Soooo why nerf gen kicking?

[Eevee Boy Ben]

So they're making it so gens can only "be regressed" a total of 8 times before it can no longer be regressed to avoid 3-genning, right?

So what's the point of maps? Deja Vu? Visionary? Any form of situational awareness?

What if the survs 3-gen themselves? Why is the KILLER punished for that? It's not THEIR fault at that point. The survs should get punished for that kind of play as they themselves weren't careful with any of their gen popping.

And the argument of "well the killer came with the sole intent of holding a 3-gen" doesn't hold water either as there are 4 survs. Use 1 surv to bait the killer away and have another work on that gen. The counter to 3-gens is not hard. It's just foresight and proper planning but again... survs wanna moan and cry because they want to play "loop the killer" instead of Dead By Daylight
Oh wait... what's the difference again?

[Onichan]

gen taps were removed btw, and fullfilling 8 regression events is just impossoble in a very average match

[Quasar]

Originally posted by Onichan:

gen taps were removed btw, and fullfilling 8 regression events is just impossoble in a very average match

I have had several killers deal with me without this being a problem. And they killed not just me, everyone.

[chasing for hugs]

Originally posted by Eevee Boy Ben:

...

What if the survs 3-gen themselves? Why is the KILLER punished for that? It's not THEIR fault at that point. The survs should get punished for that kind of play as they themselves weren't careful with any of their gen popping.

...

A good solution would require actual balancing of everything. But this isn't even a goal for the future. Trapper for example is officially viewed as beginner killer and therefore won't get a major buff. In a game where Nurse, Blight and Spirit exist, this is quite odd. In my opinion the leading factor for changes are popular demand and actual designer experiences in average-skilled environments.

[FatherOfTheAbyss]

Its going full on survivor coddle mode now, Because Survivors 3 gen themselves the Killer is punished. I have a feeling I'll stop playing Killer and maybe altogether. This is getting crazy. I guess accountability in Canada isn't a thing, I can't wait to see these long queue times, Behaviour how will you fix that? Asking for a friend who used to enjoy playing killer

[Jelly Sandwich]

Killers getting punished for survivor's bad play is nothing new.

[dragonoftime27]

Originally posted by Eevee Boy Ben:

So they're making it so gens can only "be regressed" a total of 8 times before it can no longer be regressed to avoid 3-genning, right?

So what's the point of maps? Deja Vu? Visionary? Any form of situational awareness?

What if the survs 3-gen themselves? Why is the KILLER punished for that? It's not THEIR fault at that point. The survs should get punished for that kind of play as they themselves weren't careful with any of their gen popping.

And the argument of "well the killer came with the sole intent of holding a 3-gen" doesn't hold water either as there are 4 survs. Use 1 surv to bait the killer away and have another work on that gen. The counter to 3-gens is not hard. It's just foresight and proper planning but again... survs wanna moan and cry because they want to play "loop the killer" instead of Dead By Daylight
Oh wait... what's the difference again?

Yep. survivor makes mistakes, its the killers fault. they 3gen themselves by refusing to have gen/map awareness but are stuck in this mindset that everytime its a 3gen its because the killer sits by the 3 closest gens and guards them from the start of the match, i cant imagine any killers that do this if maybe a few.

we try to tell them how to break 3gen. use of maps with addons, perks like deja vu and visonary, or just simply do gen #1 and instead of going right to gen#2, go to gen #3. But they're too stubborn to do either cause they dont want to waste perk slots, rather use toolboxes/flashlights, or just to use good thinking when completing gens.

they just want the devs to delete it for them

[Get down Mr President]

It's funny because a killer would usually run pain res which just basically requires just to hook a survivor and then we get to pop which you would use on different gens most of the time but in a 3 gen situation this becomes a problem but let me ask you this how many games have you had that there's a killer holding a 3 gen to begin with? I feel like the average answer would be not that many and good teams know how to break it but this is mainly solo queue I assume but still I don't come across often a killer who 3 gens it's mostly tunneling because I can assume that taking out a player would hinder gen progress of course and plus with all these gen regression perks the 3 gen situation seems all most uncommon (this might not be the case for some players!!) But I manly think that this is for casually players that aren't as experienced as some players are.

[Mahoroa]

Here we go again. Killers mains complaining about a change that actually benefits them. You will never be in a situation where you are regressing a single generator eight times in a match, with or without perks. The generator regression limit is practically irrelevant to the average killer. In return, base kicking regression was increased to 5% and survivor gen tapping is dead. It's crazy how anyone can interpret this update as a killer nerf.

[Pierce Dalton]

The answer for your question is in the patch notes:

"The 3-gen strategy (identifying the closest 3 Generators and defending only them) has become very strong, especially on certain Killers."

They're probably referring to high mobility killers and that's absolutely true. If survs 3 gen themselves, they already lost and that's a common thing in solo q due to the lack of communication between players.

[Pierce Dalton]

Originally posted by FatherOfTheAbyss:

Its going full on survivor coddle mode now, Because Survivors 3 gen themselves

It couldn't be any different without comms. What can you do? Stand behind people and shake your head expecting them to understand that gen shouldn't be done yet?

[Genna Strand]

Originally posted by Mahoroa:

Here we go again. Killers mains complaining about a change that actually benefits them. You will never be in a situation where you are regressing a single generator eight times in a match, with or without perks. The generator regression limit is practically irrelevant to the average killer. In return, base kicking regression was increased to 5% and survivor gen tapping is dead. It's crazy how anyone can interpret this update as a killer nerf.

