Why are they quoting Markus "Notch" Persson on their description?

[Telaso]

They might want to remove that at some point because he made Minecraft afterall...

[GunRunner89X]

Nguyên văn bởi Gambit:

Nguyên văn bởi Telaso:

They might want to remove that at some point after all his hate speech....

How about we are a little more tollerant towards other peoples opinions...

You know... Inclusive you could say

Them lot are only inclusive about things they agree with. So much for being "progressive".

Now that i think about it... it sounds a lot like fascism actually. C'est la vie.

[Hedning]

Nguyên văn bởi PunCrathod:

Even if you do follow celebrity news and social media there is no way to know what they really think. And a lot of the time all the bad things people accuse celebrities of being is just single tweets etc taken out of context and if you start reading through more of that persons tweets etc you quickly notice their stance on the subject is more likely to be the exact opposite of what they are accused of. But since the truth would prevent the hate mob from feeling powerful and furthering their agenda by "canceling" yet another "problematic" person the truth is deliberately ignored.

On the flip side the "its out of context" defense is often used to excuse bad behavior without providing the proper context because there is no other context. In this case here we have an example, because his tweets were not good and his depression and feelings of isolation is not an excuse for lashing out like he did.

[Quillithe]

It seems like there are several questions here:

1, Is it acceptable to criticize Notch for what he's said?

I'm going to go with yes on this (in concept, I don't actually care to look up what it is he's said so this isn't me criticizing him for it).

2. Is it a problem to include Notch's review?

Here I'd go with no. It's worth mentioning that I don't feel this is entirely clearcut under a 'doesn't matter what else the person has said/done' umbrella. But there are two factors.

First - he's a relevant choice of opinion. He's not a completely unrelated figure that people might object to, or a random political figure. He's famous for making a very successful variant on Infiniminer.

Second - I'm probably correct in assuming that the problem is only things he's said, that aren't even necessarily things everyone disagrees with. There's certainly some sort of cutoff here - if Notch goes on a mass shooting or commits genocide, I'd be a bit more uncomfortable with his quote being there even as a relevant person. But if all he's done is said mean or silly things or whatever it is, seems excessive.

[PunCrathod]

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

Nguyên văn bởi PunCrathod:

Even if you do follow celebrity news and social media there is no way to know what they really think. And a lot of the time all the bad things people accuse celebrities of being is just single tweets etc taken out of context and if you start reading through more of that persons tweets etc you quickly notice their stance on the subject is more likely to be the exact opposite of what they are accused of. But since the truth would prevent the hate mob from feeling powerful and furthering their agenda by "canceling" yet another "problematic" person the truth is deliberately ignored.

On the flip side the "its out of context" defense is often used to excuse bad behavior without providing the proper context because there is no other context. In this case here we have an example, because his tweets were not good and his depression and feelings of isolation is not an excuse for lashing out like he did.

Sigh... that "depression and feelings of isolation" is just based on a single out of context tweet and the perrson himself has never said he is depressed or that he feels isolated. And the not good things notch has said do indeed seem bad out of context. But if you include all the other related things notch has done and said as context at worst he is making fun of extremists and at best he misunderstood what a hashtag stood for and apologized for it. Some of it is also clearly just a language&culture barrier that comes from him being swedish. Don't get me wrong. He is often a huge ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but as far as I can tell most if not all of the bad things the woke mob accuse him of is not true.

[knighttemplar1960]

Nguyên văn bởi PunCrathod:

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

On the flip side the "its out of context" defense is often used to excuse bad behavior without providing the proper context because there is no other context. In this case here we have an example, because his tweets were not good and his depression and feelings of isolation is not an excuse for lashing out like he did.

Sigh... that "depression and feelings of isolation" is just based on a single out of context tweet and the perrson himself has never said he is depressed or that he feels isolated. And the not good things notch has said do indeed seem bad out of context. But if you include all the other related things notch has done and said as context at worst he is making fun of extremists and at best he misunderstood what a hashtag stood for and apologized for it. Some of it is also clearly just a language&culture barrier that comes from him being swedish. Don't get me wrong. He is often a huge ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but as far as I can tell most if not all of the bad things the woke mob accuse him of is not true.

