Regenerating totems to solve the issue of Hex perks.

[Seiko300]

I try to bring this idea up as often as I can, because it's that good of an idea and I've had many others agree. Whenever somebody thinks buffing or nerving the Hex perks is a good idea (not). The perks themselves are just fine, it's the general mechanic of totems that is the problem.

Regenerating Totems:

This was an idea that I created a while ago,

I won't go into too much detail, but the idea is pretty much the same as regenerating hooks, except it makes much more sense (in my opinion anyway). Affecting both normal totems and hex totems once destroyed they will repair themselves and re-appear in a different location after a certain amount of time (which is to be debated but probably around the same time as hook regen. time, if not less). This also buffs hex perks enormously and killers would no longer have to fear having a whole entire perk removed for the entirety of their games.

While the totem is destroyed your perk will no longer give you the bonuses it normally does, allowing survivors a bit of a breather period to possibly crunch up those generators with less pressure from any hex perks (for example if you had Hex: Ruin equipped). Once the totem regenerates, the effects simply continue where they left off, for example Hex: Devour Hope has you collecting tokens. You'll still have as many tokens as you did when the totem was destroyed, and you continue collecting them once the perk comes back into effect.

This allows for more bloodpoints to be doled out during games, and it also gives a more supernatural, occult, and mysterious feel when it comes to the lore of the actual power of the entity, and what the entity actually is.

Answers for questions:

Time for a totem to regenerate

Approximately 3 minutes. Simply because this should be a time to give survivors a bit of a breather from the effects of a hex perk, which is normally EXTREMELY powerful. Hex perks are in no way intended to be permanent, and they never should be. However, taking them away after they are destroyed once for entire games is just as terrible.

Extremely defensive killers

Along with the implementation of regenerating totems a decrease in time it takes to cleanse would probably be put into effect as well. This would balance out the fact that with totems constantly regenerating, and having a stronger presence within games they don't really need that increase in time to cleanse that the developers put in, in order to "buff totems" this way survivors will have a chance to cleanse a hex totem when up against a killer who is really defensive of their totems and hex perks.

Why in different locations?

Having a hex totem constantly simply repair itself in the same spot over and over again gets repetitive. As soon as the effects of the Hex begin to persist again, the survivor who initially destroyed it will go "Oh! I know where it is!" and destroy it as soon as possible all over again. Having totems respawn in different locations once again, gives that unnatural, supernatural feel as "how can the entity accomplish such a feat without directly being in contact physically?" but more importantly, keeps survivors guessing as to where it could be. You might have searched one place the second time it re-appeared but when you destroy it you'll have to check again because it could be there if you don't.

will hex jump to another dull totem? Or will it search for a cleansed totem and rebuild it?

Hexes will remain the a part of the totem that they are. Meaning, that once they are destroyed, the will remain destroyed for about 3 minutes. If the hex simply jumped to a dull totem, then survivors would not be able to gain that breather period for very powerful hex perks such as Ruin, or Devour Hope. The hex totems don't regenerate in the sense that Hooks do, which are stationary objects within the map. The totem generation within a map is already set to random, what this does is it utilizes that system which spawns totems at random, and then "regenerates" or "rebuilds" the totem in another random location a.k.a. spawning it back within the map.

And just to add on to a tinier detail, these destroyed totems would eventually have to disappear completely. Otherwise you would be seeing piles of bones everywhere across the map, and that would take up more processing power etc. than necessary.

[Seiko300]

İlk olarak UnbornCorpser tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Hero's Shade tarafından gönderildi:

a minute and a half !? Might aswell burn through the gens rather than die trying to remove a totem. and if you're gonna have to ignore the totems and burn through the gens you might aswell make them a normal perk.

Most games end within 3-5 minutes. A minute and half is a decent amount of time and with that the hex cleansing time could be nerfed to a shorter duration.

Wait what? You're telling me that most games in DBD last 3-5 minutes?? Are you serious? The average game length according to the developers is 15-20 minutes. at the very least 10.

[DBDPLAYER2326]

Are you kidding? I don't​ go around wasting my time destroying those things in hopes of stopping noed for nothing!

[Seiko300]

İlk olarak Michi tarafından gönderildi:

Love this idea. My question is: will hex jump to another dull totem? Or will it search for a cleansed totem and rebuild it?

Hex totems will remain the totem they are. See thread for edit

[Ataraxia ♥]

No, this is a horrible idea.

This will only majorly benefit the killers who guard those things with their lives.

[Nos37]

The devs have said that "Hex perks are removed when cleansed because hex perks are very powerful."

Having no perk after the cleanse sucks. The cleanse should weaken hex perks instead of completely removing them.

[Nos37]

İlk olarak fortleva tarafından gönderildi:

No, this is a horrible idea.

This will only majorly benefit the killers who guard those things with their lives.

The meta of hexes currently forces them to guard the hex with their lives.

If killers could remove 1 perk from each survivor by, let's say breaking a dog house randomly found somewhere on the map, the survivors would be body blocking it all day too.

