An Open Letter to those mad about Lara Croft

[Queen HawlSera]

So social media is already full of complainers about how "LARA CROFT ISN'T A HORROR CHARACTER! THEY'RE BETRAYING THE GENRE! DBD SOLD OUT!"

To which I have a few statements to make that I hope will address people's concerns.

Concern 1: Lara Croft isn't a horror character!

Rebuttal: Lara Croft is not a horror character, this is true. However we specifically have the Reboot version of Lara, which a much darker and more realistic take on the character. In the opening of the first of the reboot games (nicknamed the Survivor Trilogy) Lara gets Survivor's Guilt for being responsible for why the expedition came here in the first place, is nearly sexually assaulted, watches her friends die, and shows clear signs of trauma upon being forced to take a life... first an animal's for food and then a human's in self-defense.. She's not the badass gunslinging Tomb Raider from the games that take place later in the timeline... This is more emotional damage than most Scream Queens go through in their Horror Movies.

The gameplay is also quite different as instead of a run and gun against supernatural enemies in ancient tombs, you're gathering supplies, hiding from cultists and russian mercanaries, and hunting animals to stay alive long enough to get off the island and solve the mystery of the Dragon's Triangle.

While the prequel-marketed-as-a-eboot of Tomb Raider is not a straight up Horror Game, it's Horror Adjacenet

Concern 2: Tomb Raider has some scary stuff, but it's not a Horror Game!

Rebuttal: The same can be said for a lot of straight up killers in the game. Alien's first movie was a slasher in space, (encouraging knockoffs like Jason X, Hellraiser 4, and Leprechaun In Space), but it was more action orientated in the sequels with most game adaptations sharing that action focus (Alien Isolation being the sole exception), Alien even has side-scrolling beat em ups... Where's Leatherface's Side-scrolling Beat em up? Oh right, that's a ridiculous idea completely at odds with what happens in his movies.

Chucky's first movie, Child's Play, while in many respects a psychological thriller that explores a darker side of a child's innocence... The rest of the movies are largely comedic in tone, with all of Chucky's in-game lines and cosmetics being more in tone with the sequels and TV Series than the actual show

I could make a similar argument that only the first Evil Dead is a Horror Film while the rest of the series is an Action-Comedy romp with Bruce Campbell being Bruce Campbell (I'd straight up say Army of Darkness is more a Swords and Sorcery movie than a Horror flick), and again Ash is played more as a comedic character in DBD, not even having a killer associated with him (To be fair, the best killer choice is Evil Ash, and they only had the rights to the show)

And do I even need to mention how Demogorgon is from a 80's Retro Throwback show with child protagonists that merely has Horror elements from time-to-time? Or how Vecna's from a table top role playing game where players live out a power fantasy as murder hobos with swords and spells?

Concern 3: The Walking Dead, Supernatural, Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Splatterhouse, Clock Tower, The Lost Boys, [Insert Horror Franchise Here], etc. would be more onbrand

Rebuttal: What people need to remember is that Dead By Daylight is not your friend's MUGEN project, it is not a fan game dedicated to the Horror Classics, and its use of familiar characters is not under "Fair Use", each Licensed Killer is just that Licensed.

Licenses mean both parties have to agree on what characters are used, how much money BHVR will pay up front to include the character (Or even how much the license holder will pay as Valve paid for Bill's inclusion), how the profits are split, how the character is used, what creative freedoms is Behavior allowed to take with the character, what changes if any need to be made to the character to better fit the Dead By Daylight world, what changes to the Dead By Daylight world need to be made to make the license holder more comfortable?

If it were purely Behavior's call, we'd have Englund Freddy, every iteration of Jason, The Leprechaun, Scissorman, Issac from Dead Space, Army of Darkness cosmetics for Ash, Candyman, Pennywise, and maybe even some oddball joke choices like Killjoy The Demonic Clown or Dry Bowser.

But it isn't. Too many people think Behavior decides things on a basis of

"Who has proven themselves a titan of the horror genre and deserves a place at the table?"

That's simply not true, it's more complicated, and the simplest I can make it is the following list of questions Behavior has to ask.

