need it for example for red circ i will make a separate prod line with green just for the red circ only and so on. but depend on you how you prefer, usually try to keep the main/very common stuff on it

[Hedning]

The only decent way to play with a bus is to have a maximum of 1 belt of each product on the bus. If something would be starved by only getting part of one belt you should take it off the bus and make a subfactory for that thing.

I recommend a subfactory for each of the circuits. Then each of the circuits can have 1 belt on the bus along with copper, iron and steel. Gears and engines are optional.

The "mall" can be fed mostly by the bus but have a special gear supply.
Late game lds can get steel from the bus but have its own plastic and copper supply.

[RiO]

Originally posted by Purple.Dog:

what I can leave out.

Anything that turns N into >N like copper wire, as has already been mentioned.
Copper wire more so, because it can also trivially be made from just copper plate. So there's no complexity to just shipping in plate and making the wire on-site.

Similarly, you can leave out gears. The only things that need gears in mass are engines, and engines also need pipes. Both of which need just iron plate. So just belt in the iron plate and make the pipes and gears on site.

On that note: engines themselves could be left off as well. The only mass-produced things that initially needs them are blue science. Later, yellow science will need robot frames - which needs electric engines - which need regular engines as well though. So engines are in a bit of a debatable position. (Personally I just make them on-site twice.)

[Khaylain]

You've got some good advice here. Just a friendly reminder that anyone who claims there's only one way to do something in Factorio is probably oxdefecating.

[Taehl]

Originally posted by RiO:

On that note: engines themselves could be left off as well. The only mass-produced things that initially needs them are blue science. Later, yellow science will need robot frames - which needs electric engines - which need regular engines as well though. So engines are in a bit of a debatable position. (Personally I just make them on-site twice.)

I've always made engine units on-site, but yeah, that's a fair point.

I wonder: How many belts of iron plates does it take to output a full, double-sided belt of engines? If more than 1, that means you could reduce the width of a main bus a little by sending engines instead of extra iron plates...

[Chindraba]

Originally posted by Taehl:

Originally posted by RiO:

On that note: engines themselves could be left off as well. The only mass-produced things that initially needs them are blue science. Later, yellow science will need robot frames - which needs electric engines - which need regular engines as well though. So engines are in a bit of a debatable position. (Personally I just make them on-site twice.)

I've always made engine units on-site, but yeah, that's a fair point.

I wonder: How many belts of iron plates does it take to output a full, double-sided belt of engines? If more than 1, that means you could reduce the width of a main bus a little by sending engines instead of extra iron plates...

I don't know how much iron it would take, and I'm not advocating for or against making the engines as a belt on the bus. There are a couple points to consider, however.

If the engines are going to be on the bus, in an effort to reduce the lanes of iron, they will have to get the iron from someplace other than the bus. Otherwise the lane(s) of iron saved still have to be on the bus in the beginning. Of course the now empty belt of iron could be replaced by a belt of gears, or something else, but you haven't really reduced the width of the bus.

Secondly, how many of the engines on a full belt would really be needed? I've not done the checking, so it might be a non-issue. Still, engines are used in a limited number of places and they are mostly used in a 1 to 1 ratio with what they go into. (Mall items being the exception.) If the factories on the bus consume a full belt of engines, it might be at a scale where the main bus is already getting less efficient than other options anyway.

I do not have the data, and it might be that the differences don't matter. These are just ideas to watch for, and account for, when deciding to use a belt of engines in this way. I suppose it's also pretty much the points needed to be looked at when deciding about anything on the bus.

[Hurkyl]

I would look at it more as a complication thing. Do you find it more convenient to have a half-belt on the bus for shipping around engines, or do you find it more convenient to set up pipe, gear, and engine assemblers where you need engines? Or maybe you find it more convenient to spaghetti a direct line through? That should inform your choice of which solution to use.

[Chindraba]

Complication and convenience are the two main reasons I've never done a main bus.

I've started one a few times, after leaning that they were "the answer" to all the problems. Each time it was simply more convenient, and usually less complicated. to just spaghetti in what I needed, and the space for the bus became a wasteland until I erased the belts and built something useful there.

A plate of fine pasta tastes better than a long stretch of tarmac.

[Hedning]

The point of having engines on their own branch instead of together with blue and yellow science is because you need a lot of engine assemblers. And they are a low throughput item so the branch can just be made longer, which is easier than adding it at the start of a yellow science branch or making a new engine branch just before yellow science. And engines are used by the mall too.

[knighttemplar1960]

My personal preferences are to keep high demand basics on the bus. Copper plate, iron plate, steel, stone, coal, bricks, and circuits. Mid products that are demanded by specific production chains (like iron sticks, copper wire, pipes, and gears) I make locally (or use direct insertion) from basics supplied by the bus. If you keep bus belts in sets of 4 or less with 2-4 tiles between you can use splitters and underground belts to move products from the bus to your various banks of machines.

If you keep pipes off the bus you can use the bus as a highway to drive the car down without worrying about damage. (If you don't mind a couple extra steps you can barrel fluids and use belts to transport the barrels instead of cluttering the bus with pipes).

Low demand or specific demand items like sulfur and plastic can be brought in by train and added to banks of machines where needed from the sides of the bus (including fresh basic products if the supply on the bus starts to get sketchy).

[Fel]

I found the main bus approach to be nice when I was learning about how to design a factory.
Back then it wasn't exactly a wide-spread thing and it was still being figured out in terms of how many belts of items would be nice and such.

These days most people seem to use it wrongly anyway, having barely 1 belt worth of iron plates spread across 8 belts to get the illusion that you have that many and such.

The main bus is a decent approach to learn about how important scaling up is, as it naturally leaves space to increase production of everything.
It is also a relatively stable way of making a starter base for those that want to aim for a mega base after the rocket.
And that's about it really.

[Hedning]

Originally posted by Fel:

The main bus is a decent approach to learn about how important scaling up is, as it naturally leaves space to increase production of everything.

To a point. I saw Nilaus rebuild his green circuits so many times because he couldn't just add more in the same place.

[Fel]

It teaches you how important it is, it doesn't mean it can be used for that purpose when the scales grow far enough.

Green circuits are definitely a good example of the limits the main bus has in the late/end game, giving you a good reason to branch out of the approach and try others that are more suited to large-scale production.
Usually by relying on trains to some extent and often by making good use of small scale logistics network and modules.