No word about 60fps and arbitrary resolutions?

[Kain]

All screenshots on steam page also in 720p. Sounds troubling.

[Dick Justice]

A quick tip to make the game run more smoothly at 30fps: Use Nvidia Control Panel to set the vsync to half-refresh adaptive, set the in-game framerate to 31fps via the .ini file, and use Rivatuner to limit the framerate to 31fps. Doing this resulted in much less stuttery performance, and far less screen tearing than I would get if I just halved the refresh rate.

[Revan1er]

Your tip will never change the fact that the screen becomes blurry has hell when you move the camera.

30 fps is a nightmare and should be forbidden! (well I am may be a little too excessive)
Even if you try to move the camera slowly the background becomes so blurry... and when you change the frame-rate in the .ini file (60 or 120) the game becomes so smooth but you can't touch the ennemy... Is it really impossible to fix this?

[thebard88]

Originally posted by Revan1er:

Your tip will never change the fact that the screen becomes blurry has hell when you move the camera.

30 fps is a nightmare and should be forbidden! (well I am may be a little too excessive)
Even if you try to move the camera slowly the background becomes so blurry... and when you change the frame-rate in the .ini file (60 or 120) the game becomes so smooth but you can't touch the ennemy... Is it really impossible to fix this?

As explained before, the game's physics is tied to the framerate.

[Dick Justice]

Originally posted by Revan1er:

Your tip will never change the fact that the screen becomes blurry has hell when you move the camera.

30 fps is a nightmare and should be forbidden! (well I am may be a little too excessive)
Even if you try to move the camera slowly the background becomes so blurry... and when you change the frame-rate in the .ini file (60 or 120) the game becomes so smooth but you can't touch the ennemy... Is it really impossible to fix this?

My tip is there to improve performance at 30fps. It's a known problem that 30fps on PC is generally worse than 30fps on consoles.

Blur can be mitigated via downsampling. I'm using DSR to downsample from 4K to 1080p, and it helps a ridiculous amount with image quality. And because the game is capped at 30fps, performance loss isn't really an issue.

60fps issues can't be fixed because as has been explained constantly, the WOTS games, like a lot of Japanese console games, have their game physics tied to the framerate. Supposedly it makes things simpler when you're targeting 30fps on console. That's why 60fps results in broken hitboxes and animation problems.

[Revan1er]

Originally posted by ♥♥♥♥ Justice:

Originally posted by Revan1er:

Your tip will never change the fact that the screen becomes blurry has hell when you move the camera.

30 fps is a nightmare and should be forbidden! (well I am may be a little too excessive)
Even if you try to move the camera slowly the background becomes so blurry... and when you change the frame-rate in the .ini file (60 or 120) the game becomes so smooth but you can't touch the ennemy... Is it really impossible to fix this?

My tip is there to improve performance at 30fps. It's a known problem that 30fps on PC is generally worse than 30fps on consoles.

Blur can be mitigated via downsampling. I'm using DSR to downsample from 4K to 1080p, and it helps a ridiculous amount with image quality. And because the game is capped at 30fps, performance loss isn't really an issue.

60fps issues can't be fixed because as has been explained constantly, the WOTS games, like a lot of Japanese console games, have their game physics tied to the framerate. Supposedly it makes things simpler when you're targeting 30fps on console. That's why 60fps results in broken hitboxes and animation problems.

There is no difference between 30fps on console and PC. Why 30fps on console look better is because dev add some motion blur to create an artificial sensation of smooth. Unfortunately this technology makes the picture blurry during movement and honestly I feel it disgusting.
As you can see I am not talking about a blurry picture because of an adequate resolution.

And I hope you can understand one thing:

IF the entire game was tied with the frame-rate, the game will speed up if the frame-rate increase (like toukiden kiwami). Here it is not the case. What is happening here? The game becomes smoother when the frame-rate increase BUT the hitbox of the npc becomes buggy. Is it really impossible to fix it? Or the dev are just too lazy and don't want to spend money to fix it?

Sorry but I can't believe the word of random guy. I already red so lot's of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ like

-30 fps makes the game more cinematic
-eyes can see above 30 fps
-30fps is tied with the engine and can't be fixed (hello Tales of Zestria, Demon Soul, Final Fantasy Type 0...)

