Just me, or are all of the weapons kind of meh?

[@%thesock10150alpha49]

Title. I have tried out just about every weapon in the game, and almost all of them needed to be 2-3 tiers above the fight. I even tried to gather "weaknesses" in my arsenal and it definitely didn't feel like it did much. Given how expensive the ranged weapons can be for how bad they are, and the very high danger level of getting into melee with things, there's just not a lot to like about the actual combat portion here.

At this point I think the Deatomizer isn't "meta," it's just the only weapon that functions at a correct power scaling relative to the point you get it.

[Iraneth The Goat]

Depends what you are fighting, because yes soldier dudes are resistant to bullets, and the magic super Gatekeepers are also very strong, that's the point. As for melee, you're an old man who can't even throw a punch.

[MechWarden]

I can't say anything about the Reactor Sector enemies, but I think you are just running into a known oddity with the combat system. Also what difficulty did you set things on? I ask, since typically anything else other than Normal maybe be a bit much for someone new to the quirks in the game.

Unless you are aiming for the head, it is entirely possible to get the feeling like the weapons aren't able to do much, especially while playing solo.

I wouldn't quite use the Deatomizer too much, since it does rob you a bit of getting xp for other combat skills. (unless that too gives some xp now). Getting those skills leveled up and using some of the perks can help.

Now for the Reactor Sector stuff, that's just hard, and a lot of people have said just as much. I haven't checked it out yet (and will in a few days), but it feels like the difficulty spike is way higher than what players expected, despite there being hype about how strong the Gatekeepers are.

[Iraneth The Goat]

Originally posted by MechWarden:

I can't say anything about the Reactor Sector enemies, but I think you are just running into a known oddity with the combat system. Also what difficulty did you set things on? I ask, since typically anything else other than Normal maybe be a bit much for someone new to the quirks in the game.

Unless you are aiming for the head, it is entirely possible to get the feeling like the weapons aren't able to do much, especially while playing solo.

I wouldn't quite use the Deatomizer too much, since it does rob you a bit of getting xp for other combat skills. (unless that too gives some xp now). Getting those skills leveled up and using some of the perks can help.

Now for the Reactor Sector stuff, that's just hard, and a lot of people have said just as much. I haven't checked it out yet (and will in a few days), but it feels like the difficulty spike is way higher than what players expected, despite there being hype about how strong the Gatekeepers are.

The Deatomizer now gives accuracy XP
And the devs have nerfed the GateKeeper enemies a good amount. They are still mildly strong but not anywhere near what they used to be.

[MechWarden]

Originally posted by Iraneth:

Originally posted by MechWarden:

I can't say anything about the Reactor Sector enemies, but I think you are just running into a known oddity with the combat system. Also what difficulty did you set things on? I ask, since typically anything else other than Normal maybe be a bit much for someone new to the quirks in the game.

Unless you are aiming for the head, it is entirely possible to get the feeling like the weapons aren't able to do much, especially while playing solo.

I wouldn't quite use the Deatomizer too much, since it does rob you a bit of getting xp for other combat skills. (unless that too gives some xp now). Getting those skills leveled up and using some of the perks can help.

Now for the Reactor Sector stuff, that's just hard, and a lot of people have said just as much. I haven't checked it out yet (and will in a few days), but it feels like the difficulty spike is way higher than what players expected, despite there being hype about how strong the Gatekeepers are.

The Deatomizer now gives accuracy XP
And the devs have nerfed the GateKeeper enemies a good amount. They are still mildly strong but not anywhere near what they used to be.

That's good, but also a bit disappointing.

Because of real life stuff, I couldn't really give the game a try and see how hard the gatekeepers were 'in their prime'. I would love to try to fight some 'lore accurate' gatekeepers.

[Boo]

Theres a world of difference between fighting a robot normally and blasting it with electron grenades or electric weapons, or more recently using the new skink or laser weapons against the gatekeeper enemies

[AMLSALMON]

The Jotunn enemy in particular is pretty resistant, but everything else seems to go down easily with just my spear alone. Of course i'm effectively entering and leaving a turtle shell to take shots, so I can't really be killed unless my shield breaks. The new robot takes maybe a little over half of a Deatomizer (overpower mode) charge to kill. Fighting it with a spear by itself is a massive waste of time.

[burger boy]

Originally posted by MechWarden:

I can't say anything about the Reactor Sector enemies, but I think you are just running into a known oddity with the combat system. Also what difficulty did you set things on? I ask, since typically anything else other than Normal maybe be a bit much for someone new to the quirks in the game.

Unless you are aiming for the head, it is entirely possible to get the feeling like the weapons aren't able to do much, especially while playing solo.

I wouldn't quite use the Deatomizer too much, since it does rob you a bit of getting xp for other combat skills. (unless that too gives some xp now). Getting those skills leveled up and using some of the perks can help.

Now for the Reactor Sector stuff, that's just hard, and a lot of people have said just as much. I haven't checked it out yet (and will in a few days), but it feels like the difficulty spike is way higher than what players expected, despite there being hype about how strong the Gatekeepers are.

it's less that we didn't expect difficult enemies, but rather, more that along with those new difficult enemies, we lack any means to effectively eliminate them. ( currently near-impossible, even in 1 vs 1 matchups. ).

[Iraneth The Goat]

Originally posted by burger boy:

Originally posted by MechWarden:

I can't say anything about the Reactor Sector enemies, but I think you are just running into a known oddity with the combat system. Also what difficulty did you set things on? I ask, since typically anything else other than Normal maybe be a bit much for someone new to the quirks in the game.

