Store Page
NOBUNAGA'S AMBITION: Sphere of Influence
All Discussions Screenshots Artwork Broadcasts Videos News Guides Reviews

NOBUNAGA'S AMBITION: Sphere of Influence

Store Page
archita Sep 23, 2015 @ 6:47am
Oda Nobunaga: the japanese Julius Caesar ?
The life of Oda Nobunaga reminds the path of Caesar. They have the same ambition to achieve max power, the same concept of military rule, the same audacious tactic ( Okehazama is the most brilliant victory of asian history ) and the same fatal end by own retainers and allies ( the quoque tu of betrayment of loyal Akechi the "brutus" of Honnoji ).
< >
Showing 1-15 of 25 comments
Thamalandis Sep 23, 2015 @ 7:10am 
The little amount of similarities doesn't make a good comparison. Caesar had completely different presets, a different path to power and most certainly other ideals. He also ruled longer before he was assassinated. I know many people think the senate killed him asap... they didn't.

I clearly disagree with this.
Last edited by Thamalandis; Sep 23, 2015 @ 7:10am
#1
archita Sep 23, 2015 @ 7:38am 
Caesar open road to coming future empire after civil war following him death, Nobunaga was the "caesar" and Hideyoshi the "Octavianus" that defeat the betrayer Azechi. Different ideals but same decisive men that changed history in Europe and in Asia. Without genius of Nobunaga that adopted Hideyoshi himself, the muromachi age can be more longer and,maybe, less strong with different role in Asia.
#2
DTDrain Sep 23, 2015 @ 8:54am 
Originally posted by archita:
Caesar open road to coming future empire after civil war following him death, Nobunaga was the "caesar" and Hideyoshi the "Octavianus" that defeat the betrayer Azechi. Different ideals but same decisive men that changed history in Europe and in Asia. Without genius of Nobunaga that adopted Hideyoshi himself, the muromachi age can be more longer and,maybe, less strong with different role in Asia.

The process towards a true empire was advanced the most by Marius and his military reforms, not Caesar. By the time Caesar took the reigns Rome already was far more powerful than any of its neighbors.
As for the ambition to achieve absolute power, that was more a trademark of Octavian/Augustus (or arguably Sulla before).

I'm not sure if Nobunaga actually "changed history in Asia" (as opposed to just Japan) but my knowledge of Japanese history is rather lacking so you might have a point there.

Be that as it may, they were both very influential men but I don't see much of a similarity.
#3
archita Sep 23, 2015 @ 9:35am 
I see similarity because they used military power with uncommon genius and similar end where they understimated danger. I like see Azechi like a sort of "Brutus" of Honnoji tragedy.
#4
DTDrain Sep 23, 2015 @ 9:43am 
Originally posted by archita:
I see similarity because they used military power with uncommon genius and similar end where they understimated danger. I like see Azechi like a sort of "Brutus" of Honnoji tragedy.

Uncommon genius?
Roman history is full of brilliant victories (and some devastating defeats) by various consuls and generals long before Caesar (and long after him for that matter).
#5
archita Sep 23, 2015 @ 11:48am 
Originally posted by DTDrain:
Originally posted by archita:
I see similarity because they used military power with uncommon genius and similar end where they understimated danger. I like see Azechi like a sort of "Brutus" of Honnoji tragedy.

Uncommon genius?
Roman history is full of brilliant victories (and some devastating defeats) by various consuls and generals long before Caesar (and long after him for that matter).

yes but Caesar was special in decisive crisis period of Republic, the conquest of Gaul and rhine passage were part of modern propaganda work of "new man", him role in final years of republic was decisive. In this way him way to manage military and policy changed Rome, the same for Nobunaga that achieved brilliant victories and managed alliances that changed Japan.

Caesar and Nobunaga have closed historical ages, the republic age for Caesar, warring states age for Nobunaga ( Hideyoshi and Ieyasu were final result of Nobunaga age ).
#6
DTDrain Sep 23, 2015 @ 12:17pm 
Originally posted by archita:
Caesar and Nobunaga have closed historical ages, the republic age for Caesar, warring states age for Nobunaga ( Hideyoshi and Ieyasu were final result of Nobunaga age ).

The republic was already dead in all but name, Marius and Sulla killed it and the constitution was only kept up by force.
Pompey could have ruled just as easily and before Caesar, but he only wanted to be Rome's greatest general, not its master.