Put the Surge Perk which is very random as term of efficiency and where it will actually take effect and see how fast 8 regress event takes to be gone. A lot of Gen regression perks just got nerfed here with this mechanic (Surge was only 1 example among those affected). But if you are a Survivor main, you probably don't know about that.

Survivors have to spend a huge 4.5 seconds (this is for a single survivor, no tool box and no perk to repair faster) in order to stabilise a gen, which is pretty ridiculous. I don't see how this update is not a Killer nerf.

Also, before you assume I am a Killer Main, I am not. I play both side and I have been playing more and more Survivor lately. I mean, we Survivors are getting pretty pampered.

[Jingo]

It just prevents eternal 3-genning at the cost of making gen kicks stronger and avoiding rapid gen taps. It is one of the more fair parts of the update as 3gens will still be very strong, just not near unbreakable anymore.

[MasterGorak]

Originally posted by Mahoroa:

Here we go again. Killers mains complaining about a change that actually benefits them. You will never be in a situation where you are regressing a single generator eight times in a match, with or without perks. The generator regression limit is practically irrelevant to the average killer. In return, base kicking regression was increased to 5% and survivor gen tapping is dead. It's crazy how anyone can interpret this update as a killer nerf.

Most of the nerfs are for killers. For survivors, the only downsides are that the kick takes an extra 2.25 seconds to recover from and that you can't stabilize a gen while being actively pursued by a killer (which imho shouldn't have been possible in the first place).

If I take your assertion that killers will never have 8 or more regression events (which includes a lot more than just kicks) in a single game, then a killer that kicks a gen repeatedly would add at most 18 seconds (8 * 2.25) of extra work (so about 1.5 failed skill checks) while guaranteeing that it cannot go above that.

And given killers that repeatedly kicks gen usually use a perk with that (like eruption). With the kick and the perk both counting as events, that means that killers are unlikely to get more than 4 or 5 kicks. So 10-12 extra seconds max (or about a single failed skill check).

The damage from the kick itself was barely noticeable, it was the time required to walk to the gen and stabilize it that usually damaged it the most. The only actual significant downgrade for survivors is that we can't stabilize gens instantly anymore. Seriously, if you are doing a gen less than 4 seconds, you probably shouldn't have been there so soon in the first place.

So whining that it was this update is a nerf for survivors shows that you clearly don't play killer and have little understanding of the game as a whole. I spent a lot more time playing survivor and even I can see that.

[Weruat]

Originally posted by FatherOfTheAbyss:

Its going full on survivor coddle mode now, Because Survivors 3 gen themselves the Killer is punished. I have a feeling I'll stop playing Killer and maybe altogether. This is getting crazy. I guess accountability in Canada isn't a thing, I can't wait to see these long queue times, Behaviour how will you fix that? Asking for a friend who used to enjoy playing killer

"Why yes, I start every match by finding the 3 closest gens and kicking them repeatedly with Overcharge and Nowhere to hide and never chase, how could the survivor 3 gen themselves, that's a skill issue." If a Killer is kicking a gen more than 8 times that's an issue, and this change is meant to specifically affect them because BHVR doesn't want that playstyle to be encouraged. There's a quote about this "If given the opportunity Players will optimize the fun out of the game, one of the responsibilities of the designer is to protect players from themselves." and in this case that's what BHVR's attempting to do, and I think they nailed it since the actual trigger for not being able to regress is pretty high at 8 whole events, on top of that, they buffed kicking and made gen tapping not work anymore

[Melinko]

Originally posted by Weruat:

Originally posted by FatherOfTheAbyss:

Its going full on survivor coddle mode now, Because Survivors 3 gen themselves the Killer is punished. I have a feeling I'll stop playing Killer and maybe altogether. This is getting crazy. I guess accountability in Canada isn't a thing, I can't wait to see these long queue times, Behaviour how will you fix that? Asking for a friend who used to enjoy playing killer

"Why yes, I start every match by finding the 3 closest gens and kicking them repeatedly with Overcharge and Nowhere to hide and never chase, how could the survivor 3 gen themselves, that's a skill issue." If a Killer is kicking a gen more than 8 times that's an issue, and this change is meant to specifically affect them because BHVR doesn't want that playstyle to be encouraged. There's a quote about this "If given the opportunity Players will optimize the fun out of the game, one of the responsibilities of the designer is to protect players from themselves." and in this case that's what BHVR's attempting to do, and I think they nailed it since the actual trigger for not being able to regress is pretty high at 8 whole events, on top of that, they buffed kicking and made gen tapping not work anymore

If it was just 8 kicks that would be one thing, but it is 8 regression events. Surge, Pain Res, Kicks, Eruption, these things add up quickly and 8 will be an easier number to hit than people think unless you just want a 5 minute gen rush/tunnel 1 survivor out style of play only from now on. That is exactly where this is headed.

I'd much rather they not touch the gen stuff (except the touch to stop regression, that actually makes sense) and focus more on the tunneling aspect of the game. If survivors can't figure out how to break a 3 gen or how to be careful with what gens they are doing, that's on them. So few killers actually enter a game and go, these 3 gens I'm protecting all match. It's just not going to work.