How to automatically launch with a variety of items

[Landlocked]

Am I missing something? I can't figure out how to launch with multiple kinds of items in a rocket. I have a Gleba-Nauvis express and I'd like it to automatically ship Ag science and bioflux every time I get a rocketful.

[kremlin]

Output your Ag science and bioflux into passive provider chests, with a roboport with a couple hundred logistics bots. If your space platform is requesting ag science and bioflux it will automatically do full launches of each as those chests get filled with enough to load a rocket. Unfortunately, there's no way to mix automatic loads, the closest thing you can do is set the custom load size to how short you want the rocket load to be.

[Khagan]

AFAIK automatic launches are for homogeneous loads only. You can reduce the rocket load size if you are really in a hurry.

[Chindraba]

You are 'missing' nothing. Mixed load rockets are only manually launched. You'll have to make it a rocket-full of each to go automatic. As mentioned by @Khagan above, you can set a non-full load size for specific items on a silo's GUI. Basically it makes 30, or whatever number you pick, act like a "full" rocket and launches it. You will still need two rockets launched, however, as it is still a single type of item per rocket on automatic.

[bioseb31]

Would it be possible by reading the silo logistic request, and using that signal to filter inserter from a chest beside the silo, thus filling the cargo only with required amount, then using a signal to launche the rocket?

[kremlin]

Originally posted by bioseb31:

Would it be possible by reading the silo logistic request, and using that signal to filter inserter from a chest beside the silo, thus filling the cargo only with required amount, then using a signal to launche the rocket?

The silo acts like a requester chest for the materials it's trying to send up. It won't let you manually load while the silo is set to do automatic fulfillment. You can also have multiple launchpads so you can have one for manual loads separate from the automated one...

[Esxhaton]

I have noticed that a silo not set to automatic, if loaded with item requested by a platform will auto-launch.
I am not sure if this would also work for mixed cargos, but you can try to have the silo be loaded by inserters according to some circuit logic (as someone already mentioned) and if the platform requests the correct mix of items it may auto launch.
But I have not clue whether this works or not, as I am just speculating.

[Landlocked]

Originally posted by Esxhaton:

I have noticed that a silo not set to automatic, if loaded with item requested by a platform will auto-launch.
I am not sure if this would also work for mixed cargos, but you can try to have the silo be loaded by inserters according to some circuit logic (as someone already mentioned) and if the platform requests the correct mix of items it may auto launch.
But I have not clue whether this works or not, as I am just speculating.

If I request less than a full load of something, it will not launch. If I call for a short load of something, it will launch the rocket with that request and leave the remaining items behind in the launch pad. XP

[Esxhaton]

Originally posted by Landlocked:

Originally posted by Esxhaton:

I have noticed that a silo not set to automatic, if loaded with item requested by a platform will auto-launch.
I am not sure if this would also work for mixed cargos, but you can try to have the silo be loaded by inserters according to some circuit logic (as someone already mentioned) and if the platform requests the correct mix of items it may auto launch.
But I have not clue whether this works or not, as I am just speculating.

If I request less than a full load of something, it will not launch. If I call for a short load of something, it will launch the rocket with that request and leave the remaining items behind in the launch pad. XP

Optimising mixed items launches seems like to be reducible to the knapsack problem, a know NP-complete problem (I don’t remember if the devs actually mentioned this in one of their FFFs), and for this reason they have probably decided to left this possible feature out, as it can easily lead to performance issues. Maybe with some huge simplification this can be introduced but it is unsure how practical the simplified version would be

[Hurkyl]

Originally posted by Esxhaton:

Originally posted by Landlocked:

If I request less than a full load of something, it will not launch. If I call for a short load of something, it will launch the rocket with that request and leave the remaining items behind in the launch pad. XP

Optimising mixed items launches seems like to be reducible to the knapsack problem, a know NP-complete problem (I don’t remember if the devs actually mentioned this in one of their FFFs), and for this reason they have probably decided to left this possible feature out,

Knapsack problems -- especially real world ones -- are often easy.