[Dick Justice]

Originally posted by Revan1er:

Originally posted by ♥♥♥♥ Justice:

My tip is there to improve performance at 30fps. It's a known problem that 30fps on PC is generally worse than 30fps on consoles.

Blur can be mitigated via downsampling. I'm using DSR to downsample from 4K to 1080p, and it helps a ridiculous amount with image quality. And because the game is capped at 30fps, performance loss isn't really an issue.

60fps issues can't be fixed because as has been explained constantly, the WOTS games, like a lot of Japanese console games, have their game physics tied to the framerate. Supposedly it makes things simpler when you're targeting 30fps on console. That's why 60fps results in broken hitboxes and animation problems.

There is no difference between 30fps on console and PC. Why 30fps on console look better is because dev add some motion blur to create an artificial sensation of smooth. Unfortunately this technology makes the picture blurry during movement and honestly I feel it disgusting.
As you can see I am not talking about a blurry picture because of an adequate resolution.

And I hope you can understand one thing:

IF the entire game was tied with the frame-rate, the game will speed up if the frame-rate increase (like toukiden kiwami). Here it is not the case. What is happening here? The game becomes smoother when the frame-rate increase BUT the hitbox of the npc becomes buggy. Is it really impossible to fix it? Or the dev are just too lazy and don't want to spend money to fix it?

Sorry but I can't believe the word of random guy. I already red so lot's of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ like

-30 fps makes the game more cinematic
-eyes can see above 30 fps
-30fps is tied with the engine and can't be fixed (hello Tales of Zestria, Demon Soul, Final Fantasy Type 0...)

Yeah, motion blur is absolutely the issue. That's why games on PC still look crap at 30fps even when motion blur is used, right? Stating that there's no difference between consoles and PC when it comes to 30fps is utterly uninformed. Check this thread out - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1061621

As I said, half-refresh rate vsync is needed to get the game looking better at 30fps on PC. I don't really give a damn if you believe me or not. I posted a tip to make the game perform better with its framerate cap. If you just want to whine and complain about 30fps, talk to someone else.

Oh, and the "lazy devs" argument is really played out. Most people who bring that up generally have no clue whatsoever as to the realities of developing games. Concepts like "budgets" and "deadlines". Saying "lazy devs" is a lazy argument itself.

I don't recall bringing up "cinematic" or "not seeing 30fps". Nice attempt at a strawman argument.

Demon's Souls wasn't released on PC. If you're referring to Dark Souls, it has some bugs at 60fps. Also yes, hello Final Fantasy Type 0, which is still locked at 30fps. Great example, Sherlock. Zestiria is the exception to the rule. 30fps being tied to the engine is an actual thing, regardless of how ignorant you want to be.

[Revan1er]

Originally posted by ♥♥♥♥ Justice:

Originally posted by Revan1er:

There is no difference between 30fps on console and PC. Why 30fps on console look better is because dev add some motion blur to create an artificial sensation of smooth. Unfortunately this technology makes the picture blurry during movement and honestly I feel it disgusting.
As you can see I am not talking about a blurry picture because of an adequate resolution.

And I hope you can understand one thing:

IF the entire game was tied with the frame-rate, the game will speed up if the frame-rate increase (like toukiden kiwami). Here it is not the case. What is happening here? The game becomes smoother when the frame-rate increase BUT the hitbox of the npc becomes buggy. Is it really impossible to fix it? Or the dev are just too lazy and don't want to spend money to fix it?

Sorry but I can't believe the word of random guy. I already red so lot's of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ like

-30 fps makes the game more cinematic
-eyes can see above 30 fps
-30fps is tied with the engine and can't be fixed (hello Tales of Zestria, Demon Soul, Final Fantasy Type 0...)

Yeah, motion blur is absolutely the issue. That's why games on PC still look crap at 30fps even when motion blur is used, right? Stating that there's no difference between consoles and PC when it comes to 30fps is utterly uninformed. Check this thread out - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1061621

As I said, half-refresh rate vsync is needed to get the game looking better at 30fps on PC. I don't really give a damn if you believe me or not. I posted a tip to make the game perform better with its framerate cap. If you just want to whine and complain about 30fps, talk to someone else.