Have the hex cleansing degrade the perk instead of remove it and the killers won't be so desparate to protect the totems; meta changes.

[Seiko300]

İlk olarak fortleva tarafından gönderildi:

No, this is a horrible idea.

This will only majorly benefit the killers who guard those things with their lives.

This change would

1. Increase diversity in perks used. People always complain about how "the meta never changes" etc.

The reason killers don't use the hex perks is because of that risk that you take when equipping them currently. Destroy them once and they are gone permanently. Effectively a waste of a perfectly good perk slot. This would increase the number of killers using this perk and not only that but changing gameplay in a vastly different way. With more of a focus and emphasis on totems, to the point where they may as well be a secondary objective.

2. I think it's quite obvious and plain why killers guard those things with their lives is BECAUSE of what will happen if they don't. To the point where I'm struggling to type this because of how stupid a statement that is.

I believe that the number of killers who defend their totems to that degree would be reduced drastically should this change occur. Why waste time defending a secondary objective, if it's just going to not only re-appear in the next three minutes and not only that but in an entirely different area, that survivors do not know, and a potentially very well hidden area at that.

Defending totems to the degree that everyone speaks of takes time, and energy. While a killer is defending his or her totem, survivors are completing generators and getting them done. Putting them one step closer to escaping and the killer one step back from killing.

and this brings me to a sub-point:

2A. Multiple killers can begin using hex totems.

Currently the only ones that are viable to utilize hex totems are the ones that can get back to them easily. A.K.A. The Hag, The Nurse, and potentially trapper. The other killers are put at a disadvantage because they can't get back out there as quickly to defend, with regenerating totems they won't necessarily NEED to defend. They can if they want, and it may benefit them in such a way but it would no longer be a forced meta when equipping hex perks.

[Seiko300]

İlk olarak Nos37 tarafından gönderildi:

The cleanse should weaken hex perks instead of completely removing them.

İlk olarak Nos37 tarafından gönderildi:

Have the hex cleansing degrade the perk instead of remove it and the killers won't be so desparate to protect the totems; meta changes.

The problem with this is that you would have to give special attention to these perks to come up with ideas as to how that would work. For example if the Hex totem was destroyed is the Hex perk permanently degraded, but still in effect? And how would one even go about "degrading" the effects of these perks? For example:

Hex: Devour Hope

A hex rooting its power on hope. The false hope of survivors ignites your hunger. When a survivor is rescued from a hook at least 24 meters away, Devour Hope receives a Token.

2 Tokens: nothing/nothing/Gain a 5% speed burst for 10 seconds after hooking a survivor. Speed burst triggers 10 seconds after hooking a survivor.

3 Tokens: nothing/Attacks put Survivors into the dying state automatically/Attacks put Survivors into the dying state automatically

5 Tokens: Grants the ability to kill survivors by your own hand.

You would have to change literally everything about this perk in order to "degrade" it in the way that you speak. Which personally sounds like it would take more effort than it's worth.

[TheMetalCorpser]

İlk olarak Seiko300 tarafından gönderildi:

Wait what? You're telling me that most games in DBD last 3-5 minutes?? Are you serious? The average game length according to the developers is 15-20 minutes. at the very least 10.

I come across nothing but hardcore loopers and BNP users. So yeah most games end pretty fast for me. Or I kill them all but I usually avoid doing that so they can try to enjoy the game as well. If I encounter nice survivors who don't hardcore loop or spam BNPs yeah the game could last that long.

İlk olarak Samination tarafından gönderildi:

Are you kidding? I don't​ go around wasting my time destroying those things in hopes of stopping noed for nothing!

The regen could be disabled once gens are powered making it easy to still stop Noed.

[z0mb1k]

Devour Hope will become OP with this change. But yeah, good idea. You need to forward it to devs.

[Phatsoh]

Yes I would agree that the hex's doesnt need no buff or nerf because they are already good as they are but if you are running the hex perks then you know the cost and consequences. Yes they should figure a way for the hex's to not be able to get destroyed early or make it harder to find but you should already know that they might get or be destroyed early on in the game. So you are running the hex perks and your own costs.

[TheMetalCorpser]

İlk olarak z0mb1k tarafından gönderildi:

Devour Hope will become OP with this change. But yeah, good idea. You need to forward it to devs.

Eh...they could make it so if cleansed it removes 1-2 charges on DH and of course you wouldn't be able to gain tokens while it was waiting to regen.

[Tiler]

İlk olarak Nos37 tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak fortleva tarafından gönderildi:

No, this is a horrible idea.

This will only majorly benefit the killers who guard those things with their lives.

The meta of hexes currently forces them to guard the hex with their lives.

If killers could remove 1 perk from each survivor by, let's say breaking a dog house randomly found somewhere on the map, the survivors would be body blocking it all day too.

Have the hex cleansing degrade the perk instead of remove it and the killers won't be so desparate to protect the totems; meta changes.

This is a better idea.

Instead of regening, just have the perk have 2 states.

