Hurtfun x-Ray / wallhack problem.

[Craig]

Hi Hurtworldians,

It's with a little sadness that I have to report that there is a problem which isn't being addressed on the Hurtfun servers. I've discussed this at length with Klauz and he hasn't been able to offer a way forward so, against his wishes, I feel duty bound, to let you know that there is the widespread use of an exploit allowing players to see totem and locker locations. Klauz is well aware of this and when presented with what I consider to be conclusive evidence, isn't prepared to ban players and clans who use this exploit. Moreover at least one of these players donates to Hurtfun, as indicated by VIP status, which presents a conflict of interests. I find it particularly disappointing because the reason I moved to Hurtfun servers from Official servers was to move away from the widespread cheating.

I don't want to disclose my entire conversation with Klauz, without his permission, but I'll offer a quote which I feel sums up the response.

[1:09 PM] klauz24: If I will have to ban for this, gonna ban half of the server
[1:09 PM] klauz24: Cuz a lot of people abuse this glitch

I've taken many hours collecting and presenting the evidence to Klauz and we haven't been able to find a way forward, so I have to warn all players who continue to play on Hurtfun servers, that players, particularly in the biggest clans, can see their totem and locker locations. There are two ways that players can see inside bases, one is called the "x-Ray bug" and the other is via wallhacks. If I were to show you how the x-Ray bug works, I would be banned from Hurtfun servers and this post would be deleted, so I can't offer a level playing field in that respect, but I can urge you to build in such a way doesn't rely upon secrecy of totem and locker locations.

I'll add the screenshots, with explanation, which I presented to Klauz and allow the community to decide if it's sufficient evidence that a ban would've been appropriate.

The base was on top of a rock consisting of hundreds of metal cells, consisting of 4 walls and a number of metal ceilings, with 4 totems randomly hidden inside. To legitimately find the locations of these totems would require many hundreds of C4. Underneath the rock was a lot of metal walls, no lockers and no totems.

Base from the outside:
https://imgur.com/686iPhT
Name of attacking clan:
https://imgur.com/OrK2Rci
One of beds from the attackers:
https://imgur.com/a/SzdiMMR
Damage where they came through the wall:
https://imgur.com/a/rB6YNiX
Damage at totem 1:
https://imgur.com/a/ZQXgMhp
Damage at totem 2:
https://imgur.com/a/IAa1Ipr
Damage at totem 3:
https://imgur.com/a/TdsNlBm
Totem 4 protecting no lockers. They couldn't know this without cheating, however they chose not to attack this totem:
https://imgur.com/0SWHuA8
No damage elsewhere on large stone ceiling which would record damage of guessing totem locations:
https://imgur.com/a/WO1deUH
No damage on external walls:
https://imgur.com/a/KSslOma
https://imgur.com/a/iI06P5C
https://imgur.com/a/c9LRSwT
Underneath the rock. No totems and no lockers. They couldn't know this without cheating, however they chose not to even delete the walls to see what was inside, after taking the totems on the top of the rock.
https://imgur.com/a/kJNXJ0q
https://imgur.com/a/mPvgool
https://imgur.com/a/XvPsvm1

This is exactly what a precise raid would look like, knowing exactly the locations of the totems.
Based upon approximately 100 cells per plot square, we can calculate that the probability of finding the 3 totems, first try, to be 1 / 100 x 1 / 100 x 1 / 100. A one in a million chance that a raid would take place like this legitimately.

I've spent literally hours regaining access to this base and compiling the evidence for the benefit of the Hurtfun and Hurtworld communities, in that hope that it'll save some of you the time which you would otherwise spend, being unaware of these issues. It's clear that Klauz would've liked to keep this quiet, however I can't justify keeping this secret from the Hurtfun community, knowing that many players are able to cheat with impunity while others work hard and are unaware of the reasons that they lose the fruits of their labour.

TLDR: Remember that the enemy can see your totem and locker locations, even on Hurtfun servers and they won't be banned for it.

Take care,

Craig.