Anyway, this is getting us nowhere.
Even if I were to concede all kinds of points in regards to Caesar the similarities you seem to see so clearly are just not there for me.
Let's agree to disagree and leave it at that.
#7
Vermillion Sep 23, 2015 @ 1:16pm 
A more direct comparison to Ceasar would be Miyoshi Nagayoshi and Matsunaga Hisahide since both of them are responsible for the death of the shogun Ashikaga Yoshiteru and because of that the last hope of the Ashikaga shogunate died with no chance at that point of ever regaining control over the country.
Oda Nobunaga is much like Ceasar like how you mentioned but the actual act of ending the senate was more Miyoshi and Matsunaga.
#8
DKB Sep 23, 2015 @ 1:45pm 
Ehhhh, that's like saying all revolutionaries are the equivalents to each other. There just isn't enough of a comparison to draw.
Koei did popularize comparing Nobunaga Oda to Cao Cao though hahaha. (Seriously, those two have nothing in common, except that they were both ruthless)
#9
Thamalandis Sep 23, 2015 @ 10:35pm 
And are depicted with a goatee...
#10
Alice® Sep 24, 2015 @ 4:56am 
well in that case if Oda Nobunaga is Julius Caesar, then Yodo Dono is Cleopatra? Hashiba Hideyoshi is Mark Antony https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yodo-dono . The only reason Nobunaga didnt ♥♥♥& yodo dono and make her his concubine is cuz she is his relative. lol
#11
DTDrain Sep 24, 2015 @ 5:13am 
Originally posted by Alice®:
well in that case if Oda Nobunaga is Julius Caesar, then Yodo Dono is Cleopatra? Hashiba Hideyoshi is Mark Antony https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yodo-dono . The only reason Nobunaga didnt ♥♥♥& yodo dono and make her his concubine is cuz she is his relative. lol

Never heard of Yodo Dono to be honest.
That wiki link doesn't make her sound particularly special either, so I'll just have to take your word for it.
#12
Alice® Sep 24, 2015 @ 5:40am 
Originally posted by DTDrain:
Originally posted by Alice®:
well in that case if Oda Nobunaga is Julius Caesar, then Yodo Dono is Cleopatra? Hashiba Hideyoshi is Mark Antony https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yodo-dono . The only reason Nobunaga didnt ♥♥♥& yodo dono and make her his concubine is cuz she is his relative. lol

Never heard of Yodo Dono to be honest.
That wiki link doesn't make her sound particularly special either, so I'll just have to take your word for it.

u know hideyoshi have many wives yet hardly have any offsprings, which many historical sources suggest and suspect hideyoshi have erectile dysfunction. so yodo dono as hideyoshi's wife have to find as many 8===D to get his hands on to fill her desire as a harlot. Notice yodo dono is much younger than hideyoshi. the known people who having affairs with yodo dono are:

Ōno Harunaga
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%8Cno_Harunaga

Ishida Mitsunari
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ishida_Mitsunari
Last edited by Alice®; Sep 24, 2015 @ 5:42am
#13
DTDrain Sep 24, 2015 @ 5:47am 
Originally posted by Alice®:
Originally posted by DTDrain:

Never heard of Yodo Dono to be honest.
That wiki link doesn't make her sound particularly special either, so I'll just have to take your word for it.

u know hideyoshi have many wives yet hardly have any offsprings, which many historical sources suggest and suspect hideyoshi have erectile dysfunction. so yodo dono as hideyoshi's wife have to find as many 8===D to get his hands on to fill her desire as a harlot. Notice yodo dono is much younger than hideyoshi. the known people who having affairs with yodo dono are:

Ōno Harunaga
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%8Cno_Harunaga

Ishida Mitsunari
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ishida_Mitsunari

Well, Cleopatra did give Caesar a son (presumably), but she's had a bit more impact than just an affair or two.
If it wasn't for her there (probably) wouldn't have been a war between Octavian and Mark Antony, not to mention the fact that she lost Mark Antony the crucial naval battle by taking off early.
#14
salatrin Sep 24, 2015 @ 5:51am 
Originally posted by DTDrain:
Originally posted by Alice®:
well in that case if Oda Nobunaga is Julius Caesar, then Yodo Dono is Cleopatra? Hashiba Hideyoshi is Mark Antony https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yodo-dono . The only reason Nobunaga didnt ♥♥♥& yodo dono and make her his concubine is cuz she is his relative. lol

Never heard of Yodo Dono to be honest.
That wiki link doesn't make her sound particularly special either, so I'll just have to take your word for it.

Yodo-dono, aka lady Chacha is the best girl EVER!!!
Even in this game, she is the best overall historical female character statswise but she is a pain in the butt to obtain in game cuz the window of time is so limited as any scenario after 1570 she no longer exists for some odd reason UNLESS you play as Hashiba and get event which makes her his officer, and in scenarios before and including 1570, u need to either hope Azai stays alive long enuff for her to be born (1578) or have her marry into your clan anytime from 1566 till Oda destroys the Azai

My obsession with her is so great that lately, i have only always been starting in either 1567 or 1570 scenarios and getting marriage alliances with Azai at all costs just so i can have her as officer, and i choose those 2 cuz they take the least time for her to join game, anything before that is too long a wait for me :P
Last edited by salatrin; Sep 24, 2015 @ 5:54am
#15
< >
Showing 1-15 of 25 comments
Per page: 1530 50

NOBUNAGA'S AMBITION: Sphere of Influence > General Discussions > Topic Details
Date Posted: Sep 23, 2015 @ 6:47am
Posts: 25

Discussions Rules and Guidelines