1. What companies are opening to licensing their intellectual properties to us?
2. How much money do they want for the license?
3. How easy will it be to renew this license in order to keep them in the game?
4. What creative freedom do we have if any, what restrictions come with the character?
5. Will this license attract new players while appealing to old ones?
6. Do we have any ability to make additional money off this character with merchandising or cosmetics?

And that's only six out of potientially dozens of questions., and for Lara I can answer all of them

1. Movie Companies tend to be stingier on character rights than other forms of media. it's why we had Alien Vs. Predator games for decades before the movie was even a blip on the radar. It's why Freddy Vs. Jaosn Vs. Ash couldn't be a movie despite Sam Raimi and New Line trying to work something out, but it had no problems being a comic book. A lot of the character and requested for Dead By Daylight are either showing up in video games for the first time (like Pinhead, Amanda, and Ghostface) or have had a very limited exposure to the gaming market (Freddy, Michael, and Leatherface).. This means if it's purely TV/Film it's going to take a bit more negotiation to even begin to approach a "Yes" unless it's an Indie Studio... and even then many of them have to use loopholes (Like Michael and Freddy being specific incarnations of the character, and Ghostface being based on the Halloween Costume and not the Scream movie)

A Video Game company is more likely to just say "Oh you're doing a crossover? Sure we can throw you a bone, it's good marketing for us.... did you see how quickly Persona and Dragon Quest went mainstream after being in Smash? We will need a few bucks in licensing fees to pay some of our people with, but give us that and we'll fax over a contract" after being shot on email...

There's a damn good reason Mortal Kombat 11 couldn't get Ash Williams despite Bruce Campbell and Ed Boon both wanting it, yet Dead By Daylight could with the restriction that it had to be a promo for Ash Vs. Evil Dead.. and that series wasn't even allowed to reference Army of Darkness despite being the same continuity and having the same lead character and actor!

2. Tomb Raider hasn't been a household name since the 90's, sure it gets some buzz here or there when there's a new movie or an older game is rebooted or remastered... But it isn't the powerhouse it used to be and it no longer has a major studio like Square Enix backing it, so I'd imagine Lara Croft is a pretty cheap grab compared to most other characters.... For someone like Rick Grimes (Who I'd argue is probably even less of a household name than Lara Croft) there are multiple companies at play, you'd have to talk to the studio that made the show, the comic book company that created the character, the channel that gave airtime to the show... and they're all going to want a cut.

3. Given that Tomb Raider is kept alive through merchandising, remasters, and guest appearances.... Yeah probably pretty dang easy, heck Square Enix didn't even have to remove Lara's playable cameo appearance in Lightning Returns (Just a costume that turns Lightning into Lara)

4. Given that the March Steam sale for the Tomb Raider series was advertised with a picture of Lara's ass despite the focus of the sale being the Survivor Trilogy (The incarnation) where she's the least sexualized and this being an era where Female Sexuality in Media is more frowned upon... I'd imagine there aren't many restrictions

5. I could see Tomb Raider fans who just want to see Lara again taking up this game to play the character, especially since it means she'll get to face off with famous villains like the Xenomorph and Chucky while meeting fellow female action heroes Jill Valentine and Ripley.. So yeah I expect a healthy influx of fans of Tomb Raider or just gamers who see DBD going in a more "Video Gamey" direction with its guest stars... So it's a good get. Maybe even moreso than the highly request Supernatural as Supernatural has so little of a presence in the gaming community that we can't be sure what portion of the Supernatural fanbase buy and play video games in the first place.

6. Given how many designs and alternate costumes Lara's had over the years, I expect her to be loaded to the teeth with cosmetics. If she doesn't have at least four of her alternate outfits from the first reboot game and a "Classic Lara" skin based on the recent remaster I'll be geniunely shocked

tl;dr

I know it may be disappointing to see an out of left field choice like Lara get in over someone more heavily requested, but at the end of the day Behavior has to go with the best choices for Dead By Daylight's longevity and profitability, not how well it works as a museum of your favorite horror flicks. Until we live in a world where games and movies are largely done for the art and not the money, a Post-Capitalist society I don't expect to see in my lifetime, that's simply the way it is.

I'm not some Tomb Raider Fangirl playing apologist, I'm just saying the facts

There's lots of things I wanna see in the game. I'd love to see Evil Ash as a killer, but he's not a big enough draw by himself to fork over money for the Army of Darkness license and it's not like we'd get regular Ash out of the deal since he's already in the game.