For example, if you have a bunch of coins and you need to give someone exact change? That's a knapsack problem that usually has a very easy solution: keep giving them the biggest coin you can.

With U.S. currency, I think the only way this can go wrong is if you have dimes (10) and quarters (25) don't have any nickels (5) or enough pennies (1) and need to give someone 30 cents, and similar situations.

(this is called the "greedy" solution, since it operates by optimistically making each decision the choice that makes the most immediate progress)

And even when a knapsack problem is hard to solve perfectly, it can still be fairly easy to come very close to the optimal packing.

Rocket loading in Factorio, from what I've seen, is almost entirely of this super-easy variety. I've actually implemented it in-game with combinators.

[Esxhaton]

Originally posted by Hurkyl:

Originally posted by Esxhaton:

Optimising mixed items launches seems like to be reducible to the knapsack problem, a know NP-complete problem (I don’t remember if the devs actually mentioned this in one of their FFFs), and for this reason they have probably decided to left this possible feature out,

Knapsack problems -- especially real world ones -- are often easy.

For example, if you have a bunch of coins and you need to give exact change? That's a knapsack problem with a very easy solution: keep giving them the biggest coin you can.

Rocket loading in Factorio, from what I've seen, is almost entirely of this super-easy variety.

Given enough constraints a knapsack problem can definitely fall within computationally acceptable boundaries (P for those who know), and the coins example you mentioned is one of those. However rocket loading in factorio is not necessarily that easy as the “value” of an item is not necessarily equivalent to its “rocket space”.

[Hurkyl]

Originally posted by Esxhaton:

Originally posted by Hurkyl:

Knapsack problems -- especially real world ones -- are often easy.

For example, if you have a bunch of coins and you need to give exact change? That's a knapsack problem with a very easy solution: keep giving them the biggest coin you can.

Rocket loading in Factorio, from what I've seen, is almost entirely of this super-easy variety.

Given enough constraints a knapsack problem can definitely fall within computationally acceptable boundaries (P for those who know), and the coins example you mentioned is one of those. However rocket loading in factorio is not necessarily that easy as the “value” of an item is not necessarily equivalent to its “rocket space”.

The selector combinator lets you read the "rocket stack size" of each signal. And can also be used to pick the signal with the smallest stack size.

It's "easy" because the "rocket space" of the items seem to have particularly simple relations to one another, much like coins do.

[Esxhaton]

Originally posted by Hurkyl:

Originally posted by Esxhaton:

Given enough constraints a knapsack problem can definitely fall within computationally acceptable boundaries (P for those who know), and the coins example you mentioned is one of those. However rocket loading in factorio is not necessarily that easy as the “value” of an item is not necessarily equivalent to its “rocket space”.

The selector combinator lets you determine its "rocket space".

Not really. Maybe I should have used “weight of an item” instead of rocket space. And you don’t have to determine that, it is a given constant.

[Fishy]

If you build the rocket after it is loaded, it will auto launch the pre-loaded content one item type at a time in separate rockets even if the item does not fill the rocket. You must set the minimum per-rocket to a low ball amount from the space platform request.

[Aestrea]

This is only really a problem early on or if you are building a new platform.

Once you have a platform regularly visiting each planet with various cargo to deliver like green belts/big drills/ various turrets to landing pad to keep it stocked, it works just fine.

Just keep in mind how many launches it would take for the platform to restock and even then, if it's just circling the the first 3-4 planets, it doesn't have to wait until fully restocked.

It will get the job done eventually. Just make sure you have more than 1 rocket silo on each planet that resupplies the platform.

[Hurkyl]

And to a lesser extent, it's just small platforms. When you start making large ones, you don't mind so much having a whole rocket's worth of building materials handy for repairs/redesigns/expansions.