Steel Furnaces Pointless - Dev's Please Fix

[Cavalier Roy]

I have always seen the steel furnaces as a waste of material, its easy enough to research and advanced material processing 2 and go from stone to electric furnaces without ever building a single steel furnace. If for example the steel furnaces was used as part of the recipe for electric furnaces then i would happily hold off pushing to elecric and build them but for now i see the steel furnaces as pointless and a total waste of material.

[Hielor]

It's also worth noting that the electric furnaces actually consume 2x the coal as steel furnaces if you're still on steam power (boilers are only 50% efficient).

[Xuhybrid]

Upgrading to steel furnace is easy to do early on and for 2x boost in speed, you'd be stupid not to. This changes if u have oil in a safe/close location. Researching oil etc takes a bit though so staying on stone furnaces for that long isn't advisable.

[ravage_mk2]

If I recall correctly, both there should be 2 sets of mods, one called Dystech and the other "Bob's X" set, that should have some uses for Steel Furnaces (and quite a bit of other stuff, to put it mildly)

Granted, mods mght not be the solution you were looking for. Just mentioning the option.

I too would have found it a bit more logical if the 3 furnace types were a chain, but I don't mind the current situation either.

[NimrodAbsolution⁧⁧98]

Xuhybrid eredeti hozzászólása:

Upgrading to steel furnace is easy to do early on and for 2x boost in speed, you'd be stupid not to. This changes if u have oil in a safe/close location. Researching oil etc takes a bit though so staying on stone furnaces for that long isn't advisable.

Steel does not have a 2x boost over electric
In fact, electric is faster, and he says he upgrades to it.

[T-Bone Biggins]

Tacomancer eredeti hozzászólása:

Xuhybrid eredeti hozzászólása:

Upgrading to steel furnace is easy to do early on and for 2x boost in speed, you'd be stupid not to. This changes if u have oil in a safe/close location. Researching oil etc takes a bit though so staying on stone furnaces for that long isn't advisable.

Steel does not have a 2x boost over electric
In fact, electric is faster, and he says he upgrades to it.

Steel has a 2x boost over stone he meant. Electric is only faster when you upgrade that with modules.

[Horoai]

The_Mell eredeti hozzászólása:

You fix bugs - game design and balance are changed or improved.
First one is an objective thing because an error is something 'hard' and nothing to discuss about.
Second one is subjective because it's something 'soft' and more about likes&dislikes and an idea about how the game should feel.

Someone dislikes steel furnaces and would prefer not to waste the resources put into those by recycling them - that's fine. You've got the right to have an opinion.
But demanding a fix...really..? :KOh:


I'm on my 2nd playthrough and hunting down quite some achievements with it. Lots of coal available, base powered by only 20 steam engines and not a single electric furnace.
So what's the point of them?
Devs fix electric furnaces..? :TOwrench:

There are tried and tested objective concerns about design and balance too. However, I agree that this (OP) is not one of them or at least failed to be argued as such.

Steel furnaces seem pretty decent to me just by their reduced cost and the abundance of coal in late game alone.
Then I again, I have always wondered the math behind coal invested into steel furnaces vs coal invested into steam engines to feed elect. furnaces.
Also, I'm curious how long the extra coal investment of efficiency cards (plastic) takes to pay off.

An answer to both these questions would probably shed some light on whether steel furnaces are "worth it" or not.

[Timi]

Yggdrasil eredeti hozzászólása:

Steel furnaces seem pretty decent to me just by their reduced cost and the abundance of coal in late game alone.
Then I again, I have always wondered the math behind coal invested into steel furnaces vs coal invested into steam engines to feed elect. furnaces.
Also, I'm curious how long the extra coal investment of efficiency cards (plastic) takes to pay off.

An answer to both these questions would probably shed some light on whether steel furnaces are "worth it" or not.

Boilers are "half efficient" when burning fuels and converting it to electricity.

It's pretty easy to test; take one offshore pump, boiler, steam engine, a power pole and an electric furnace. Fill it with 50 iron ore, and put one coal in.

Do the same for steel furnace, and maybe with a pair of eff modules.

With one coal used:
Steel furnace: 25 (+1/3rd) iron plates smelted
Electric furnace: 12 (+1/3rd) iron plates smelted
Electric furnace w/ 2x Effiency module Mk2s: 59 (+½) iron plates

Purely on fuel, Steel furnaces are worth more if you are running on steam engines and no modules. You'd need a pair of efficiency module mk1s in the electric furnace to beat steel furnace in fuel consumption.

[Mazian]

Timi eredeti hozzászólása:

Purely on fuel, Steel furnaces are worth more if you are running on steam engines and no modules. You'd need a pair of efficiency module mk1s in the electric furnace to beat steel furnace in fuel consumption.

I like these kinds of observations. I learn something from them. Learning is good.

[Xuhybrid]

Timi eredeti hozzászólása:

Boilers are "half efficient" when burning fuels and converting it to electricity.

It's pretty easy to test; take one offshore pump, boiler, steam engine, a power pole and an electric furnace. Fill it with 50 iron ore, and put one coal in.

Do the same for steel furnace, and maybe with a pair of eff modules.

With one coal used:
Steel furnace: 25 (+1/3rd) iron plates smelted
Electric furnace: 12 (+1/3rd) iron plates smelted
Electric furnace w/ 2x Effiency module Mk2s: 59 (+½) iron plates

Purely on fuel, Steel furnaces are worth more if you are running on steam engines and no modules. You'd need a pair of efficiency module mk1s in the electric furnace to beat steel furnace in fuel consumption.

Just to support your research. In my experience i start reaching the 10 MJ usage from 20 Steam Engines, right as i start getting Red circuits. After upgrading to electric furnaces and creating efficiency modules for all my machines, my usage drops to 5 MJ.

I haven't done any hard research but this is my experience, identical from 3 different maps.

[Kitsunerune]

dont steel and stone furnaces burn coal at the same rate? or does the double crafting speed of the steel also drain more from the coal? if so, then the steel are an effiency upgrade for the stone to speed up production while you get to the framework for electric to me.

[Cavalier Roy]

Ok so i started 2 new game saves. The first was with my typical setup of small but efficient for what i needed and the second was using the main bus system and in my small style factory everything would run fine without needing to upgrade to steel furnaces. In the large factory with the main bus i had to upgrade to steel furnaces to keep up with the plate production. In both games i have rushed to electric furnaces but have not built any, because i haven't got the ability to make modules so electric furnaces would be pointless to build at the moment and tbh i'm not in a rush to get the modules automated.

I do still feel the steel furnaces should be used in the crafting recipe for electric ones but they are a much needed upgrade for medium to large factories.

[NimrodAbsolution⁧⁧98]

Kitsunerune eredeti hozzászólása:

dont steel and stone furnaces burn coal at the same rate? or does the double crafting speed of the steel also drain more from the coal? if so, then the steel are an effiency upgrade for the stone to speed up production while you get to the framework for electric to me.

Double speed but same coal consumption rate
So it burns 2x ore