Is it worth making quality science packs?

[Reflex18]

Quality on science packs only serve to increase the output of the pack. So it appears that it might be rather useless to use quality compared to just using as much productivity as you can.

[Ccrack]

do labs require all quality packs to work or can they be mixed?

pretty sure the quality module would be putting out quality packs more often than a productivity would produce an extra. so if labs can used mixed quality packs then using those makes sense

[Reflex18]

Originally posted by Ccrack:

do labs require all quality packs to work or can they be mixed?

pretty sure the quality module would be putting out quality packs more often than a productivity would produce an extra. so if labs can used mixed quality packs then using those makes sense

Yes labs can use mixed quality but dealing with quality does mean that it takes more effort with filters.

[jagholin]

making quality science pack is a way to get to ridiculously high SPM.

something that can be a goal in the end-game

[Khagan]

Originally posted by Ccrack:

pretty sure the quality module would be putting out quality packs more often than a productivity would produce an extra.

Not to begin with. For the same tier and quality productivity produces about 2.5 times the gain that quality does. And you need fewer assemblers and modules to do it, since you can use speed beacons.

Only if you have researched a very high level of research productivity would the balance of advantage shift to quality.

[Simon]

Uncommon science packs (lowest quality) has twice the duration of normal packs, which is a lot even when you consider the productivity loss. The only problem you'll face is UPS from having so many machines, because you can't utilize speed modules in beacons. It's worth it in a normal game, but probably not for megabasing.

[Scipione]

i'm not too great of a fan of that, i mean yeah everything has its argument, but if you begin quality mixing your science packs, you have a hard time balancing you labs.

i mean you either could balance your labs, based on common packs and just be "happy" if there are higher tiers, but that just means science backs up
but if you balance it on a higher consumption rate, you could run dry

(Also there is the hassle of automated quality science shipping between planets)

[Fel]

Each level of quality adds 100% to the durability, meaning that uncommon packs are twice as potent.

A quality module 3 (without quality on them) would add 2.5% and decrease speed by 5%
A productivity module 3 would add 10% productivity and decrease the speed by 15%.

What that means is that with 1,000,000 times the time it would take to craft without modules, a productivity module 3 would bring down the number of crafting cycles to 850,000 but get an extra "free" 85,000 for a total of 935,000 science packs.

Similarly, the quality module 3 would get 950,000 crafting cycles (so already more than the productivity module's total), with 21,375 being uncommon, 2,137 rare , 214 epic and 21 legendary (rounded numbers of course).
Applying the bonus from quality, you would get 976374 packs worth of research (about 2.776% "free" compared to the resources spent).

Both end up being worse than the "no module" number in terms of total production, the productivity gets the least but also at the least cost and quality is closer to no modules while also saving some materials.

Quality modules have the advantage when used on their own, but productivity modules can be paired with speed modules later on as well.


So the final take is that if resource cost is not a big deal for you, no modules (or speed modules) have the advantage, quality modules get you more than productivity modules but less "free" ones.

[Khaylain]

Originally posted by - EMPTY -:

Its the path you need to take if you want to achieve 1M spm without too much CPU cost

Going by the calculations by Fel above the best way to limit CPU cost for science pack production would be productivity modules in the assembler with beacons filled with speed modules around it, not quality modules.

A lot of speed beacons allows a single assembly machine to do the work of several assembly machines, but they're incompatible with quality modules. So to get the same SPM with quality modules requires a lot more assembly machines (and also more resources, thus more machines providing those resources) than having science using productivity and speed beacons.

[Halliwax]

I only did it on Aquillo because my production rates were poor and it was a way to squeeze a little more science out of limited resources and limited power. But if you're expanding your factory to get more science, I'm doubtful that quality science packs are ever advantageous over increased throughput.

[Simon]

I believe the question was whether it's worth it for the material input, and not whether it's good for UPS, because for UPS, speed modules are the obvious choice, and quality doesn't allow speed.

[Aestrea]

The problem with the space variety is that you can't request both the normal and the quality items of the same type on the landing pad. So it might be not worth it in the long run because you would manually have to change it every single time for each tier of quality.

[Scipione]

Originally posted by Aestrea:

The problem with the space variety is that you can't request both the normal and the quality items of the same type on the landing pad. So it might be not worth it in the long run because you would manually have to change it every single time for each tier of quality.

thats just not correct, ofcourse you can request all qualities (needs a request for each quality),

problem is more the automatic loading of science packs from other planets

[Hurkyl]

One situation to consider quality for is when you have quality ingredients. For example, you can't use productivity modules to boost production of Productivity Modules, Electric Furnaces, and Rails... but you can use quality instead. And you could filter out the higher quality products for the purpose of making higher quality Production Science Packs.

However, my impression is that these materials would be better used elsewhere -- either directly (smelt with the furnaces!), indirectly (productivity modules as ingredients to higher tiers) or sending them to quality recyclers to increase production of higher quality source materials.

[Vigilante]

Quality also makes they spoil slower for the biological ones so maybe worth for those over productivity +beacons

[god bless you]

You can except 0.9*1 + 0.1*2 durability output with 10% quality modules.
Then multiply by 0.8 is the production rate, 0.88 output per cycle.
But quality is a probability problem, not guaranteed.
IMO, it is not a good way.