Devour hope. 2,3,5 tokens, while active like it is now. When destroyed change it, tokens no longer accumulate and:

2 tokens same as active
3 tokens change instant down to 20% hit recover speed.
5 tokens change from mori to 1% speed bonus

Ruin. When totem is broken change the effect so that a good skill check does a 1% regression, instead of 5%, and great skill checks give bonus progress again.

third seal while active improve it so that all aura reading, including hooked/downed survivors is reduce by 100% and is active if you have been hit or not.

When inactive, reduce the aura reading effect to 50% and have it affect the last 2/3/4 hit survivors.

Third seal might actually become a popular perk if you made changes like this.

Devour hope and ruin would both be much improved and hex perks would become more popular overall, but would still be risky perks.

[Seiko300]

İlk olarak Tiler tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Nos37 tarafından gönderildi:

The meta of hexes currently forces them to guard the hex with their lives.

If killers could remove 1 perk from each survivor by, let's say breaking a dog house randomly found somewhere on the map, the survivors would be body blocking it all day too.

Have the hex cleansing degrade the perk instead of remove it and the killers won't be so desparate to protect the totems; meta changes.

This is a better idea.

Instead of regening, just have the perk have 2 states.

Devour hope. 2,3,5 tokens, while active like it is now. When destroyed change it, tokens no longer accumulate and:

2 tokens same as active
3 tokens change instant down to 20% hit recover speed.
5 tokens change from mori to 1% speed bonus

Ruin. When totem is broken change the effect so that a good skill check does a 1% regression, instead of 5%, and great skill checks give bonus progress again.

third seal while active improve it so that all aura reading, including hooked/downed survivors is reduce by 100% and is active if you have been hit or not.

When inactive, reduce the aura reading effect to 50% and have it affect the last 2/3/4 hit survivors.

Third seal might actually become a popular perk if you made changes like this.

Devour hope and ruin would both be much improved and hex perks would become more popular overall, but would still be risky perks.

Again, way too much effort for what it's worth. And even so, the "degraded" effects aren't even worth it. What you described is literally the UNCOMMON version of the perk Unrelenting with a 1% speed bonus. Except NOW you need to get tokens to recieve the bonuses.

Doesn't sound very good now does it?

1% Regression, again not worth it. You're talking 1% do you realize how INSIGNIFICANT a 1% regression is. It might as well not even be a perk.

50% reduction instead of 100% reduction to third seal won't make the perk popular.



I get that it SOUNDS like a good idea, to nullify the effects of the hex perks, but in all honesty it just sounds like a flat out cop out on the devs part because they couldn't think of anything better. It also doesn't fit with the lore in any way shape form or fashion because the Hexes are completely bound to their respective totems. Once the totems are destroyed so are the hexes. That's how it works. This isn't voldemort splitting his soul into 12 different pieces here.

[Tiler]

İlk olarak Seiko300 tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Tiler tarafından gönderildi:

This is a better idea.

Instead of regening, just have the perk have 2 states.

Devour hope. 2,3,5 tokens, while active like it is now. When destroyed change it, tokens no longer accumulate and:

2 tokens same as active
3 tokens change instant down to 20% hit recover speed.
5 tokens change from mori to 1% speed bonus

Ruin. When totem is broken change the effect so that a good skill check does a 1% regression, instead of 5%, and great skill checks give bonus progress again.

third seal while active improve it so that all aura reading, including hooked/downed survivors is reduce by 100% and is active if you have been hit or not.

When inactive, reduce the aura reading effect to 50% and have it affect the last 2/3/4 hit survivors.

Third seal might actually become a popular perk if you made changes like this.

Devour hope and ruin would both be much improved and hex perks would become more popular overall, but would still be risky perks.

Again, way too much effort for what it's worth. And even so, the "degraded" effects aren't even worth it. What you described is literally the UNCOMMON version of the perk Unrelenting with a 1% speed bonus. Except NOW you need to get tokens to recieve the bonuses.

Doesn't sound very good now does it?

1% Regression, again not worth it. You're talking 1% do you realize how INSIGNIFICANT a 1% regression is. It might as well not even be a perk.

50% reduction instead of 100% reduction to third seal won't make the perk popular.



I get that it SOUNDS like a good idea, to nullify the effects of the hex perks, but in all honesty it just sounds like a flat out cop out on the devs part because they couldn't think of anything better. It also doesn't fit with the lore in any way shape form or fashion because the Hexes are completely bound to their respective totems. Once the totems are destroyed so are the hexes. That's how it works. This isn't voldemort splitting his soul into 12 different pieces here.

These are only ideas to improve perks that go unused because of the state of totems. The devs are not bound to "lore" they make it up, they can change it how they see fit.

The idea is to make the perks lower quality perks when the hex is broken, but not remove the benefit completely so that the risk in using them is mitagated. The suggested values were only to demonstrate the idea.

And they are specifically meant to be unpleasant reductions, because you should still try to defend the totem, if you decide to take the hex perks.

I'm sorry that you feel the need to be so defensive when I like someone elses idea more then yours.

Your suggestion is far more development effort then adding an alternate effect when totems are broken, btw.