[Craig]

Many of you won't be aware that before I made this post I was a chat moderator on Hurtfun, but as a consequence of making this post that is no longer the case. Without Klauz's permission, I won't share with you the venomous message which I've just received from him.

[Craig]

It's happening pretty fast now. I've just been kicked from the Hurtfun discord server.

[Axel Foley]

they just want the money!!!

[Seth]

This has been a bug for about a year now, nice catch greg

[𐍈𐌂𐌄𐌀𐌽]

tell me about it, that server is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

[Seth]

u know like 99% of the players who play hurtfun also just dont speak english right?

[Sans]

Maybe you should be talking to the devs instead of Klauz, it's a game issue...not server issue.

[nsl]

is someone gonna cry?

[Axel Foley]

Originally posted by We move fast:

is someone gonna cry?

for a person with "1 game ban on record | Info" should be shut up and not allowed to comment posts

[woof]

Just to add my 2 cents as hf admin, yes there are few game issues which are out of my control as server admin so punishing people for it without strong evidence is not right imo, in this case Craig got raided by these guys (he had in-game issues with them before) and wanted me to ban them no matter what just because HE thinks they used exploits to raid his base and thats not how things work at hf. Moderators, donators or whatever has 0 impact when it comes to server management, so since I denied his ban request he's trying to defame hf now with this post, no big deal tho he's not the first and the last person doing this type of stuff.

[Craig]

As I said to you in previous reports, I was reasonably confident that they were using hacks or exploits but I appreciated that what I was reporting wasn't actionable because it wasn't conclusive. In this case the evidence is conclusive and requires action to uphold the Hurtfun rules. You weren't interested in the evidence from the outset and didn't want to ban these players as is demonstrated in the quote I posted. Which is why I told you that the community have the right to be aware of the extent of the problem.

You have suggested that I'm implying that the reason that these players weren't banned is because one or more of them hold VIP status and as such, pay money to you. I'm not accusing you of that. I have no way to know how much of a consideration that is for you when determining the outcome of reports, but what I am saying is that it presents a "conflict of interests".

It's not correct that I wanted you to ban them "no matter what". What I want is a level playing field where everyone is aware of the hacks and exploits in use, their pervasiveness and the level of enforcement of Hurtfun rules. I know that I'm not going to achieve that in its entirety by making this thread but it's a step in the right direction.

I still think Hurtfun is a better choice than Official servers, for players who want to continue with Hurtworld and reduce their exposure to cheaters and I appreciate that you are in a difficult situation without support of the developers. I can't allow players to naively build bases thinking that they have protection via Hurtfun rules and administration, when we both know that they do not. I think when you have had time to think about this, you'll see that it is the right course of action, even if it does have the potential to be detrimental to the population count of your servers and whatever revenue you generate from them, but as we've discussed before, the majority of the community don't even read these posts.

I hope that both Hurtworld and Hurtfun can recover from the threat that these hacks and exploits present, but at least now the community have some insight into our opinions about that prospect.

[Dragosani]

Nice trap base Craig to work out where they goto and why....But, not surprising unfortunately. Haven't heard anything from the developers over these (rendering) issues for a long time now but it really needs tackled or re-written.....

Only thing you can do is build your base so if it is raided, it's raided at a massive cost to what they get out of it....but, even then it doesn't matter when clans are coming at you with nearly 90 C4.....

[Craig]

I've made hack proof bases many times before. 20 totems, 1 locker each, 2 layers of metal. Takes ~2000 metal. 80-100 C4 to get everything. Can make it in a few hours at 3x. It's just not going to be any fun for anyone if everyone has to do that, but it's the only rational way to play against hackers and exploiters.

[Sans]

Pretty sure these "problems" have been in the game since the beginning, it's lack of development not a server side issue. I would be calling out the developers, not individual server owners.

[Craig]

I've written to Bankroll about it in the past. According to my records, the last time Spencer responded to the support address was 25th February.

Klauz has been picking up the support emails since then. The best bet was active administration on a community server, but even that looks like a dead end.

It's true that the game has been riddled with exploits and hacks since the start. Some progress was made in the the past though.