Depression and feelings of isolation can cause you to make comments that you would not normally make, particularly if you are on medication for those conditions and stop taking it because you "feel fine."

Oddly enough this is a defense that is only acceptable for one side to use.

[Hedning]

Nguyên văn bởi PunCrathod:

Some of it is also clearly just a language&culture barrier that comes from him being swedish. Don't get me wrong. He is often a huge ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but as far as I can tell most if not all of the bad things the woke mob accuse him of is not true.

If it's out of context give me the context then. I am Swedish. I know that we are pretty good at English and it's not like the culture is so different a Swede would misunderstand. What even are you claiming he misunderstood? Some, or all? It's not like he just posted one bad tweet about one thing.

Also if he was not depressed he has even less of an excuse.

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

Oddly enough this is a defense that is only acceptable for one side to use.

You are deluded. You just throw out the hypocrisy argument as a reflex, not based on anything that has happened.

[knighttemplar1960]

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

Oddly enough this is a defense that is only acceptable for one side to use.

You are deluded. You just throw out the hypocrisy argument as a reflex, not based on anything that has happened.

You made my point for me again. Thanks.

[Hedning]

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

You made my point for me again. Thanks.

What point? You have made no points, just thrown out baseless accusations. How about you at least try to bring som substance, or are you afraid of doing that because you would realize you have nothing?

[Lyra]

Nguyên văn bởi PunCrathod:

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

On the flip side the "its out of context" defense is often used to excuse bad behavior without providing the proper context because there is no other context. In this case here we have an example, because his tweets were not good and his depression and feelings of isolation is not an excuse for lashing out like he did.

Sigh... that "depression and feelings of isolation" is just based on a single out of context tweet and the perrson himself has never said he is depressed or that he feels isolated. And the not good things notch has said do indeed seem bad out of context. But if you include all the other related things notch has done and said as context at worst he is making fun of extremists and at best he misunderstood what a hashtag stood for and apologized for it. Some of it is also clearly just a language&culture barrier that comes from him being swedish. Don't get me wrong. He is often a huge ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but as far as I can tell most if not all of the bad things the woke mob accuse him of is not true.

I don't think that saying that the Qanon movement is right is something that would come from a language barrier or misunderstood hashtag, and I've not seen a quote from him that would indicate that was meant to be making fun of them, though if there is one I'd be interested in seeing that. I've looked into some of it before and not found anything on that, so I really would be interested. I feel similarly about his comments about Jewish and transgender people. There might be more things he was controversial for making comments on, but I'm not aware of them.

Also, for everyone in the thread saying things like "so much for the progressive / inclusive / tolerant left, this is the real fascism," grow up. Any movement of inclusivity needs to actively work against and push out groups that are explicitly exclusionary / hateful. While this makes the group itself also exclusionary to a degree, it's the only way to not make it push out inclusive ideologies. For example, if a group does not exclude a group of violent and vocal homophobes, then it becomes exclusionary of gay people by the existence and support for the homophobic group. If it is exclusionary of such violent and exclusionary groups, then it becomes more inclusive.

[knighttemplar1960]

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

You made my point for me again. Thanks.

What point? You have made no points, just thrown out baseless accusations. How about you at least try to bring som substance, or are you afraid of doing that because you would realize you have nothing?

The point that people with your political view immediately resort to calling names and being rude to anyone that does not share your point of view. You've given proof once again that people with your view point lack tolerance and manners. Is that a you thing or Sweeden thing?

Nguyên văn bởi Lyra:

Also, for everyone in the thread saying things like "so much for the progressive / inclusive / tolerant left, this is the real fascism," grow up. Any movement of inclusivity needs to actively work against and push out groups that are explicitly exclusionary / hateful. While this makes the group itself also exclusionary to a degree, it's the only way to not make it push out inclusive ideologies. For example, if a group does not exclude a group of violent and vocal homophobes, then it becomes exclusionary of gay people by the existence and support for the homophobic group. If it is exclusionary of such violent and exclusionary groups, then it becomes more inclusive.