I'd like to see Ash given a higher resolution model that doesn't stand out as much, but they'd need approval from a license holder

I want Freddy to have a skin based on the NES game, complete with the "Freddy's Coming!" music from said game to be his chase music, but we're lucky Freddy hasn't been Demogorgon'd with how difficult New Line Cinema is to work with

I want the Jigsaw Puppet to be an alternate skin for Chucky, but they can't just mix licenses willy-nilly

I want a Clock Tower chapter with Jennifer and Scissorman, but it's too obscure, so unless Clock Tower Rewind pushes it into the mainstream...

I want a Dead Rising chatper with Frank West and Slappy, but it's a dead series and we're more likely to get a third Resident Evil chapter or a Monster Hunter chapter if Capcom's phone's getting ringed again.

I want a Leprechaun Chatper with Warwick Davis voicing the Leprechaun, but there are Horror Icons higher up on the priority list who are easier to get, so probably not gonna happen before Blair Witch, Candyman, Springtrap, and Jason

Them's the brakes, I'm not an employee of BHVR for the record. Sorry if I gave off any impression that I was.

[Powerfull]

Bro what are you talking about? dbd sold out when they added Chucky to the game.

[Queen HawlSera]

Originally posted by Powerfull:

Bro what are you talking about? dbd sold out when they added Chucky to the game.

1. the tl;dr is, there's a bunch of people complaining that Lara shouldn't be in because she "Isn't Horror enough"

2. Wasn't Chucky highly requested but thought to be impossible until they realized third person would work?

Originally posted by Kraken:

I ain't reading all that,
i'm happy for you tho
or sorry this happened to you

Neither of those are appropriate responses, but uhh.. thanks I guess

[Powerfull]

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

there's a bunch of people complaining that Lara shouldn't be in because she "Isn't Horror enough"

Honestly i don't mind her, the only thing that breaks the game's style is when she keeps spitting out one-liners all time, that's also the problem with most of the new licensed chars, Aland Wake, Nick Cage, etc. She's like the Silent Hill chars, she fits.

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

Wasn't Chucky highly requested but thought to be impossible until they realized third person would work?

yes, that's the problem. the playerbase doesn't know what's good for the game. those that are saying dbd sold out by adding Lara to the game are technically right, the game did sell out. But not with Lara, it was a long time ago. Imo it started with trickster and then it just went down-hill. i'm talking about chucky because he's the worst offender, not only does he breaks the game's style he also breaks the game's rules by being a killer as tall as a box and by having a third-person camera.

[Queen HawlSera]

Originally posted by Powerfull:

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

there's a bunch of people complaining that Lara shouldn't be in because she "Isn't Horror enough"

Honestly i don't mind her, the only thing that breaks the game's style is when she keeps spitting out one-liners all time, that's also the problem with most of the new licensed chars, Aland Wake, Nick Cage, etc. She's like the Silent Hill chars, she fits.

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

Wasn't Chucky highly requested but thought to be impossible until they realized third person would work?

yes, that's the problem. the playerbase doesn't know what's good for the game. those that are saying dbd sold out by adding Lara to the game are technically right, the game did sell out. But not with Lara, it was a long time ago. Imo it started with trickster and then it just went down-hill. i'm talking about chucky because he's the worst offender, not only does he breaks the game's style he also breaks the game's rules by being a killer as tall as a box and by having a third-person camera.

1. I feel like that's probably a request of the license holder at this point. The character has to be true to the character, and that means saying "the things", personally I blame Ash for starting the trend (Though to be fair, is it really Ash if you don't have Bruce Campbell or a decent sound-alike bringing that himbo energy?)

