Scrap Mechanic

Scrap Mechanic

Minnow Jul 5, 2021 @ 1:43am
Elephant In The Room: Mechanic's Shop
I'm curious to know how other people feel about this topic, but I absolutely despise the Mechanic's Shop. It's completely anathema to the very concept of a survival game. That is, an easily defendable indestructible building with build-in accommodation and enough free space for everything you could need in a base. I find its very existence offensive.

Suggestion: Remove it entirely and either add a build menu so they can build their own bot builder, or transfer its robot building capabilities to the crashed ship.
Last edited by Minnow; Jul 6, 2021 @ 12:15am
Originally posted by Arkay:
Ugh.
The 'Y u caer hw i ply gaym!? >:(' bullsht. Such a dumb objection.

It's about the intended experience. For starters, something like this actively /encourages/ players to set up in the Mech Station. Setting up elsewhere has nothing to incentivise doing so.

You could raise this objection to any number of things where you wouldn't find it convincing. Like I've seen people suggest new Seats or Weapons, but their hypothetical inclusion might require altering/nerfing existing content for it to fit. The suggestions are great, but there's always some braindead child responding; 'Y u want nerf thng i liek? Y u car hw i play gaym!? >:('
In any game, especially an early access game, things are going to change to preserve the intended experience or discourage things that can be seen as exploits.

Lastly, it's OUR game, too. It's not like we can suggest changes for our own personalised copies of the game. Believe it or not, but you and how /you/ play the game is not the centre of other peoples mind when they suggest changes.

What's wrong with kids these days, indeed.
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Showing 1-10 of 10 comments
Arkay Jul 5, 2021 @ 2:40am 
I agree. Setting up a base inside the Mech Station is baby mode. I wouldn't remove any of the functionality, just add extra elements to disincentivise moving in.
I'm of the opinion that non-deconstructable structures need to have some extra challenge to them. Like an extra raid multiplier or regularly respawning Agribots inside the area.

Perhaps the introduction of some aerial Agribots further down the development road could routinely patrol these areas.
AC Dosage Jul 5, 2021 @ 3:06am 
When the total value of block/parts within the confines of the garage break a certain threshold the mechanic bots from the rival second mechanics garage come and destroy any block/parts within the garage confines until the value falls below the threshold once again, flipping you off with their medium wrench finger as they leave. In this way the garage can be limited to being only a viable early base solution as you could never grow there beyond a certain point.
YetiChow Jul 5, 2021 @ 3:06am 
1) Early Access game -- things are not final; changes will be made going forwards and I'd be amazed if the mechanic's shop we have now is how it stays in the final release

2) what part of "reasonably comfortable place for new player to stay while trying things out" is anathema to a game about exploring, trying things out, and building up over time? This isn't Rust. 7D2D or some other "hardcore" survival game where the whole world is actively trying to wipe you out at all times. Sure, the haywire robots are a threat but they're intentionally not a 7D2D style endless horde; they have specific triggers and spawn locations because they're a challenge for the player to grapple with on their terms.

If you're offended by being given the option to have some fun in a chill environment rather than having to struggle and grind at all moments to prove how "hardcore" you are, then you've got some serious issues you might want to reflect upon. Or don't, I'm not your Dad. But either way, you're not the target audience for this game (it's explicitly a "scrappy", kid-friendly game that encourages play and exploration; not a Struggle Simulator); and I personally find it hilarious that you're getting so worked up about the game being "too easy" when your very word choices in your complaint betray the fact that you clearly don't understand the game as well as you think you do.

As far as bases go, the mechanic's workshop is only good for rookie players. It's not all that big, it's not as easy to defend as you'd think (doubly so once exploding totebots are added in the next patch or two); and chances are that there aren't many resources nearby. The beds in the capsule accommodation are also far from ideal -- aside from the fact that one of them spawns a haybot regularly; they're again not particularly defensible (in fact they limit LoS and make it easy for large bot swarms to trap you inside; jumping out the window risks fall damage and who knows how many bots are hiding in the gap underneath the building?) The main benefit of the mech workshop is that it can produce all the heavy machines in one place; early on the player likely doesn't have a vehicle that can readily transport the Craftbot or Refinebot.

The doorways in and out of the mech garage are easily blocked by a single farmbot (the big red scythe minibosses) during a high-tier farming raid; and with their AoE attacks it's impossible to dodge them once they have you boxed in. Hell, even a couple of haybots can make those doorways a death sentence. Defending "securely"/failure-proof-ly against that kind of attack requires basically blocking the doorways up to the point they no longer exist; which means you can kiss goodbye to anything you have outside the walls of the shop. Which means all your farms, for one; and almost certainly your larger vehicles (unless you do everything with a tiny quadbike-like thing; which means you're going to be spending a lot of time shuttling oil and/or battery materials back to base for refining)... at that point, there really isn't anything left to bother defending.

The alternative is to build defences outside the mech shop; in which case... you're not actually getting a benefit from its indestructible walls. And given how easy it is to build beds once you've found cotton, really there's no reason to rely on the capsule apartments unless you're specifically looking for a low-effort solution that lets you focus on other more fun problems than building up a wilderness outpost.

