Eco
Dknighter Feb 10, 2018 @ 6:58am
In game currency is confusing
I'm about to setup a store, lets say I put in 20 logs to sell, it then asks me how much I want to sell it for but it's only a number, lets says it's $. What is 1$ worth? I don't understand this at all. Say if I wanted to sell gold how can I decide how much 1 gold is worth in the currency? It would be so much better if you say, I am selling 20 gold for 40 logs instead of this currency that has no value.
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Showing 16-30 of 35 comments
Zyana Feb 10, 2018 @ 12:59pm 
you can use also 0.1 prices, even 0.001..
(1 coin cost 1-5 gold ingot depenting to skill).
Last edited by Zyana; Feb 10, 2018 @ 1:01pm
TicoPico Feb 11, 2018 @ 3:35pm 
Originally posted by Dknighter:
yeah lol but actual currency has a value.

Oh public education systems... how you have failed us
-=GoW=-Dennis Feb 12, 2018 @ 9:16am 
The value of the currency comes from using it. When everyone stops using the currency, it has no more value. You need to fiddle it out on the server. Begin with some value for something and see how it develops and how others price their items. You'll get to an average value automatically over time. And yes, while in thise phase you'll loose value.

In eco minted currency also is linked to a resource, so it's gold based, which nearly no currency on earth is any longer. So in the eco economy minted coints have more value than the ones in reallife *g*
Last edited by -=GoW=-Dennis; Feb 12, 2018 @ 9:18am
Beercules Feb 12, 2018 @ 11:33am 
From what I can see you have personal currency, but I see this as a flaw not a benefit as you could have 10s if not 100s of different currencies in your server.

I would like to see a server option that restricts all currency to a global currency from the start with "Starter cash" than allow us to expand upon this vs using individual currencies but I guess this is the "Economics" of this game :P

I am currently working on a mod that will allow all metals (copper, iron or gold) to be used for minting currency and limiting the mint to government only by outlawing the creation and operating of a mint to government only, and removes personal currencies.
This solves most if not all of the issues with currency in game :D

I call my mod ECO-nomics :P
Beercules Feb 12, 2018 @ 11:36am 
Originally posted by -=GoW=-Dennis:
In eco minted currency also is linked to a resource, so it's gold based, which nearly no currency on earth is any longer. So in the eco economy minted coints have more value than the ones in reallife *g*

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_standard

The only economy not on the gold standard from my understanding is USA which is under the Petrol Dollar system basically backed by oil. If gold wasn't used for backing the world economy why did it go thru the roof when the world economy collapse in 2009?

If you do not back your countries currency with something that has value, you basically handing out worthless paper. If you had 50 million dollars in gold and print 50 million dollars in money you would have a 1 to 1 ratio, if you print more money than you have backing you devalue your currency and becomes worthless. I believe some 3rd world country have 1 million dollar notes LOL.
Last edited by Beercules; Feb 12, 2018 @ 11:39am
John K  [developer] Feb 12, 2018 @ 1:20pm 
Love this thread :)
And yeah currency is relative, one of the intentions of the design is players get to setup and manage the value of currency.
Dknighter Feb 12, 2018 @ 1:24pm 
yeah it's pretty great, I just don't have the time or effort to setup a functioning economy in 30 days with a server that has max 4 on at a time. It would be so much easier to just say, I want this item for this item.
Ater Roseum Feb 12, 2018 @ 11:39pm 
Originally posted by Dknighter:
yeah it's pretty great, I just don't have the time or effort to setup a functioning economy in 30 days with a server that has max 4 on at a time. It would be so much easier to just say, I want this item for this item.

Sell the item you want to sell so let's say as an example Hewn Logs for 20 (or slightly cheaper since anyone can make hewn logs) but buy Logs for 10(takes 2 logs to make a Hewn log without any efficiency).

Another example is if you want 1 gold for let's say 10 Birch Seeds, then buy Birch Seeds for 2 credits, but sell gold for 20 credits. That way if someone wants to make the credits to buy your stuff they have to sell to you an amount you feel is personally equivalent to what you sell before they can afford such.

Currency is and has always been used to price things at values we deem equivalent, it's why in real life a lot of people wait to buy a game when it's on sale or say in a review such and such game is truly worth such and such. We as individuals really pretty much choose the value of things. If someone goes to your store they will tell you if they think you are over pricing stuff.
Kunomatata Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:15am 
Originally posted by Dknighter:
I guess but real currency has a value, what the hell is 1 in eco?
Real world currency only has the value of what others tell you it is and what signs and symbols try to conviece you it is. logically for Eco to simulate what you want...will require moe people on one server. about 1000. 1 in every 10 will be a jackass, 1 in 20 will be a scammer, 1 in 5 will be a boaster, 1 in 40 will be a undercutter, 1 in 3 will be a hoarder. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ united in glory to make you feel like your 1$ is not worth this or atleast worth "that".
Afterall in a world by yourself, gold is worth as much as turds. the more "others" to symbolicly compete with; the more something could have value to someone.

In Original Theory of currency.

Was created to represent how much one puts into sociaty as a whole. Those who contributed to the betterment of mankind (local town, village, City). Farmers, Smiths, Teachers, and Guards were paid it as 'tokens' representing the contributions to 'sociaty' and if they ever needed anything they turned them in for said services or goods rather than bartering their livelihood or things they needed.
As time marched on; it became more a ruined symbology / system.
Last edited by Kunomatata; Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:18am
RandomRedMage Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:25am 
Originally posted by Beercules:
From what I can see you have personal currency, but I see this as a flaw not a benefit as you could have 10s if not 100s of different currencies in your server.

