Roads, Roads, and Roads...

[Shane]

I wish you would do something about roads lmao

cant you make cross sections, have it build in 2x2, 4x4, etc blocks, even some prefab corner shapes, and some sections what taper of the road into three directions, just do something with them, by all means make the 4x4 cost what it does doing it all single blocked, but at least it will make putting them down better.

right now its a major major teraforming task beyond words, not to mention the largest issue of all is getting a road to drop 6blocks its insane how much room is required to achieve that, it was my largest overall complaint back at launch and still is today.

[dorianmode]

Asphalt and stones roads are getting updated in 9.0 - with the hammer build changes you can build them rapidly in areas and rows, as well as block by block. Perhaps dirt roads will get something similar in future.

On the subject of ramps: a 1:4 slope is a very steep road indeed. If it were increased to 1:3, it would be approaching the steepest occupied roads in the world. The maximum recommended slope for pushing something up a ramp is 1:12, which would be a ramp three times longer than the one currently in-game.
The current ramp is already unrealistically steep to make a compromise for gameplay purposes - I'm unsure I agree there's a case for increasing it further.

Maybe you need to settle somewhere less mountainous?

[Shane]

i wish to shorten it !!

im not even talking about a mountain style region, i play SP so i spread out, we are already not playing as intended (or as you would in MP mode) im just talking about sending a road in a straight line down 5 blocks in height, this requires via ramps 20 tiles in lengh to achieve...

now even in open areas 20 blocks in lengh requires some serious digging of all types to get the desired drop and because each ramp is 4 blocks the result is sheer madness, the turn radius of trucks, and carts requires a wider than 2 block road, for example...

more like 8 (6can be okay) but 8 is better

not to mention if you opt to tunnel instead of road up/down over a intended area, you need at least 3 high tunnel for a empty truck (more for a load im going to assume) roads are just insane by default if you ask me....

a comparison of roads vs how it should be doesnt work, because in real life the lenght of a ramp to climb or desend 1 block is not correct in the first place. if you drive around in R/L you dont need to travel as much lengh to achieve the same altitude

the ramps are just to long.... you cannot build a correct and desired road unless you start suspending them, honestly it makes me wanna throw the towel in completely, when im requried to drop a road 5 blocks, the sheer amount of terraforiming, and left over material that returns is just madness and thats before we have to calculate the 20 block distance can even be done in the first place

[Shane]

this is something in this game i would never and i mean NEVER try and road, its impossible you cannot do this with ramps because the length required is off the scale stupid

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105081311

but this is something i dont class as a mountain, but feel the length of ramps required just to get down to the beach level is equally as dumb

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105081251

its just sheer madness on any level !!

[Shane]

here is the issue, this is how developers do things...
https://steamcdn-a.akamaihd.net/steamcommunity/public/images/clans/25097638/e7708988fbf707363584b1aa6c6bad7c0a60938e.png

but that is NOT how i want to do things...

if i wanted to create a suspended world type building game that hangs over the world itself, meaning i have to drop down to the ground to get things, but construct everything mid air i would go back to satisfactory...

which is why when you watch any youtuber creations of satisfactory the world is always created above the terrain. i wish to create a world that blends and fits into the terrain not replace it

in R/L we do not build like that our construction does NOT hover above the terrain, the roads are NOT flying over the top of oceans and hanging metres above the actual ground

do you even understand what it takes to replicate that link screenshot in space/tiles ?
lmfao

[dorianmode]

Originally posted by Shane:

a comparison of roads vs how it should be doesnt work, because in real life the lenght of a ramp to climb or desend 1 block is not correct in the first place. if you drive around in R/L you dont need to travel as much lengh to achieve the same altitude

This just isn't correct, sorry. Here is some information of the gradient of roads: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_(slope)#Roads

US Federal regulations mandate no more than a 7% gradient in mountainous areas when the speed limit is below 60mph - this is 1:15 - or a ramp that is 15 blocks to descend one block. The ramp in Eco is 25% - a very steep road indeed.

Here is a warning sign specifically for a 25% gradient road, since it is *very* steep, and difficult to drive with even a modern vehicle. This road is called the Devil's Staircase. Again, you'll note this is the standard ramp gradient in Eco. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_(slope)#/media/File:Devil's_Staircase_Wales.jpg

You are already getting a much smaller and steeper ramp in Eco than you would get in real life.

Originally posted by Shane:

the ramps are just to long.... you cannot build a correct and desired road unless you start suspending them, honestly it makes me wanna throw the towel in completely, when im requried to drop a road 5 blocks, the sheer amount of terraforiming, and left over material that returns is just madness and thats before we have to calculate the 20 block distance can even be done in the first place

The game is about living with the consequences of your actions, and how you settle in the landscape is part of that. I personally enjoy the challenge of navigating the topology. If road-building were trivially easy it wouldn't provide much of a problem to be solved. The investment required to build a tunnel versus the extra travel time of navigating around an obstacle is part of the strategy required when planning your roads.
Road-building is something that requires considerable earthworks and produces lots of waste rock and dirt, which is something that needs to be taken into account. For example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cut_(earthworks)

Originally posted by Shane:

this is something in this game i would never and i mean NEVER try and road, its impossible you cannot do this with ramps because the length required is off the scale stupid
but this is something i dont class as a mountain, but feel the length of ramps required just to get down to the beach level is equally as dumb
its just sheer madness on any level !!

