so save the best for last, still good or gutted ?

[Ohen]

as some killers, will lose tokens just from using there power, like nemesis's infection, or slingers harpoon, even if that doesn't do any damage, still takes tokens, as it seems gutted to me, and that just makes me sad

[NotBadSlayer08]

Not gutted but fair and balance

Don't you love Nemesis perma 8 stacks without the survivors being able to counter/remove his stack ? Doesn't seems fair to me

Atleast now the killer have to leave the obsession alone to build up they're stack and survivors need to send obsession to remove his stacks ; fair and square.

I use it on Clown with Rapid Brutality and it work just fine.

[Crazy muffin]

Its a tunneling perk and you need to ignore the obsession at all time.

The perk was only usefull on certain killer now its only isefull if you want to tunnel.

Its a good change in a way because now killer like nemesis and demo will pick a slowdown perk instead so killer build will be even more set in stone so its easier to counter them.

[Facu]

Still useful and good. Not as good as before but still pretty damn good.

[Elikir]

Originally posted by Ohen:

as it seems gutted to me, and that just makes me sad

Gutted? no, we're still away from that point, but we're going to, its still a viable perk

But for me, the real problem is that, the "balance strategy of BHVR" which consist of nerfing everything until it sucks, then either buff some of the things you nerfed trough reverting nerfs/reworking the perk itself, or simply creating new OP perks available on license characters

Which result as, less and less "good/viable" options for killers, something which happens since years, but seems BHVR want to keep the same idea, if peoples want to know why tunneling and camping (which existed since the beta of DbD) became much more frequent than 2-3 years ago, don't look anywhere else, just see how they remove any viable strategy/builds one by one, until we only have one meta built in stone, camping and tunneling still intact

and i hope tunneling and camping stays as it is, as right now, removing those strategies completely would just destroy most killers and their players, as even the most expert need to resort to it against survivors team with same skill level (not every match/trial mind you), so imagine for your average killer?

Originally posted by NotBadSlayer08:

Not gutted but fair and balance

Don't you love Nemesis perma 8 stacks without the survivors being able to counter/remove his stack ? Doesn't seems fair to me

Atleast now the killer have to leave the obsession alone to build up they're stack and survivors need to send obsession to remove his stacks ; fair and square.

Except using his tentacle to hit the obsession means not getting the CD reduction? since it affect only base attacks

so instead of having few killers being able to hook the obsession time to time, just tunnel everyone else? just ignore the obsession until he's the only guy alive or else you lose stacks? are you sure you want to encourage or at least give even more reasons to tunnel when they already have every reasons to do it anyways?

Originally posted by Crazy muffin:

Its a good change in a way because now killer like nemesis and demo will pick a slowdown perk instead so killer build will be even more set in stone so its easier to counter them.

Except we're already using slowdown perks anyway? i mean from devs last stats survey, top 5 MOST PICKED/USED PERKS FOR KILLERS, 4/5 was slowdown perks (5 if sloppy butcher counts as one too)

STBFL was a perk only meaningful for M1 killers (guys like nemesis could use it, but its not mind blowing for him, he would also not use it fully, even less now), meaning a good/viable perks to help weak killers stay competitive, nerfing it when those same killers already struggle?
and in a few months, BHVR gonna also nerf sloppy butcher?

Are you sure you want every single player taking the exact 2 or 3 perks (mostly slowdowns) every build for every killer? are you sure you want to erase variety when there already not much?

[Ivan]

Originally posted by Ohen:

as some killers, will lose tokens just from using there power, like nemesis's infection, or slingers harpoon, even if that doesn't do any damage, still takes tokens, as it seems gutted to me, and that just makes me sad

I find it’s still useful despite the changes.

[the BIG sloppy]

It feels like its still effective. In my experience, I just need to be more mindful on preserving stacks as well as making sure I have a build more catered to complementing it. Don't get me wrong - its lost some of its bite, but it still fulfills its role the same way. At least, in my opinion.

[Spudsy]

ruined, along with almost all the killer "buffs" from that update. Fine if they wanted to remove the buff, but they did their usual and went overboard.

[glythe]

Originally posted by Ohen:

as some killers, will lose tokens just from using there power, like nemesis's infection, or slingers harpoon, even if that doesn't do any damage, still takes tokens, as it seems gutted to me, and that just makes me sad

You lose 2 stacks for whipping the obsession as Nemesis. That means the perk is utterly useless because you lose 6 stacks for using your power on that player.

Originally posted by NotBadSlayer08:

Not gutted but fair and balance

Don't you love Nemesis perma 8 stacks without the survivors being able to counter/remove his stack ? Doesn't seems fair to me

Atleast now the killer have to leave the obsession alone to build up they're stack and survivors need to send obsession to remove his stacks ; fair and square.

I use it on Clown with Rapid Brutality and it work just fine.

Which would you rather play against:

Blight/Nurse OR Nemesis with perma 8 stacks of STBFL? The honest answer is that Nemesis is far less powerful.

Why was Nemesis good with pre nerf STBFL? He wasn't required to get 12 hits to down 4 survivors. He needed 2 fresh whip hits and then could punch 3/4 players to death very rapidly.

Originally posted by A Mess (In my pants?!?):

It feels like its still effective.

You are incorrect. STBFL used to be "S" tier on killers like Pig/Nemesis who could preserve stacks if they were very skilled with their power. Now that skill expression is removed so that you are worse off using your power on those players.

Now STBFL is used only on M1 killers that do not have a damage power.

Originally posted by Spudsy:

ruined, along with almost all the killer "buffs" from that update.

This is the truth. It's a huge negative to use STBFL now on Nemesis, Pig or even Demo who didn't really need to use it before.

[erandomone]

It's real killer dependent, but it still rocks socks when you get it filled.

Even if the obsession figures it out and tries body blocking to get you to use charges? It's free damage / downs on the obsession. Win win.

[Dusty!]

The problem with STBFL is that is was a powerspike to killers who were bad. It was a strong perk but it was only viable on killers who were otherwise pretty bad.

I had the obsession bodyblock in my last three STBFL games. That was before nerfs. So right now, it feels like it's just an expensive gamble. Bodyblocking is extremely meta right now.

Only a slinger main could tell you if it's still good on slinger, as he's his own beast. I imagine they all lock it in because they want flashy hits more than wins, but in competetive, you probably will see them swap it out for NOED + agi.

[Ohen]

Originally posted by NotBadSlayer08:

Not gutted but fair and balance

Don't you love Nemesis perma 8 stacks without the survivors being able to counter/remove his stack ? Doesn't seems fair to me

Atleast now the killer have to leave the obsession alone to build up they're stack and survivors need to send obsession to remove his stacks ; fair and square.

I use it on Clown with Rapid Brutality and it work just fine.

gutted, as some killers lose stacks just for using there power, just infecting, not evne damaging infecting, takes tokens, meaning only killers with none damaging powers can use it

[Kitten]

Originally posted by Crazy muffin:

Its a tunneling perk and you need to ignore the obsession at all time.

The perk was only usefull on certain killer now its only isefull if you want to tunnel.

Its a good change in a way because now killer like nemesis and demo will pick a slowdown perk instead so killer build will be even more set in stone so its easier to counter them.

Incorrect. It's a chase perk.