I would like to see a server option that restricts all currency to a global currency from the start with "Starter cash" than allow us to expand upon this vs using individual currencies but I guess this is the "Economics" of this game :P

I am currently working on a mod that will allow all metals (copper, iron or gold) to be used for minting currency and limiting the mint to government only by outlawing the creation and operating of a mint to government only, and removes personal currencies.
This solves most if not all of the issues with currency in game :D

I call my mod ECO-nomics :P

Yes, everyone has their own 'currency' however pay attention to the fact it calls it 'credit' and each player has infiite of their own 'credit' think of it as this, I can give out as many I.O.U's as I want, thats basically me giving credit to someone.

But I have a limited amount of coins I can give.

So in the start, before you start minting actual coin. Everyone is kind of working on favors. You give me 20 logs, I give you 40 credit of my saleable items. Down the line, I start minting coins. So I setup shop to Primarily BUY items. But Instead of credit, now I start handing out actual coin.

This is where the economy side of the game can flourish, as there is a limited amount of coins. While I am distributing my currency, I'll also setup shop to sell things that can only be bought using my new coin. But now prices are a little more solid. How much is a gold bar worth? I can mind 5 coins with a gold bar? OK, so that log is prolly worth .5 to 1 maybe 2 coins depending on the demand for logs.

Doing what your talking about actual complicates it more. making it so only the government can create the currency in the game causes problems with how the game is meant to be played, and since that government can change on the whim of the server population, that complicates it even more, because without the 'credit' system you cant promote trade with players who are currently offline. Take my shop for example, I have a list of things I will buy, how much credit I offer for them, and a list of things I sell, and how much credit I feel their worth. It's all kind of arbitrary based on my percieved VALUE of the items. I'm not a farmer, so seeds arent that valueable to me. So, I sell them fairly low. However Furnature, my primary production, is fairly valuable, while I dont over value it compared to my buying price of materials. I factor in what I feel the materials are worth if I sold them, as is, vs the TIME spent learning the skills, and making the product itself. so naturally, Lumber is going to sell, higher than logs, as its processed, and even at the highest efficiency, costs at least 2 logs per 1 lumber. conversely, hewn logs, i'll sell a near the same cost as logs themselves because at max efficiency you can get more than one hewn log from a single log. But others might value it differently because it costs them far more to make the hewn log as their efficiency is lower.

And this all boils down to percieved value. As trees dwindle in your world, wood is more valuable because there is less of it and those with it are less likely to give it up. And of course, if a smith selling iron tools has a surplus of iron, his tools may be cheaper, even if his efficiency isnt that great. but the smith down the way, who may not ave that much iron, but is really efficient may be selling them around the same price, but overall putting less material into it. In essence earning more out of his materials than the other.

And my final comparasin, this time to real life. I have the last pickle. I love pickles. You have lots of cheese. I like chease, but you have an aweful lot, compared to my one pickle. But you want that pickle. your likely to offer me more cheese for that last pickle, than you would if I also had a lot of pickles, because that last one is percieved as more valuable because there arent any more left. if youve ever had siblings and wanted something they had you should be getting the idea by now.

If you arent getting the idea, dont worry about it, those that do, will set prices, and you will fall in line as a consumer in the market, and not a shop owner.
-=GoW=-Dennis Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:31am 
Originally posted by Beercules:
Originally posted by -=GoW=-Dennis:
In eco minted currency also is linked to a resource, so it's gold based, which nearly no currency on earth is any longer. So in the eco economy minted coints have more value than the ones in reallife *g*

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_standard

The only economy not on the gold standard from my understanding is USA which is under the Petrol Dollar system basically backed by oil. If gold wasn't used for backing the world economy why did it go thru the roof when the world economy collapse in 2009?

If you do not back your countries currency with something that has value, you basically handing out worthless paper. If you had 50 million dollars in gold and print 50 million dollars in money you would have a 1 to 1 ratio, if you print more money than you have backing you devalue your currency and becomes worthless. I believe some 3rd world country have 1 million dollar notes LOL.
Congratz, you understood how our currencies work. Our money indeed is worthless paper that only works based on trust. None of the economies is based on gold standard anymore, as there is much more money as gold. It wouldn't work out. Gold standard has long passed.

Why it did go through the roof? Because it's a finite, deemed valueable resource people like to have for crisises. The value of gold is also more emotional since the beginning of humanity. We demmed it looking shiny and gave it a value it shouldn't really possess.

There are a lot of nice education movies about this topic, unfortunatley i do not know any english ones, as english is not my main language.
Last edited by -=GoW=-Dennis; Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:35am
Kunomatata Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:35am 
Originally posted by -=GoW=-Dennis:
Originally posted by Beercules:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_standard

The only economy not on the gold standard from my understanding is USA which is under the Petrol Dollar system basically backed by oil. If gold wasn't used for backing the world economy why did it go thru the roof when the world economy collapse in 2009?

If you do not back your countries currency with something that has value, you basically handing out worthless paper. If you had 50 million dollars in gold and print 50 million dollars in money you would have a 1 to 1 ratio, if you print more money than you have backing you devalue your currency and becomes worthless. I believe some 3rd world country have 1 million dollar notes LOL.
Congratz, you understood how our currencies work. Our money indeed is worthless paper that only works based on trust.
Less than 3% of transactions were "Cash" based world wide as a whole. I will be 1.5% this year i assume. Technically its worth less than nothing / paper. infact its barely a idea / or thought. just some easily manipulated data somewhere.
-=GoW=-Dennis Feb 13, 2018 @ 3:35am 
That's what i meant. Worthless paper before, now worthless bits.
Poknutsaurus Apr 8, 2018 @ 7:08pm 
Maybe this should help... Its a parody of how it started and explanation of bitcoins that is about the same... :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHjYt6Jm5j8
Dknighter Apr 9, 2018 @ 7:14am 
Exactly
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