It is your choice how to handle this. In reality, you are absolutely correct: you would not ramp down this slope at all, you would navigate around it, or create switchbacks to accommodate the gradient smoothly.

You'll note that coast roads generally travel parallel to the coastline for exactly this reason: https://www.google.com/search?q=coast+road&sxsrf=ALeKk01nM2NRfCFsHLsXt5-TpcbDY2OqJw:1590156188488&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjB9oG20cfpAhX3XhUIHXnJBj0Q_AUoA3oECAwQBQ&cshid=1590156242833846&biw=1680&bih=907

Or causeways and cut-throughs and other earthworks would be used to adjust the gradient - not unlike what you have shown in your screenshots. Or if the road continues out onto a bridge, it often is suspended or raised: https://www.annahenly.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/roadworks_1-600x448.jpg

I would not call it madness in the slightest - it is representative of what road-building involves. If you have a large amount of height to navigate and do not wish to use ramps, maybe consider using an elevator instead. You are also free to make considerable adjustment to the landscape, or build unrealistic roads if you wish.

Originally posted by Shane:

here is the issue, this is how developers do things...
but that is NOT how i want to do things...

You don't have to do it this way if you don't want to - this is only for illustrative purposes. It is your choice how to solve the problem - this is one of many solutions. It's been done in real life, as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_of_Chicago
You'll note in this livestream other developers have built the roads at ground level, so it is not universally 'how developers do things': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjLKDCYHboo

You have the freedom to build the roads however you want, but asking for the standard ramp to be as steep as the steepest roads in the world doesn't seem reasonable to me. "Road building takes work" is not a good reason for this to be changed, in my opinion.

You can always mod a shorter ramp if you really think the game needs it. Alternatively, you can adjust your world generation to generate flatter terrain.

[dorianmode]

Originally posted by Shane:

do you even understand what it takes to replicate that link screenshot in space/tiles ?
lmfao

Yes, I do. Here are some screenshots of how this was done in a server I have recently been playing:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105126199
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105126273
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105126101
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105126005

Some of it is suspended, and some conforms to the land - depending on the preferences and investment of the road builder. You are, of course, free to build them any way you prefer.

[Shane]

hehe look what i started now, just what i need alongside a fight with my wife...

i understand what your saying in full, and what your getting at, and believe me i have no issue when it comes to gaming putting in the work when the work required returns what is desired even under a real life comparison...


but dont keep throwing R/L comparison at me, vs what you see when you do the above in this game, because i assure you it doesnt work out in your favor...

because....


i want to get a road from point A-B and in real life its easy as fcking piss !!
but in this game you show me how you would do it...

given ramps

heres the screenie...
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105145937

and im not even close to messing around here, in real life that is a very simple task by comparison, in real life there would NOT navigate in the same visible road layout to get to point B

so please behave ffs

[Shane]

if your going to give me a bunch of BS reasons and links why that scale in real life could mean i cant make A-B please dont lmao

[dorianmode]

Originally posted by Shane:

i want to get a road from point A-B and in real life its easy as fcking piss !!
and im not even close to messing around here, in real life that is a very simple task by comparison

As above, this is simply false. You're making a drop of four units, which in real life would take a ramp with length 60, at a standard (if steep) 7% incline. You have less than 40 blocks between your marked points.

In real life, again, a coast road would run parallel to the water to increase the favourability of the slope.

Originally posted by Shane:

but in this game you show me how you would do it...

given ramps

I would notice I already have access to the altitude at B using the existing ramp by the lighthouse, and use the flat sand area to gain access from A to B without building anything at all.

Or I might use an elevator, or move some earth, or question whether point B was really the best location for what I intended to build. It entirely depends on the circumstances.

The game has presented you with a problem, and many ways to solve it - it is up to you which option you choose.

None of this does much to suggest a case for shortening ramps.

Originally posted by Shane:

if your going to give me a bunch of BS reasons and links why that scale in real life could mean i cant make A-B please dont lmao

So you're *not* interested in an answer to your question? Makes me wonder why you'd ask at all, in that case.

[Shane]

no its 6 drops, not 4 (at least 6 not counted proper), the existing ramp by the light house is only there because i cant road from A-B directly, but its what i wanted and its by no means from this game a mountain range

im not going to construct an elevator to drop 6blocks mate....

crap im already building over 20tiles of steps to bypass this issue where i need roads because i cant build ramps that high in this amount of space, in other words i can link pictures of steps going up inclines not even hills in real life, let alone mountain ranges

your trying to compare some serious BS crap to a game scale that is not even slightly close to reality

[Shane]

fck i could win this argument drunk and i am...

[dorianmode]

You're free to play the game however you like - I don't often use elevators either.

If you come up with any particular reason why ramps should be shorter, I'd be interested to hear it.

[Shane]

lets look at this..
https://i.pinimg.com/236x/63/69/de/6369de5c0c237b0db0de5d0e755bd372--places-to-go-scary-places.jpg

then this,....
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2105081311

[Shane]

seriously dude you are really trying to fcking flog a seriously futile argument in comparisons, this game does NOT utilise real life scaling

getting from A - B in R/L is piss easy !! via roads !!

[dorianmode]

I didn't say it did - in my first post I acknowledged that the standard Eco ramp would be an exceptionally steep road in real life. The game could just as easily make the carts fly, if that was the game they wanted to make.

My question is, what justification is there for making them even steeper, other than your preference?