So fighting hate by using hate is sanctioned if the hate is from the "prgressive" side? That doesn't sound very progressive to me. It sounds like a certain country in the 1930s making excuses for their bad behavior that everyone bought until it was too late. Its people that fail to read history that need to grow up. The reason that history repeats is because people fail to learn from past mistakes.

[Hedning]

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

What point? You have made no points, just thrown out baseless accusations. How about you at least try to bring som substance, or are you afraid of doing that because you would realize you have nothing?

The point that people with your political view immediately resort to calling names and being rude to anyone that does not share your point of view. You've given proof once again that people with your view point lack tolerance and manners. Is that a you thing or Sweeden thing?

If you want to discuss substance I am perfectly willing. If you are just reflexively going to call hypocrisy then I'm going to call you out on it. If you take that as hostility that's a you problem. If you feel that "your side" is often treated that way then that may be an indication that your side rarely have any substance to discuss. Again that's not my fault.

[Hedning]

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

So fighting hate by using hate is sanctioned if the hate is from the "prgressive" side? That doesn't sound very progressive to me. It sounds like a certain country in the 1930s making excuses for their bad behavior that everyone bought until it was too late. Its people that fail to read history that need to grow up. The reason that history repeats is because people fail to learn from past mistakes.

You should read up on "the paradox of tolerance". You cannot tolerate the intolerant.

To oversimplify you cannot tolerate someone calling for you to be killed, because then you will be dead. It's not hypocrisy nor a double standard. It's simply a case of nothing being an absolute.

[Lyra]

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

Nguyên văn bởi Lyra:

Also, for everyone in the thread saying things like "so much for the progressive / inclusive / tolerant left, this is the real fascism," grow up. Any movement of inclusivity needs to actively work against and push out groups that are explicitly exclusionary / hateful. While this makes the group itself also exclusionary to a degree, it's the only way to not make it push out inclusive ideologies. For example, if a group does not exclude a group of violent and vocal homophobes, then it becomes exclusionary of gay people by the existence and support for the homophobic group. If it is exclusionary of such violent and exclusionary groups, then it becomes more inclusive.

So fighting hate by using hate is sanctioned if the hate is from the "prgressive" side? That doesn't sound very progressive to me. It sounds like a certain country in the 1930s making excuses for their bad behavior that everyone bought until it was too late. Its people that fail to read history that need to grow up. The reason that history repeats is because people fail to learn from past mistakes.

Immediately going to "actually you're really just nazis," huh? Don't know what I expected, really. There isn't really a middle ground between people who think LGBTQ+ people, people of specific ethnicities, etc. are inherently bad, "degenerate," immoral, etc. and people who think they're fine and have the right to exist. The point of view that they're fine is not one I would consider hateful, and the point of view that some people are inherently "degenerate" and as such are a negative for society is one I would consider hateful. Nazi ideology was based around the elimination of such "degenerate" elements. Inclusivity is based around the acceptance of those without an ideology of hatred. Note how one of these is against people for who they are, and one of these is against people for their ideologies about other people.

[Quillithe]

Nguyên văn bởi knighttemplar1960:

Nguyên văn bởi Hedning:

What point? You have made no points, just thrown out baseless accusations. How about you at least try to bring som substance, or are you afraid of doing that because you would realize you have nothing?

The point that people with your political view immediately resort to calling names and being rude to anyone that does not share your point of view. You've given proof once again that people with your view point lack tolerance and manners. Is that a you thing or Sweeden thing?

Hey now, name calling and rudeness are politically equal opportunity. Part of any particular group will be jerks, and it's easier to define groups one doesn't belong to by their worst outliers while recognizing the worst outliers in your own group don't define it.

[krbbypatty MEgaMunch u l t ra]

Eh, I don't agree with a lot of stuff he says either, but he probably has a trustable take on video games.