boil over needs reworked

[Ghost]

Boil over is the most toxic perk to run in dbd, now let me explain.

Its clear how to tell who is running boil over if they lead a chase to an upper floor and make a dumb mistake. All they do is constantly run up the stairs forcing you the killer to slug them.

Now, recently bhvr made adjustments to make hooking survivors easier to avoid this playstyle. But, its still possible to do and ruins the fun from killers and survivors who arent using this playstyle, because survivors are dealing with 1 survivor not doing gens and just purposely trying to annoy a killer by making themselves unhookable and killer finds them annoying cause they get no benefits from them other more pressure. also with hook respawns this will only effect low amount of maps not all the maps.

Also this playstyle can STILL WORK ON RECENTLY UPDATED MAPS! All they have to do is bring overbuffed toolbox hook offerings and any maps that makes this playstyle effective (garden of joy or MacMillan estate map with a factory). Recent updated maps still can get hit with playstyle by hook offerings which can remove hooks upstairs which then they refuse to play to make killer annoyed. And theres one counter to this is executioner who doesnt need hooks. Onyro can also counter this as well but you lose bps.

Now im not saying this perk is strong s tier. But this perk does need rework so people who play this style are forced to play rather purposely annoy everyone to get reactions or get a clip of people slugging them for sympathy points

[Nod to get Booped]

Then don't slug to counter. Commit to picking up and hooking.

I always run Iron Grasp to help deal with some (not all) of Boil Over's nonsense, or just the problem of hook free zones. Just check for a visual on hooks before picking someone up for the first time.

This really only becomes a problem if you're playing against a swf team running Breakout and swarming you, but that happens in what... maybe 1% of matches for me? Even then, just take a deep breath, and focus.

[On Elm Street]

Eh, It's only a problem if you chase them up to heights. If you know how to use their momentum against them, BO can provide the killer with a much faster movement speed while carrying.

[Rusko]

Messaggio originale di Peaches ♡:

Oh but killers can play by camping someone to death, tunneling someone out of a game, slugging for a long time to sweat for that 4k, letting survivors bleed out for a few minutes.... and that's perfectly valid, but using a single perk as intended is promoting a bad playstyle... yep, I'm actually reading this...

So you WANT to be slugged all the time ? And if you dont want to be slugged, then you agree with him, that the perk should be changed, since currently it forces the killer to slug you.
I mean i'd assume you dont want that, since you said " letting survivors bleed out for a few minutes " And yet you defend a perk that forces killer to do exactly that.
Cause surely you dont mean that the killer should just pick up the survivor, even when both of them know that there is ZERO chance for the killer to hook ?

[Nod to get Booped]

Messaggio originale di Rusko:

...since currently it forces the killer to slug you.

Nobody is forced to slug. Nobody is forced to play a certain way. This is always an internal choice.

[KillaJoJo665]

Messaggio originale di Wolf in sheep clothing:

Boil over is the most toxic perk to run in dbd, now let me explain.

Its clear how to tell who is running boil over if they lead a chase to an upper floor and make a dumb mistake. All they do is constantly run up the stairs forcing you the killer to slug them.

Now, recently bhvr made adjustments to make hooking survivors easier to avoid this playstyle. But, its still possible to do and ruins the fun from killers and survivors who arent using this playstyle, because survivors are dealing with 1 survivor not doing gens and just purposely trying to annoy a killer by making themselves unhookable and killer finds them annoying cause they get no benefits from them other more pressure. also with hook respawns this will only effect low amount of maps not all the maps.

Also this playstyle can STILL WORK ON RECENTLY UPDATED MAPS! All they have to do is bring overbuffed toolbox hook offerings and any maps that makes this playstyle effective (garden of joy or MacMillan estate map with a factory). Recent updated maps still can get hit with playstyle by hook offerings which can remove hooks upstairs which then they refuse to play to make killer annoyed. And theres one counter to this is executioner who doesnt need hooks. Onyro can also counter this as well but you lose bps.

Now im not saying this perk is strong s tier. But this perk does need rework so people who play this style are forced to play rather purposely annoy everyone to get reactions or get a clip of people slugging them for sympathy points

boil over is fine the minute you know that a surv has it just keep a mental checklist of the hooks and if they go upstairs in a map like hawkins end chase and go for someone else

[A.I.KA-00]

I just went against two annoying clowns with builds and toolboxes specifically so I can't hook them at all, they also brought map offering and when I had enough of them and just slugged them to death, they dared to tell me how I'm the worst killer and they will report me.. honestly welcome to dbd

[Narrowmind]

That's what it takes.

[Earl of Wessex]

Just run Iron Grasp and/or Agitation? Plus, a lot of upstairs locations now have hooks, too.

[Rusko]

Messaggio originale di Quietly:

Messaggio originale di Rusko:

...since currently it forces the killer to slug you.

Nobody is forced to slug. Nobody is forced to play a certain way. This is always an internal choice.

Okay so lets take the scenario what OP is saying. That a survivor with Boil Over runs into some high ground and then goes down.
Both the Killer and the Survivor knows that the killer CANNOT hook the survivor cause the killer would have to fall down from a ledge which gives the survivor enough wiggle to get free so picking up that survivor would be a waste of time.