Anyone who is "serious" about Scrap Mechanic knows that the mechanic's workshop is a waystation on the road to a permanent base somewhere further down the road (probably quite literally -- the most sensible place for a base is along the road somewhere between the two packing stations and the farmer barn, ideally near water and any features of interest like oil wells or chem plants.) What I'd like to see eventually is the option to create craftbots from within the craftbot, or some kind of deployable "bot crafter bot", so that players can eventually move on from needing to go back to the workshop when they want an extra craftbot for a dedicated automation line. Then again... I'm not sure whether the game ever intends to reach a point where "dedicated automation lines" are a realistic requirement -- after all, it's not "scrap factory; and if mass-production is required for something in the mid-late game then I quite like the idea of going in to repair the existing factories (or probably some specific part of them) in the same kind of way that you start out with the mechanic's workshop. It's actually quite refreshing to me to have a "survival crafting" game where you jerry-rig solutions out of the existing world, rather than having to grind and build up from scratch like in every other game out there.
Ninja Zyborg Jul 5, 2021 @ 6:39am 
Originally posted by Minnow:
Suggestion: Remove it entirely and transfer its robot building capabilities to the crashed ship.
so now everyone builds their base in the starting zone. great.
Minnow Jul 5, 2021 @ 6:46am 
Originally posted by Ninja Zyborg:
so now everyone builds their base in the starting zone. great.
The ship isn't big enough to hold anything useful.
YetiChow Jul 5, 2021 @ 8:15am 
Originally posted by Minnow:
Originally posted by Ninja Zyborg:
so now everyone builds their base in the starting zone. great.
The ship isn't big enough to hold anything useful.

Wow, you really don't know much about any strategy beyond your own, do you?

The ship has a large non-spawning area around it, multiple short cliffs (perfect for defending farms -- you just build against the edge of the cliff in a corner area, that blocks off access from multiple sides and you only need to trap/defend a small entry area), the starting pond for a water source, several stacks worth of ember trees, and 2 buildings nearby that spawn free scrap rods + some fuel that are lightly guarded by only a couple of haybots... everything required for a heavily-armoured "tank" complete with a drill or saw, all safely available in the starting area. With a tiny bit of creativity it's quite easy to run 2 engines + steering off of the basic seat, which means that tank is a very plausible build for a rookie player.

Congrats -- in the pursuit of fixing one cheese tactic, you've found a way to encourage new players to trivialise the entire first chapter of the game instead! Why bother throwing together a scrappy first vehicle and exploring the road when you could just safely grind small farm raids until you have an unstoppable tank? Or hell, why not expand those farms over time (with traps of course) until tapebots start showing up, giving a supply of batteries too? Of course there will be tutorials for how to do that up within minutes of the change going live... so, rather than letting new players come up with their own solution to how they want to progress through the game, you've created a short-cut to the ultimate cheese tactic to sequence-break straight from the crashed ship to farmer-hunting to get the first gun.

Allowing rookies to camp out in the mechanic's shop hurts nobody. Prescriptive rules around the "proper way to play the game", on the other hand, just close off potential for different players to enjoy it. If you want to challenge yourself not to use the mechanic's workshop, go right ahead -- and if you can't stop yourself from using it because it's "too powerful", well then that's a YOU problem, not a design flaw in the game.

Like I said, any experienced player will realise very quickly that the workshop is only good as a short-term outpost; it lacks all the resources you'd want or need to progress into what passes for mid-game at the moment. Once the next chapter drops and we get the underground area, it'll be even more obvious that the workshop is just one of the stops along the road.

Akil Jul 5, 2021 @ 12:36pm 
Who is forcing you to build in mechanic station? Is something like that? Or you just need to force other people how they *need* to play their own game? What's wrong with kids those days?
The author of this thread has indicated that this post answers the original topic.
Arkay Jul 5, 2021 @ 1:06pm 
Ugh.
The 'Y u caer hw i ply gaym!? >:(' bullsht. Such a dumb objection.

It's about the intended experience. For starters, something like this actively /encourages/ players to set up in the Mech Station. Setting up elsewhere has nothing to incentivise doing so.

You could raise this objection to any number of things where you wouldn't find it convincing. Like I've seen people suggest new Seats or Weapons, but their hypothetical inclusion might require altering/nerfing existing content for it to fit. The suggestions are great, but there's always some braindead child responding; 'Y u want nerf thng i liek? Y u car hw i play gaym!? >:('
In any game, especially an early access game, things are going to change to preserve the intended experience or discourage things that can be seen as exploits.

Lastly, it's OUR game, too. It's not like we can suggest changes for our own personalised copies of the game. Believe it or not, but you and how /you/ play the game is not the centre of other peoples mind when they suggest changes.

What's wrong with kids these days, indeed.
Last edited by Arkay; Jul 5, 2021 @ 1:11pm
Xeno42 Jul 5, 2021 @ 1:51pm 
your base never really gets hit by attack other then the occasional nusance hay or tote bot unless you built your farm to close and even then they will mostly ignore everything that is directly in the way of your crops. i just build near the oil because that means i can use as much thrusters as i want and go faster then the game can load. all you need to completely protect your home for 99% of attacks is a single strip on metal3 on the outer wall of your base.
Taylor Jul 5, 2021 @ 9:25pm 
I don't really understand what the solution of moving the bot making capabilities to the crashed ship really does. I can understand why some hard core survivalists find the mechanic station offensive (Even tho it's really dumb since scrap mechanic isn't supposed to be that difficult anyway)

Realistically the only thing you are changing by doing that is moving the mechanic station closer to spawn, shrinking the interior and making the landscape around it the same for everyone. It still gives players a starter base to build up their supplies until they can make their own base. The only real difference being the amount of loot boxes nearby and the fact that they have to park their cars outside.

The free space that is protected by bots point is invalidated since you can still protect your stuff 100% by placing it on top of the ship so the cheesing aspect tryhards hate still exists.

And the insentives to leave are still the same other than the crashed ship being a little further away from all the rescources.

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Date Posted: Jul 5, 2021 @ 1:43am
Posts: 10