Oh, and the "lazy devs" argument is really played out. Most people who bring that up generally have no clue whatsoever as to the realities of developing games. Concepts like "budgets" and "deadlines". Saying "lazy devs" is a lazy argument itself.

I don't recall bringing up "cinematic" or "not seeing 30fps". Nice attempt at a strawman argument.

Demon's Souls wasn't released on PC. If you're referring to Dark Souls, it has some bugs at 60fps. Also yes, hello Final Fantasy Type 0, which is still locked at 30fps. Great example, Sherlock. Zestiria is the exception to the rule. 30fps being tied to the engine is an actual thing, regardless of how ignorant you want to be.

FF Type 0 was limited at 30 fps on psp and the limit was removed with a hack and you can play it at 60 fps on emulator or hacked psp (good point Sherlock, I didn't mention the HD version because they blocked it intentionally or not during the port)
Google it if you don't trust me!

Dark soul (yeah my bad): some bugs but fixed in majority with the help of the community and totally fixed by dev for Dark soul 2 (same engine!!!). And I can give you a lot of others example.

Now the real point:
Dev can fixed a broken engine but like you said, it needs some times AND money. And I am sure it is the case here. They didn't want to spent too lots of money and time for a port wich will not sell a lot. I know this.

For my other arguments I didn't directed them to you but to the marketing people who love saying these kinds of things. Are you one of them?
I said it because the guy from Ghostlight told us, frame-rate is tied so unfixable... And my point is: is it true or they just don't want to spend time\money to fix it?

By the way, I can't find any proof of your your statement. I only see graph from PC version of The witcher 3 and just "games look smoother on console"... Do you have a better link? Real study of why console games look smoother than pc?

[Dick Justice]

Originally posted by Revan1er:

Originally posted by ♥♥♥♥ Justice:

Yeah, motion blur is absolutely the issue. That's why games on PC still look crap at 30fps even when motion blur is used, right? Stating that there's no difference between consoles and PC when it comes to 30fps is utterly uninformed. Check this thread out - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1061621

As I said, half-refresh rate vsync is needed to get the game looking better at 30fps on PC. I don't really give a damn if you believe me or not. I posted a tip to make the game perform better with its framerate cap. If you just want to whine and complain about 30fps, talk to someone else.

Oh, and the "lazy devs" argument is really played out. Most people who bring that up generally have no clue whatsoever as to the realities of developing games. Concepts like "budgets" and "deadlines". Saying "lazy devs" is a lazy argument itself.

I don't recall bringing up "cinematic" or "not seeing 30fps". Nice attempt at a strawman argument.

Demon's Souls wasn't released on PC. If you're referring to Dark Souls, it has some bugs at 60fps. Also yes, hello Final Fantasy Type 0, which is still locked at 30fps. Great example, Sherlock. Zestiria is the exception to the rule. 30fps being tied to the engine is an actual thing, regardless of how ignorant you want to be.

FF Type 0 was limited at 30 fps on psp and the limit was removed with a hack and you can play it at 60 fps on emulator or hacked psp (good point Sherlock, I didn't mention the HD version because they blocked it intentionally or not during the port)
Google it if you don't trust me!

Dark soul (yeah my bad): some bugs but fixed in majority with the help of the community and totally fixed by dev for Dark soul 2 (same engine!!!). And I can give you a lot of others example.

Now the real point:
Dev can fixed a broken engine but like you said, it needs some times AND money. And I am sure it is the case here. They didn't want to spent too lots of money and time for a port wich will not sell a lot. I know this.

For my other arguments I didn't directed them to you but to the marketing people who love saying these kinds of things. Are you one of them?
I said it because the guy from Ghostlight told us, frame-rate is tied so unfixable... And my point is: is it true or they just don't want to spend time\money to fix it?

By the way, I can't find any proof of your your statement. I only see graph from PC version of The witcher 3 and just "games look smoother on console"... Do you have a better link? Real study of why console games look smoother than pc?