So please do tell, what is the killer supposed to there ?

[💫 Moshi 💫]

Messaggio originale di Goblin:

Messaggio originale di Wolf in sheep clothing:

idk if you read your own comments you havent been calm

The discussion has been normal. Stop trying to create a narrative that people that are saying you are wrong are somehow "not calm"

I love how someone keeps awarding you a jester. Do people not realize they're actually helping people they're laughing at by doing it? You get so many points after a while lol

[asa0199]

Messaggio originale di Rusko:

Messaggio originale di Quietly:

Nobody is forced to slug. Nobody is forced to play a certain way. This is always an internal choice.

Okay so lets take the scenario what OP is saying. That a survivor with Boil Over runs into some high ground and then goes down.
Both the Killer and the Survivor knows that the killer CANNOT hook the survivor cause the killer would have to fall down from a ledge which gives the survivor enough wiggle to get free so picking up that survivor would be a waste of time.

So please do tell, what is the killer supposed to there ?

Now let's take it a step further.

It's not one survivor. It's four survivors. Four survivors who came equipped with Boil Over, Flip-Flop, No Mither, and Prove Thyself (nowadays one of them also will have Weaving Spiders). Three of them brought stacking oak branch offerings. One of them brought an exploitable map offering (the Eyrie, the Game, etc). As soon as you locate one, they run to a dead zone and just stand there. Since the Boilflop/Oak Branch combo has made them unhookable, you slug them... but No Mither has made them unsluggable. They can get back up an infinite amount of times. And every time one of them gets away from you, they work on gens. You regress gens, but you cannot regress them indefinitely any more, and with the gen perks and toolboxes they brought, they can fix them faster than you can regress them, while also being unhookable and unsluggable. You keep them on the ground as much as possible, but again, they have infinite self-pickups. So slowly, painfully, and did I mention agonizingly slowly, they cherry-tap all five gens to completion. Maybe some of them bleed out. Maybe you ambush a few en route to the dead zone and get a few hooks. But the end result is: there is a very good chance they finish all five gens and get at least two survivors out for a "win" by, literally, standing in one spot for most of the match.

I have had matches go exactly like this.

Yes, it's super rare. But it's bad for the same reason Gen Merchant and Gen Knight were bad and the entire regression system had to be reworked just to stop them. They were rare, too. It doesn't matter that "hardly anybody does that;" nobody should be able to break the game so hard the other side can't functionally act at all. Again, that was why Gen Merchant and Gen Knight were bad, and that was why this is bad, and why I'm genuinely amazed it hasn't been addressed... especially since, as I pointed out above, addressing it would be as easy as just making it so some of these perks, items, and offerings don't stack or work together. Boil Over alone is fine. Flip-Flop alone is fine. An oak branch is fine. Toolbox? I don't leave the campfire without mine. But get a group of bad-faith actors putting them all together in stacks and stacks, and they can legit bring the match to a standstill, just like Gen Merchant and Gen Knight used to be able to. And that's a problem. Infrequent a problem, but a problem.

[BbQz]

Messaggio originale di asa0199:

Messaggio originale di Rusko:

Okay so lets take the scenario what OP is saying. That a survivor with Boil Over runs into some high ground and then goes down.
Both the Killer and the Survivor knows that the killer CANNOT hook the survivor cause the killer would have to fall down from a ledge which gives the survivor enough wiggle to get free so picking up that survivor would be a waste of time.

So please do tell, what is the killer supposed to there ?

Now let's take it a step further.

It's not one survivor. It's four survivors. Four survivors who came equipped with Boil Over, Flip-Flop, No Mither, and Prove Thyself (nowadays one of them also will have Weaving Spiders). Three of them brought stacking oak branch offerings. One of them brought an exploitable map offering (the Eyrie, the Game, etc). As soon as you locate one, they run to a dead zone and just stand there. Since the Boilflop/Oak Branch combo has made them unhookable, you slug them... but No Mither has made them unsluggable. They can get back up an infinite amount of times. And every time one of them gets away from you, they work on gens. You regress gens, but you cannot regress them indefinitely any more, and with the gen perks and toolboxes they brought, they can fix them faster than you can regress them, while also being unhookable and unsluggable. You keep them on the ground as much as possible, but again, they have infinite self-pickups. So slowly, painfully, and did I mention agonizingly slowly, they cherry-tap all five gens to completion. Maybe some of them bleed out. Maybe you ambush a few en route to the dead zone and get a few hooks. But the end result is: there is a very good chance they finish all five gens and get at least two survivors out for a "win" by, literally, standing in one spot for most of the match.

I have had matches go exactly like this.

