Desperados 3 looks lazy.

[Schizm]

I liked Shadow Tactics a lot but when I heard they were making a sequel to Desperados I was excited as hell, then I looked saw the trailers and I'm kind of disappointed. It looks like a clone of shadow tactics down to the exact mechanics. I know this sounds like a good thing but I was hoping for something a little more grounded in westerns. The gamplay trailer is clearly just Hayato and Yuki replace shuriken with knife and a trap with a bear trap. Wouln'nt it have been better to just release an expansion pass for this game rather then completely reuse mechanics from another game? I mean the mechanics are good but something different is always a welcome change of pace.

I was hoping mechanics would be inspired more by Westerns and have a unique feel to it. But it just looks like Shadow Tactics: Tumbleweed edition. I watched the entire video and I really didn't get a western vibe or atmosphere at all.

Idk just my 2 cents, maybe later trailers will have more things to set it apart from Shadow Tactics.

[Taruwolf]

To be fair, it's more that ST mechanics were inspired by the first Desperados. Cooper's abilities in the first game included the gun, knife, and a musical clock that was similar to Kuma. Aiko is very similar to Kate, etc...

I think the major advances in gameplay will be the town environment (somewhat non-hostile) and ability to enter and exit buildings that are more than just dark rooms.

[Schizm]

What I fear is its going to be exactly like ST. Will there be a Mugen that throws wiskey instead of Sake? Probibly. I'm hoping new things other then enviromental interactions get added. It looks like a reskin of ST rather then trying to build off of it and improve it.

[mopple]

Mh, I don't really understand what you were expecting Schizm. It's like after the announcment of Half Life 2 people said: "It's the same thing again: firearms, a crow bar and aliens."

Throwing knives, traps and whisteling are core mechanics of the genre, just as shotguns, granades and sniper rifles are in shooters. But I'm sure the new game will have some unique features too. The "social areas" where you are allowed to be seen, are a cool thing already. This way you can - and you have to - choose how to enter a target area at the beginning of the mission. Before, you allways started in one corner of the map and there was not so much to decide. You just had to fight your way out of the corner.

This was the first new feature they showed. Of cause they don't show all the cool new stuff at once. I'm sure there will be some unique skills too. And they said that firearms will be more important and more unique than in Shadow Tactics - as they should be in a Western scenario.

But the core gameplay will stay the same. Just as in every other genre. And I think that's a good thing.

[Schizm]

Well Half life is a sequel so that's not a good comparison at all, sequel are expected to keep the same mechanics just iterating upon them to bring something more unique. And half life 2 was massively different in terms of pacing over HL1. It made improvements it mixed up the gameplay with vehicle sections, and tonal shifts during lvs like ravelholm and others.

This genre of games has been stagnant for a while they all play the same even desperado 1, commando, and shadow tactics. I was hoping mimimi would take this chance to move forward and try new things. I get burned out playing the same type of game over and over and the trailers for Desperado 3 just seems like more of the same. Granted more of this type of game is good the gameplay is solid, the lv design is great, but as it stands it looks like a gloried reskin of Shadow Tactics.

As someone who likes and admires this industry I like to see things move forward. I also love westerns, its probably my favorite genre ever and video games have not explored it hardly at all. There is a lot to draw from Westerns and I was just hoping for a bit more creativity then what the current trailers have shown.

[Smug]

There really isn't that much new you can do mechanically without breaking what makes the genre so engrossing. Commandos 3 focused on action more and it's god awful. The reality is that these games are pretty limited, but the niche audience that loves them is fine with that so long as they got more and varied content to consume.

The areas where there's potential for advancement mostly lie in environments and how you interect with them and the towns are a step in that direction.

[TradeGy]

While there are a lot of similarities there are also some differences, probably more than we know of.

The maps, especially with neutral zones will be different than ST, and for me probably the most important as the gameplay is solid so new maps with new challenges would be most noticable I think.

The guns work different from how they worked in ST, no idea if different from earlier desperados as I haven't played those.

I'm not sure what new mechanics you'd want.

[Pherdnut]

Yeah because Shadow Tactics. What a lazy game. Not detail-oriented, pain-stakingly-ornate or hilarious with the rock-pelted-ox-murdering of morons at all.

[t.slappy]

Check this game: http://partisans-game.com/en/ It is Commandos 2 style in WW2 from point of Soviet soldiers with some RPG elements which may fit you better. But anyone can prefer different style of gaming.

[Planetdune]

I loved how in commandos each character had unique skills. You had the driver, the diver, the strong guy that could move stuff, the one that could use those barb wire cutters etc... I think there is room to give the charactres a little more environmental diversity. Also more vehicles! I really loved stealing a tank in Commandos or having to cross a river patrolled by boats etc.. I hear they are remastering Commandos 1 and I it has been so long since I played that game... If they do it right, I'll deffo replay the entire thing.

[Bolt]

Well a new thing that could be added would be a stance for when a character is not controlled by the player so that the character would either automatically surrender (that was a thing in Desperados 1), do nothing (passive mode) or shoot at whatever enemy comes in range, except a throwing knife (or any other ranged weapon that isn't a gun) is pre-selected in which case that is thrown before starting to shoot.

This would support the wild west a bit and fix the overkill, corner clutter and target selection micro issues.

Edit: Pathfinding overhaul would also be an improvement as characters in Desperados made use of ladders and doors automatically which they didn't in Shadow Tactics, demanding the player micros the steps once there's such an obstacle on the way.

An issue in Shadow Tactics was also throwing and jumping, seeming to only work from certain spots, certain angles or special pixels at times. Control issues there. Wouldn't hurt to make use of button combintations to be able to support controllers as well as PC keyboards while being able to bind specific actions to specific key (combinations).