Why the Controls are so F*ck up?

[D.A.R.K.]

I was thinking in buy that game, I have a friend who plays that game all the time, he loves it. Sometimes I watchi his broadcast and thought "I want to play it, but those keyboard settings... they are stupid, too much stupid" I mean...

If we see your Control, we have tons os buttons and if we see our Keyboard, we have more buttons yet... Why the hell the Devs did the game with the Commands so mess up?

Dude... To hit an enemy I need to jump and hold the jump butto? The f*ck? Where's the reason of that?

Why can't we have a single button to Attack, a single button to Jump, a single button to throw, a single button to use the Jump Potion, a single button to use the Corridor Potion, a single buttton to open our Inv and so on?

I just don't understand why the Commands are so mess up =/

There's anyway that I can rebind the Keyboard button to do that?

[Quazi]

You have single buttons for potions, and then swinging swords and carrying items are shared with holding jump and holding run. Its done this way because you have the ability to perform actions like throwing/grabbing an item/swinging a sword while you move around. Having more buttons would just make it more difficult, and youd have to pause to pick things up/ throw things/swing your weapon, as well as be unable to bind shoulders/triggers to important things like using potions.

The game has lots of controls, and we made them this way because it allows you the most uninterrupted control. Also you only sometimes get a sword so itd be silly to waste a button on it.

There is an option to invert the run key which makes it so you only need to press the run key to hold items, and hold it down to throw.

No matter how the controls were set up theyd be complicated since theres a lot of them. Once you get used to them you dont even think about them and they wont bother you at all.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally posted by Quazi:

"...swinging swords and carrying items are shared with holding jump and holding run. Its done this way because you have the ability to perform actions like throwing/grabbing an item/swinging a sword while you move around."

You don't understand the problem, you can move around with one single button to those two commands, and more, if those two commands had a single button each, this means we could do more things, not only the same thing.
PS.: Yet more, if those commands had a single button each, anyone could change it at Keyboard Binding and let they as what it is today. This means players will be able to swing the sword with only one button without do any other action as well as bind the swing to do with the same button as the jump. This is forcing players to play without change the Binding to a better performace.

Originally posted by Quazi:

"...Having more buttons would just make it more difficult..."

You are wrong about that. More control over the character means more freedom to act in any way in any situation. It wouldn't make the game more difficult, it would give the player more freedom to move the character and act appropriately in any situation.

Originally posted by Quazi:

"...youd have to pause to pick things up/ throw things/swing your weapon, as well as be unable to bind shoulders/triggers to important things like using potions.

The game has lots of controls, and we made them this way because it allows you the most uninterrupted control."

Actually we have 2 buttons to switch between items, so... No sense in this.

Originally posted by Quazi:

"...No matter how the controls were set up theyd be complicated since theres a lot of them."

Do you know how much buttons do we have in the Keyboard and Controlers? ¬¬
PS.: There's moments we could swing and throw items while running or jumping do evade a death (based in my friend playing)

Originally posted by Quazi:

Once you get used to them you dont even think about them and they wont bother you at all.

That's not the problem. If anyone get used to any situation means that situation will not bother anymore, but doesn't means that situation is the best one. Players could do more and better if you give to them more freedom in the Bindings. If a player that plays better jumping and swining at the same time, this player could just bind the same button to jump and swing, will change nothing to him.

[D.A.R.K.]

I still don't see reason to that.

It's just 1 button for each action AND if someone wants to do 2 Actions in one single button, they just could Keybinding the same button.

If you don't like to Jump/Swing at the same button, this means you could change it to be one single button each.
If you DO like to Jump/Swing at the same button, this means you could change it to be the same button to each.

[D.A.R.K.]

Think about this situation:
There's an enemy infront of you, stopped, ready to die, just waiting you to kill it...

What do you need to do? You need to calculate the distance between you and the enemy, jump and in the air you need to calculate the distance of the fall so that the swing reaches the enemy.