Yes, it's super rare. But it's bad for the same reason Gen Merchant and Gen Knight were bad and the entire regression system had to be reworked just to stop them. They were rare, too. It doesn't matter that "hardly anybody does that;" nobody should be able to break the game so hard the other side can't functionally act at all. Again, that was why Gen Merchant and Gen Knight were bad, and that was why this is bad, and why I'm genuinely amazed it hasn't been addressed... especially since, as I pointed out above, addressing it would be as easy as just making it so some of these perks, items, and offerings don't stack or work together. Boil Over alone is fine. Flip-Flop alone is fine. An oak branch is fine. Toolbox? I don't leave the campfire without mine. But get a group of bad-faith actors putting them all together in stacks and stacks, and they can legit bring the match to a standstill, just like Gen Merchant and Gen Knight used to be able to. And that's a problem. Infrequent a problem, but a problem.

This reads like some camp fire horror fanfictions killers tell each other.
Geez man it's a video game your not some helpless victim with no options. Run iron grip if your are so scared of boil over trust me ive seen basement trappers bring people across the map using a few perks no boil over flip flop no mither combo is going to stop your from hooking. This is a mental block you have created it isn't one based in reality. I hate to tell you and others this since you will no doubt take it the wrong way but your morality during the game will effect you more then any perk. You have come to the conclusion you lost before the game even finished and like a magic "you" created this terrible situation and allowed it to happen.

[Ghost]

Messaggio originale di BbQz:

Messaggio originale di asa0199:

Now let's take it a step further.

It's not one survivor. It's four survivors. Four survivors who came equipped with Boil Over, Flip-Flop, No Mither, and Prove Thyself (nowadays one of them also will have Weaving Spiders). Three of them brought stacking oak branch offerings. One of them brought an exploitable map offering (the Eyrie, the Game, etc). As soon as you locate one, they run to a dead zone and just stand there. Since the Boilflop/Oak Branch combo has made them unhookable, you slug them... but No Mither has made them unsluggable. They can get back up an infinite amount of times. And every time one of them gets away from you, they work on gens. You regress gens, but you cannot regress them indefinitely any more, and with the gen perks and toolboxes they brought, they can fix them faster than you can regress them, while also being unhookable and unsluggable. You keep them on the ground as much as possible, but again, they have infinite self-pickups. So slowly, painfully, and did I mention agonizingly slowly, they cherry-tap all five gens to completion. Maybe some of them bleed out. Maybe you ambush a few en route to the dead zone and get a few hooks. But the end result is: there is a very good chance they finish all five gens and get at least two survivors out for a "win" by, literally, standing in one spot for most of the match.

I have had matches go exactly like this.

Yes, it's super rare. But it's bad for the same reason Gen Merchant and Gen Knight were bad and the entire regression system had to be reworked just to stop them. They were rare, too. It doesn't matter that "hardly anybody does that;" nobody should be able to break the game so hard the other side can't functionally act at all. Again, that was why Gen Merchant and Gen Knight were bad, and that was why this is bad, and why I'm genuinely amazed it hasn't been addressed... especially since, as I pointed out above, addressing it would be as easy as just making it so some of these perks, items, and offerings don't stack or work together. Boil Over alone is fine. Flip-Flop alone is fine. An oak branch is fine. Toolbox? I don't leave the campfire without mine. But get a group of bad-faith actors putting them all together in stacks and stacks, and they can legit bring the match to a standstill, just like Gen Merchant and Gen Knight used to be able to. And that's a problem. Infrequent a problem, but a problem.

This reads like some camp fire horror fanfictions killers tell each other.
Geez man it's a video game your not some helpless victim with no options. Run iron grip if your are so scared of boil over trust me ive seen basement trappers bring people across the map using a few perks no boil over flip flop no mither combo is going to stop your from hooking. This is a mental block you have created it isn't one based in reality. I hate to tell you and others this since you will no doubt take it the wrong way but your morality during the game will effect you more then any perk. You have come to the conclusion you lost before the game even finished and like a magic "you" created this terrible situation and allowed it to happen.

fun fact iron grasp doesnt counter it

[angelofdeath]

i agree boil over does need a rework. they have not changed it to match with the smaller maps. the all things wicked map has a hug dead spot of hooks and an area of over saturated hooks and boil over only works in the deadzones. otherwise once you start going to where the supersaturated area is, your guaranteed to be hooked. if you really want to deal with this. quit chasing the person doing this and force them into taking hits and going down near hooks. your the killer. YOU get to control the flow of the trial not them

[Nod to get Booped]

Messaggio originale di Rusko:

Messaggio originale di Quietly:

Nobody is forced to slug. Nobody is forced to play a certain way. This is always an internal choice.

Okay so lets take the scenario what OP is saying. That a survivor with Boil Over runs into some high ground and then goes down.
Both the Killer and the Survivor knows that the killer CANNOT hook the survivor cause the killer would have to fall down from a ledge which gives the survivor enough wiggle to get free so picking up that survivor would be a waste of time.

So please do tell, what is the killer supposed to there ?

Don't chase the survivor to high ground, let them waste time, go back to patrolling gens. Knowing when and where to chase is a good skill to have.

Messaggio originale di asa0199:

[snip]

While I don't doubt this has happened to you, it seems like the exception rather than the norm. The answer I have for you is: Take a deep breath, and try your best. If you fail, then you may still end up learning something from that failure (In fact, I find failures more enlightening than successes).