2. Yeah... Trickster was definitely a blatant attempt to market to the K-Pop crowd (and the Anti-KPop crowd seeing as he's a villain), his name doesn't even make sense. Nothing about his backstory or playstyle screams "trickster", I think the only reason they call him that is because it was the closest they could get to legally calling him "The Joker", since the dude design wise is basically just "The Joker, but sexy"

As for Chucky changing the rules, eh... each killer "changes the rules" in their own way, with Nurse ignoring most of them, Wraith being able to pretty much decide when and if a chase is going to happen, Trapper having a danger present even when the killer isn't around, Michael brought obsession, Hag brought hexes, Freddy has his own set of rules with the dream world, Xenomorph and Singularity require the player to actually get weapons to fight back with, Ghostface and Amanda give Killers the survivor only crouching power, Amanda forces survivors to abandon playing DBD to instead play Saw, Plague introduced a sickness mechanic continued by both Resident Evil characters, and I still don't fully understand how Pyramid Head works.

Sides Chucky has to change the rules a bit, most killers in the movies use crazy powers or brute strength to get their kills.. Chucky has neither option as he's physically easy to dispatch... So he gets his kills by pretending to be a toy and gaslighting people into thinking someone else is the killer, basically he's in a situation where he can only be dangerous if he can convince others that there is no danger... This translates pretty well to a character with a small terror radius that you can't see very well.

[Powerfull]

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

I blame Ash for starting the trend

i completly disagree, Ash is how a licensed char should be. If you asked a person who games in their free time, has never watched any of the army of darkness movies and has never played dbd, they wouldn't be able to tell him apart. Just like Bill, Cheryl, Alan, James, etc.

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

As for Chucky changing the rules, eh... each killer "changes the rules" in their own way.

If everyone breaks the rules there is no rule. Chucky is not guilty of having a killer power, he's guilty of not fitting into the game in any way. But devs knew he would be very popular and consequently bring in a lot of revenue.

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

I don't understand how Pyramid Head works.

Touch his red trail and he can instantly send you to a special hook where hook-related perks don't aplay. if you're on last hook he can mori you. simple. that's a killer power.

[Queen HawlSera]

Originally posted by Powerfull:

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

I blame Ash for starting the trend

i completly disagree, Ash is how a licensed char should be. If you asked a person who games in their free time, has never watched any of the army of darkness movies and has never played dbd, they wouldn't be able to tell him apart. Just like Bill, Cheryl, Alan, James, etc.

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

As for Chucky changing the rules, eh... each killer "changes the rules" in their own way.

If everyone breaks the rules there is no rule. Chucky is not guilty of having a killer power, he's guilty of not fitting into the game in any way. But devs knew he would be very popular and consequently bring in a lot of revenue.

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

I don't understand how Pyramid Head works.

Touch his red trail and he can instantly send you to a special hook where hook-related perks don't aplay. if you're on last hook he can mori you. simple. that's a killer power.

OH! It has to be the Red Trail, I thought you had to be physically close to the cage on the map, but I couldn't find the cage... Wasn't sure what my trail was doing beyond just alerting me if someone touched it

As for Chucky, each killer has their own rules, nothing wrong with one person's rule being low visibility... Especailly since that's Ghostface and Wraith's rule too

[Ren Stoker]

I love Tomb Raider, so I'm excited to see the character I grew up playing on the PS2 come to DBD. Are her games horror? No. I guess the first reboot kinda is but that's pushing it, imo. Honestly, I don't care. I mean, Nicholas Cage is in the game. How does that fit with the horror? Vecna is in the game. And as many people like to defend it, DnD is not a horror game. You can try, but at the end of the day, it's still an adventure game full of exploration, battles, and late-nights with the boys drinking coke and watching Star Wars after Midnight on a work day (true story). But I don't care because I love DnD so I'm glad it was able to make it into the game. Also, how come nobody is complaining about the Castlevania crossover? Castlevania isn't horror. It's a metrovania; you're slaying demons and killing the vampire. The characters you play as don't seem to be bothered by these atrocities in front of them.

It's DBD. People will always complain about something that doesn't matter.

[luie]

I don't understand the hate for Lara Croft. We literally have Nicolas Cage 💀. Love them both though.

[Mors_Indecepta]

Mario has to face ghosts and skeletal turtle enemies, and those original boss fights with Bowser were actually scary and tension-building.
Would you be on board with Mario being added as a survivor?
Luigi had an entire horror inspired "haunted mansion" game. We can have Mario AND Luigi, and have Bowser's castle as a new map!

If that wouldn't ruin the game for you (meaning those of your opinion, not JUST you), then I guess I'm curious why you choose to play DBD?