What's wrong to just walk towards him and swing? See how is more practice just move to the enemy and pressing one single button hit him.

[Quazi]

If you play the game you see this is a non-issue. The swinging/jumping is designed to work cause of the timing anyway, and most (90%) of the items function by throwing.

Its kind of naive to say i dont understand, ive tested adding seperate buttons like youve stated and it becomes too difficult to multitask since you need to walk you fingers around too much. It wasnt a blind decision to make things as they are. Its not a good decision to give an extra control for swords when theyre an item you arent even guaranteed to get.

It would be possible to do as you say, but I don't have the free time to set it up right now. Ill likely add it as advanced options, but i strongly recommend you learn the current system.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally posted by Quazi:

If you play the game you see this is a non-issue. The swinging/jumping is designed to work cause of the timing anyway, and most (90%) of the items function by throwing.

Its kind of naive to say i dont understand, ive tested adding seperate buttons like youve stated and it becomes too difficult to multitask since you need to walk you fingers around too much. It wasnt a blind decision to make things as they are. Its not a good decision to give an extra control for swords when theyre an item you arent even guaranteed to get.

It would be possible to do as you say, but I don't have the free time to set it up right now. Ill likely add it as advanced options, but i strongly recommend you learn the current system.

Oh... If you will gonna add it some day, it will be fine.
Because, that's the only reason I just didn't buy the game yet, and it really looks like a very good game, Rogue-Like as I like and harsh to defeat.

[Tobash]

It's hard to really judge the controls of a game when you've barely played it. The controls really become natural, and the jump swing thing with the sword is a non issue and part of the mechanics of the game. It actually is very useful for using the hammer effectively. If it were mapped to a different button, the timing of that would be a lot trickier and annoying. The system is smooth as can be, and there's almost never, possibly never, a situation where you can't swing your sword without dying. Learning to throw items to do damage is part of learning the game, and it is often times more effective than actually swinging.

I'll also point out that it's really useful to be able to switch to items quickly in particular stressful situations. That second item switch button can get you to that necessary item that much faster to save your life. It's very very useful.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally posted by tobash:

It's hard to really judge the controls of a game when you've barely played it. The controls really become natural, and the jump swing thing with the sword is a non issue and part of the mechanics of the game. It actually is very useful for using the hammer effectively. If it were mapped to a different button, the timing of that would be a lot trickier and annoying. The system is smooth as can be, and there's almost never, possibly never, a situation where you can't swing your sword without dying. Learning to throw items to do damage is part of learning the game, and it is often times more effective than actually swinging.

I'll also point out that it's really useful to be able to switch to items quickly in particular stressful situations. That second item switch button can get you to that necessary item that much faster to save your life. It's very very useful.

Dude, the problem is: You are removing the option.

If the Devs put each command a single button, I can CHOOSE set 1 button to do 2 actions, this is non-sense.

If I want to throw with one button and run with antoher one, I can. If I want to throw and run with the same button, it's just set this up and I will be able as well.

Think about a FPS game, Action FPS... We can Jump at Spacebar and Shoot at Mouse1... But I'm able to set to Jump + Shoot with the same button, got it?

The question here is why don't I have the option to configure the way I want....

PS.: When I mean "Swing" with the Sword, in fact, the action is "Use the Item".
If I'm holding the a Sword, I will swing with that single button.
If I'm holding the a Boomerang, I will throw it with that same button.
If I'm holding the Calling Horn, I will Call the Witch with that same button.

If you check out any other game, that isn't Flash, of course, you will see we CAN change any keybind to do a good setting...

[Quazi]

You can throw swords so how could that even work.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally posted by Quazi:

You can throw swords so how could that even work.

What do you mean?
Instead of using only one button to Run/Throw, we could have 2 buttons, one to Run and one to Throw.

If a player wants to set both actions to do in one single button, he could.
If a player wants to set both actions to do in different buttons, he could as well.