Unless you are aiming for the head, it is entirely possible to get the feeling like the weapons aren't able to do much, especially while playing solo.

I wouldn't quite use the Deatomizer too much, since it does rob you a bit of getting xp for other combat skills. (unless that too gives some xp now). Getting those skills leveled up and using some of the perks can help.

Now for the Reactor Sector stuff, that's just hard, and a lot of people have said just as much. I haven't checked it out yet (and will in a few days), but it feels like the difficulty spike is way higher than what players expected, despite there being hype about how strong the Gatekeepers are.

it's less that we didn't expect difficult enemies, but rather, more that along with those new difficult enemies, we lack any means to effectively eliminate them. ( currently near-impossible, even in 1 vs 1 matchups. ).

Not new impossible, it was more then doable.

[Iraneth The Goat]

Originally posted by MechWarden:

Originally posted by Iraneth:

The Deatomizer now gives accuracy XP
And the devs have nerfed the GateKeeper enemies a good amount. They are still mildly strong but not anywhere near what they used to be.

That's good, but also a bit disappointing.

Because of real life stuff, I couldn't really give the game a try and see how hard the gatekeepers were 'in their prime'. I would love to try to fight some 'lore accurate' gatekeepers.

heres the only footage I have of the pre nerf guys.
Three things to note, I have the Ogre doll, this gives extra damage to GateKeepers, I am also using a Holy weapon, this also does more damage to GateKeepers.
I also have the auto turrets helping me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjysIU_yynw

[MechWarden]

The weird thing about combat in this game is that it sometimes feels more like a puzzle than actual combat. Often times you get the right tools for the job and you utterly kill what's in front of you, but you can still brute force it with other tools, and sometimes that's just as fun (for awhile).

However that puzzle/combat aspect doesn't quite always work, since the a weaknesses isn't given to all enemies, or you just get a higher tier weapon that makes past enemies irrelevant.

Added to the fact that combat is way different between solo and co-op, and you get even weirder results. For awhile my 6 player co-op team still would melee a security or containment bot to death, even though we had better tools. That's not to say it wasn't fun, it was, but the needed weapons to handle the threat was way different when there's a group.

Edit: didn't see your post until now.
Damn, that still looked like quite the fight! Would be fun early on but even with those tools it looks like it would get tiring fast.

Also, lul, Cackle Factor mod.

[@%thesock10150alpha49]

Originally posted by Iraneth:

heres the only footage I have of the pre nerf guys.

Everything about that fight looked rough. You had a set up and great cover everything and it STILL took that much. It'd be one thing if they were like a "boss" enemy, but they are pretty common in that sector and there are plenty of situations I can imagine you just not having the firepower to down them. I see why they got nerfed.

Originally posted by MechWarden:

Also what difficulty did you set things on?

Apocalyptic. Which only exacerbated our supply issues as a three man. We ended up all just using Deatomizers with multiple laser charge packs because anything else was just too costly to field. Melee on almost anything was completely out of the question. One gun enemy was usually enough to drop your stamina and even the mountaineer armor would only mildly protect you, and melted through durability.

You can totally over-prepare in this game, which makes it easier, but it more-or-less just puts you on equal footing with the enemies rather than making you stronger than them. Not to mention that prep in this game involves a LOT of grinding. I could burn through 30-40+ grinder discs in a single fight during the Manufacturing West section. And that's with a solid accuracy stat.

[Mastema]

Ngl, the whole gig with Gatekeepers felt like a push for those who stick to one thing only. For me personally, it was obvious that these enemies would be "special," so me and my homie brought Lodestone Bow and Quill Arm + a ♥♥♥♥ ton of different nades to see what works best. In terms of dealing with GKs regularly, I would suggest sneaking with crystal armor and an antique shotgun. The only GKs that are a bit harder to pull this on are Jotuns, but the rest get decimated; just be wary of your surroundings. Fight smart, not hard.

[@%thesock10150alpha49]

Originally posted by Mastema:

Quill Arm

I had heard that these did decently well against them, but it was still ~2mags AFTER shields popped to kill the regulars so I dropped it.

Originally posted by Mastema:

I would suggest sneaking

Works well if there are some stragglers, but we found that if there were any baddies in the same room, we couldn't kill the guys fast enough to not have them alert everybody else.

[Morphic]

I sort of agree with this sentiment. However, I think perks/XP and damage types make a difference. My general go-to has been melee(spear+shield) preferably sneaking up for a sneak attack to initiate. Against most things this seems solid, especially if you are "on level" with gear.

Though this new batch of enemies(especially Exor Cha) make this dangerous/tough. Which, I do like the challenge but, IMO, at times it is ridiculous; like pre-nerf Exor Cha basically doing omnislash on you. I do agree with the comment that combat almost seems like a puzzle at times. E.g. the GK Mystigog was scary tough, especially with his 1 frame command grab; yet if you sneak attack throw an electron grenade... it 1-shots him most times lol. Same with throwing a slushie grenade then blasting with deatomizer at Exor Chas and Volatiles.

Personally, I would like to see a few more melee weapon improvements.(I loved the concept of Harpoon pull) Also, I think traditional firearms need a broad buff due to needing an armor slot just to wield.(Perhaps make a high level trinket to provide it? Or maybe more armors that have sets that do not require arms? Alternatively let us craft "enhanced" firearms use materials, like making our own FAMAS etc.?)