From what I've googled, the frame counter shows 60fps for Type 0, but the actual motion is still 30fps. Great example again, Sherlock.

Dark Souls 2 wasn't a late port. They planned the PC version beforehand this time. And even then, it still had the durability bug.

Ghostlight is a small company. So don't count on them going above and beyond in the porting process. If you weren't addressing me with the other arguments, why bring them up when quoting me?

Take your own advice and google the 30fps on PC issue. It's a known thing. Whether or not you want to bury your head in the sand is up to you. I played a 30fps game on my PS3 the other day, and it felt fine. Played a PC game at 30fps, and it felt jittery as hell.

[spooney]

Originally posted by Revan1er:

Originally posted by ♥♥♥♥ Justice:

Yeah, motion blur is absolutely the issue. That's why games on PC still look crap at 30fps even when motion blur is used, right? Stating that there's no difference between consoles and PC when it comes to 30fps is utterly uninformed. Check this thread out - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1061621

As I said, half-refresh rate vsync is needed to get the game looking better at 30fps on PC. I don't really give a damn if you believe me or not. I posted a tip to make the game perform better with its framerate cap. If you just want to whine and complain about 30fps, talk to someone else.

Oh, and the "lazy devs" argument is really played out. Most people who bring that up generally have no clue whatsoever as to the realities of developing games. Concepts like "budgets" and "deadlines". Saying "lazy devs" is a lazy argument itself.

I don't recall bringing up "cinematic" or "not seeing 30fps". Nice attempt at a strawman argument.

Demon's Souls wasn't released on PC. If you're referring to Dark Souls, it has some bugs at 60fps. Also yes, hello Final Fantasy Type 0, which is still locked at 30fps. Great example, Sherlock. Zestiria is the exception to the rule. 30fps being tied to the engine is an actual thing, regardless of how ignorant you want to be.

FF Type 0 was limited at 30 fps on psp and the limit was removed with a hack and you can play it at 60 fps on emulator or hacked psp (good point Sherlock, I didn't mention the HD version because they blocked it intentionally or not during the port)
Google it if you don't trust me!

Dark soul (yeah my bad): some bugs but fixed in majority with the help of the community and totally fixed by dev for Dark soul 2 (same engine!!!). And I can give you a lot of others example.

Now the real point:
Dev can fixed a broken engine but like you said, it needs some times AND money. And I am sure it is the case here. They didn't want to spent too lots of money and time for a port wich will not sell a lot. I know this.

For my other arguments I didn't directed them to you but to the marketing people who love saying these kinds of things. Are you one of them?
I said it because the guy from Ghostlight told us, frame-rate is tied so unfixable... And my point is: is it true or they just don't want to spend time\money to fix it?

By the way, I can't find any proof of your your statement. I only see graph from PC version of The witcher 3 and just "games look smoother on console"... Do you have a better link? Real study of why console games look smoother than pc?

Developers have stated that allowing the game to go 60fps will break some of the mechanics.
Everyone knows 60fps looks and feels superior.
The entire engine is hardcoded to 30fps, i'm not entirely sure but it's possible they continue to use the same engine for each game so you get the same hardcoding.
Hardcoding is not something you can just *fix*
If you want to keep your head up your ass and blame something then blame console limitations.
Why bother changing it when they will only reach 30fps?

[Ebon Wolf]

Originally posted by Maverik770:

Originally posted by The Man Who Sold The World:

so basically the game is rendered at 720p and then upscaled to whatever you set it to?
what is this 2000? and a 30 fps lock as well? No thanks
If you can't port a game properly then don't bother.These botched attempts won't be getting any money from me.

The port bashing is getting a bit ridiculous these days. As PC Gamers we have certain standards we expect which in recent times has been the "60 FPS" standard. Anything that fails to meet this simple framerate standard is automatically vilified and slandered into the ground with claims of "botched port" and developers being "lazy" or "bad at porting" games to PC. The thing we PC Gamers need to understand, especially in regards to these consoles ports and even more so when talking about a Japanese console port, is that these console games were never created with PC in mind at all. You can't call this game a "botched port" when it was made over 7 years ago for a console that is locked at 30 FPS and was never even considered for running it on PC that is capable of more.