This means, every body could customize his own Keyboard Settings to play the game and do the best he can to reach Zardo.

[videotape]

Originally posted by D.A.R.K:

Originally posted by Quazi:

You can throw swords so how could that even work.

What do you mean?
Instead of using only one button to Run/Throw, we could have 2 buttons, one to Run and one to Throw.

If a player wants to set both actions to do in one single button, he could.
If a player wants to set both actions to do in different buttons, he could as well.

This means, every body could customize his own Keyboard Settings to play the game and do the best he can to reach Zardo.

So obviously more options would be better; thats a given for most things.

However, you dont even own this game and your all up in arms about the controls. The controls fine, atypical in some ways but they never feel like they restrict what I want to do in game.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally posted by Blind Joe Death:

Originally posted by D.A.R.K:

What do you mean?
Instead of using only one button to Run/Throw, we could have 2 buttons, one to Run and one to Throw.

If a player wants to set both actions to do in one single button, he could.
If a player wants to set both actions to do in different buttons, he could as well.

This means, every body could customize his own Keyboard Settings to play the game and do the best he can to reach Zardo.

So obviously more options would be better; thats a given for most things.

However, you dont even own this game and your all up in arms about the controls. The controls fine, atypical in some ways but they never feel like they restrict what I want to do in game.

I didn't buy the game yet because of that, even I don't own the game, I watch my friend playing every time he plays and I see how non-sense is those settings... Here his Profile:
http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197980014417/

[Tobash]

1. Your friend's profile is private, so we can't even see it.

2. Just because your friend has played it a lot (possibly, I don't know), that doesn't mean he has a full grasp of how to use the mechanics to his benefit. The mechanics and controls of this game were very thoughtfully integrated, and they work extremely will within this game. This game requires a lot of thoughtful use of its mechanics to be utilized well. If I may suggest, try watching some of my videos on youtube at https://www.youtube.com/user/Tobash to see some expert play in this game and see how the controls are not only not a detriment, but verily an asset.

3. The assertions of the controls being fine are actually sound. I urge you to really try it before you knock it. It takes getting used to, but once you have them down they're super natural. Think of it kind of like Super Mario World with climbing and more items.

[D.A.R.K.]

Originally posted by tobash:

1. Your friend's profile is private, so we can't even see it.

2. Just because your friend has played it a lot (possibly, I don't know), that doesn't mean he has a full grasp of how to use the mechanics to his benefit. The mechanics and controls of this game were very thoughtfully integrated, and they work extremely will within this game. This game requires a lot of thoughtful use of its mechanics to be utilized well. If I may suggest, try watching some of my videos on youtube at https://www.youtube.com/user/Tobash to see some expert play in this game and see how the controls are not only not a detriment, but verily an asset.

3. The assertions of the controls being fine are actually sound. I urge you to really try it before you knock it. It takes getting used to, but once you have them down they're super natural. Think of it kind of like Super Mario World with climbing and more items.

None of that is reason to don't give options to the player.

Again... Why players HAVE TO play with the pre-determined Key Settings of Devs? That's just non-sense, any company, even Indie, has this basic notion. Each player has their style of play, especially its Key Configs, I see no reason to Devs forcing players to play this way.

It's not absurd what I'm saying, any game, especially Combo Games, the player has the ability to configure the keys and combos the way he want.

Again saying ...

If the player wants to jump and hit with the same button, supposedly the player should have the freedom to set up in such a way.
If the player wants to jump and hit with different buttons, supposedly the player should have the freedom to set up in such a way.

There is no such thing as "We are the developers, we did it that way because it is the best for you, accept it and get over with", there's no logic in that.

[mellypeach]

You're not exactly in a place to judge whether or not something is logical when you're criticizing a game you haven't even experienced yourself... On top of that, you somehow think you know what's better for the game than the people who actually made it. There's no logic in that.

P.S.