[Emmy]

idk, all I see is a character that's known for Survival being added to a roster of Survivors
really not that weird, people need to get over it

[Queen HawlSera]

Originally posted by Mors_Indecepta:

Mario has to face ghosts and skeletal turtle enemies, and those original boss fights with Bowser were actually scary and tension-building.
Would you be on board with Mario being added as a survivor?
Luigi had an entire horror inspired "haunted mansion" game. We can have Mario AND Luigi, and have Bowser's castle as a new map!

If that wouldn't ruin the game for you (meaning those of your opinion, not JUST you), then I guess I'm curious why you choose to play DBD?

Mario and Luigi are from bright and colorful games targeted to children, I'd hardly expect them to be in a situation like the one in the opening of Tomb Raider (2013), it's not a fair comparison.

[Mors_Indecepta]

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

Originally posted by Mors_Indecepta:

Mario has to face ghosts and skeletal turtle enemies, and those original boss fights with Bowser were actually scary and tension-building.
Would you be on board with Mario being added as a survivor?
Luigi had an entire horror inspired "haunted mansion" game. We can have Mario AND Luigi, and have Bowser's castle as a new map!

If that wouldn't ruin the game for you (meaning those of your opinion, not JUST you), then I guess I'm curious why you choose to play DBD?

Mario and Luigi are from bright and colorful games targeted to children, I'd hardly expect them to be in a situation like the one in the opening of Tomb Raider (2013), it's not a fair comparison.

Frankly, I have a much bigger problem with the DnD chapter than with Lara being added. That said, back-to-back chapters that are playing it really loose with the association to horror (especially with so many actual horror characters that players want added) is concerning.

[asa0199]

Originally posted by Mors_Indecepta:

Mario has to face ghosts and skeletal turtle enemies, and those original boss fights with Bowser were actually scary and tension-building.
Would you be on board with Mario being added as a survivor?
Luigi had an entire horror inspired "haunted mansion" game. We can have Mario AND Luigi, and have Bowser's castle as a new map!

If that wouldn't ruin the game for you (meaning those of your opinion, not JUST you), then I guess I'm curious why you choose to play DBD?

Have you ever played or watched a recording of 'the (Coronation Day)?

That legitimately scared the ♥♥♥♥ out of me. I'm not kidding.

[The Lost]

For me it also don't make Sense Lara really fits into the Survivor Role and to act like Dead by Daylight is a seeious Horror Game is just pathetic.
Just look at some Skins in this Game. It's more Fortnite than Horror.

The Gameplay is also really not scary except for the first 5 Minutes.

[Queen HawlSera]

Originally posted by asa0199:

Originally posted by Mors_Indecepta:

Mario has to face ghosts and skeletal turtle enemies, and those original boss fights with Bowser were actually scary and tension-building.
Would you be on board with Mario being added as a survivor?
Luigi had an entire horror inspired "haunted mansion" game. We can have Mario AND Luigi, and have Bowser's castle as a new map!

If that wouldn't ruin the game for you (meaning those of your opinion, not JUST you), then I guess I'm curious why you choose to play DBD?

Have you ever played or watched a recording of 'the (Coronation Day)?

That legitimately scared the ♥♥♥♥ out of me. I'm not kidding.

Okay I have to respect that, love that bit where Mario's trapped in Hell... The music is oddly satisfying for so horrible a fate

Originally posted by Mors_Indecepta:

Originally posted by Queen HawlSera:

Mario and Luigi are from bright and colorful games targeted to children, I'd hardly expect them to be in a situation like the one in the opening of Tomb Raider (2013), it's not a fair comparison.

Frankly, I have a much bigger problem with the DnD chapter than with Lara being added. That said, back-to-back chapters that are playing it really loose with the association to horror (especially with so many actual horror characters that players want added) is concerning.

Yeah the timing wasn't great D&D and then Tomb Raider? And the month after that is Castlevania which is more of a Gothic Fantasy game than a Horror game (Though to be fair, it is probably the most instantly recognizable version of Dracula who IS a Horror character)

I really hope whoever the March character is is someone a bit more on-brand. The rumors say Jason, but the March Licensed killer is just a killer, no survivor, no map... Wouldn't Jason have Crystal Lake for his map and either Crayton Duke or Tommy Jarvis for his survivor?