You clearly have no idea how game's are made and programming is done. One of the developers themselves already posted on this thread explaining that the game was actually made tied to the 30 frames per second rate. That is VERY common with console games, especially Japanese console games. By locking the engine and framerate together they can assure a much better and consistent experience for the users on the consoles that the game was made for. Expecting them to literally re-write the entire game's code and/or engine for a budget port to PC 7+ years after the fact is beyond ridiculous and smacks of the absurd entitlement I see PC gamers bandying about these days.

Just because you're a PC gamer and expect 60 FPS as the standard does not mean every game ever made can possibly achieve that target standard. Or at least considering their budgets and situations for old ports like this. Allowing the game to run at 60 FPS could cause severe instability as well as broken combat and/or mechanics and a bazillion other anamolies. Then everyone would be on here screaming and crying about how shoddy and buggy this port was and then vilify them for that instead. You need to udnerstand that what you're asking is not as simple as you think it is. It's not even remotely close to as simple as you act it is for console games built like this. Re-coding a game like this to be capable of running at different/higher framerates is a massive undertaking.

You should drop the entitlement act and actually learn about things before spouting off non-sense about botched ports and the like. Modern PC Gamers want their cake and eat it too. It's growing very tiresome. On one hand they cry for devs to port console games like this that you don't get to experience much on PC but then want to hang these devs because it wasn't possible to do it in the way they wanted? Absurd.

Dumbest thing i've heard all day. I always see posts like this when it has to do with a game the poster personally likes. Accepting mediocrity is never a good sign. 1 single person was able to unlock the framerate in a game that was "originally made at 30" that was originally a PS3. It's the devs not the games fault.

[spooney]

Originally posted by Ebon Wolf:

Originally posted by Maverik770:

The port bashing is getting a bit ridiculous these days. As PC Gamers we have certain standards we expect which in recent times has been the "60 FPS" standard. Anything that fails to meet this simple framerate standard is automatically vilified and slandered into the ground with claims of "botched port" and developers being "lazy" or "bad at porting" games to PC. The thing we PC Gamers need to understand, especially in regards to these consoles ports and even more so when talking about a Japanese console port, is that these console games were never created with PC in mind at all. You can't call this game a "botched port" when it was made over 7 years ago for a console that is locked at 30 FPS and was never even considered for running it on PC that is capable of more.

You clearly have no idea how game's are made and programming is done. One of the developers themselves already posted on this thread explaining that the game was actually made tied to the 30 frames per second rate. That is VERY common with console games, especially Japanese console games. By locking the engine and framerate together they can assure a much better and consistent experience for the users on the consoles that the game was made for. Expecting them to literally re-write the entire game's code and/or engine for a budget port to PC 7+ years after the fact is beyond ridiculous and smacks of the absurd entitlement I see PC gamers bandying about these days.

Just because you're a PC gamer and expect 60 FPS as the standard does not mean every game ever made can possibly achieve that target standard. Or at least considering their budgets and situations for old ports like this. Allowing the game to run at 60 FPS could cause severe instability as well as broken combat and/or mechanics and a bazillion other anamolies. Then everyone would be on here screaming and crying about how shoddy and buggy this port was and then vilify them for that instead. You need to udnerstand that what you're asking is not as simple as you think it is. It's not even remotely close to as simple as you act it is for console games built like this. Re-coding a game like this to be capable of running at different/higher framerates is a massive undertaking.

You should drop the entitlement act and actually learn about things before spouting off non-sense about botched ports and the like. Modern PC Gamers want their cake and eat it too. It's growing very tiresome. On one hand they cry for devs to port console games like this that you don't get to experience much on PC but then want to hang these devs because it wasn't possible to do it in the way they wanted? Absurd.

Dumbest thing i've heard all day. I always see posts like this when it has to do with a game the poster personally likes. Accepting mediocrity is never a good sign. 1 single person was able to unlock the framerate in a game that was "originally made at 30" that was originally a PS3. It's the devs not the games fault.

So just going to ignore why it's 30fps and call people dumb?
Ok, sure showed him.