Cannibalism and Albinism

[Jeigura †]

Since cannibalism seems to be fairly common in the new version of Evirma and there were rumors that cannibalistic players would become more identifiable because after so much cannibalism their dinos would be made albino somehow. Is that still planned in the future?

Also, I think the customizable color system we had back in legacy was kinda silly because the dinosaurs stopped looking like a species since there were all these weird different colors. I think there should just be pattern variants and maybe the occasional rare albino/melanistic mutation. After all, it's a survival game not a fashion/skin simulator, but it would be nice for albinos to stick out like a sore thumb as the punishment for a prominent cannibalistic playstyle.

Now, if albinism worked this way, I guess those players that are elusive and manage to go without being killed often would probably get rewarded with a melanistic mutation as darker animals tend to be harder to find in a jungle environment. I also think if such features were implemented they should be random, as in your dino just spawns with that appearance, and not something the player can choose but maybe can be passed on to hatchlings.

[xXDruidXx]

The reason (other than because your species will die off) for cannibalism being inherently bad and not just socially unacceptable is because you're much more likely to catch diseases off of your own species, or a similar species. That's why most animals avoid it for the majority of time. (The exceptions being males killing other males offspring so they can get mating rights and give their offspring a better survival chance and females eating their babies as a last resort when they themselves will otherwise starve).

Most animals avoid killing their own species when possible because the after effects of such a close match-up often also result in their death (infection of wounds and such).

I think turning a creature from one colour-albino would look out of place to me. Although getting ill/looking ill I could get behind. Something players couldn't really spot from afar but if you're paying enough attention to you could spot things like mouth sores and such before getting within biting range.

[PEEBOY]

that isnt true if youre using real life as an example to why cannibalism is bad. cannibalism is bad because humans say its bad. cannibalism is so common in nature. honestly...just look it up.

[Pablo Croft]

Even if albinism had nothing to do with killing (like in my second example above) these players would be treated the same way. killed on sight, and never allowed in groups. Not sure a player should be subject to that too lightly.

Diminishing effects, and or diseases work better, IMO. It's about the eating.

[xXDruidXx]

Messaggio originale di ryan:

that isnt true if youre using real life as an example to why cannibalism is bad. cannibalism is bad because humans say its bad. cannibalism is so common in nature. honestly...just look it up.

I am not saying cannibalism doesn't happen. It is however, not good for you for health reasons.

[PEEBOY]

Messaggio originale di xXDruidXx:

I am not saying cannibalism doesn't happen. It is however, not good for you for health reasons.

its actually the reason why animals in nature are cannibals...for health reasons.

did you have a pet rabbit? rabbits are known cannibals.
chickens? cannibals
frogs? cannibals
hamsters? cannibals
crabs, fish, snakes, spiders, bugs, etc etc

chimps share a dna sequence almost identical to humans...guess what?

[xXDruidXx]

Messaggio originale di ryan:

Messaggio originale di xXDruidXx:

I am not saying cannibalism doesn't happen. It is however, not good for you for health reasons.

its actually the reason why animals in nature are cannibals...for health reasons.

did you have a pet rabbit? rabbits are known cannibals.
chickens? cannibals
frogs? cannibals
hamsters? cannibals
crabs, fish, snakes, spiders, bugs, etc etc

chimps share a dna sequence almost identical to humans...guess what?

As I have said. I know it happens, particularly in desperate times.
You are however, much more likely to get sick from eating your own species or a similar species. Humans have actually caused quite a few animals to show increased levels of cannibalism by causing so much stress and/or cramped conditions.

Getting sick from eating your own species too often further shows the gritty reality of nature imo.

[Pablo Croft]

Cannibalism needs to be an act of desperation. Disease, or the more you eat, the less they fill you ensures this. It stops players from abusing cannibalism as a means of just staying in one place and surviving off their group. Butting heads against the idea of players needing to roam -like the developers want.

A third situation is when a player(s) are hunting another group of the same species non-stop. Not the more common situation of running into random players. Occasionally, you run into your own kind, but not always.

[xXDruidXx]

Look up Tasmanian devil facial tumour diseases if you need an example :)

The disease spreads between the species because they are a very aggressive species and so bite each other frequently.
There are special breeding programmes going on to try save the species because so many of them killed each other off by spreading the fatal disease. They only needed to bite each other, not even cannibalise.

[PEEBOY]

the diseases associated with cannibalism arent generic and dont apply to every species on the planet. the diseases humans get from cannibalism isnt the same disease a rabbit is going to get.

[xXDruidXx]

Messaggio originale di ryan:

the diseases associated with cannibalism isnt generic and doesnt apply to every species on the planet. the diseases humans get from cannibalism isnt the same disease a rabbit is going to get.

I know. I never said to make it genetic. Which is why I said I'm against it turning players albino but am okay with creatures getting/looking sick from frequently killing/eating their own species.

Edit: I also think different species in Evrima should be affected by this at varying levels. Some species have better immunity against such things.

I also understand that the diseases caught are different from species to species. But that is exactly my point. You're more likely to get sick from killing/eating your own species than if you kill and eat another.

[PEEBOY]

and the argument im making is that disfiguring someones dino because they ate their own species doesnt solve the underlying issues youre all trying to solve, not from a game play perspective and not from a natural perspective.

punishing someone for stumbling across a corpse makes no sense on multiple levels in terms of the game (gameplay and technical). consuming the food ensures you get to survive because of the misfortune of someone else, continuing the ecosystem of the server and balancing the population. finding food is hard enough already. consuming a corpse removes it from the world, freeing up server resources.

it also makes no sense from a natural perspective, its a fact that cannibalism actually increases the survival rate of the cannibals themselves. they didnt keel over and die of some disease or get mutated/mutilated from doing it. the whole point of natural cannibalism is nutrition conservation. your friend died? eat it. your babies are about to be eaten by a predator? eat them. you hatched on your moms back and there isnt enough food? eat her.

the issue people have is that their own species is murdering each other. trying to solve cannibalism in an attempt to fix same species murder is like trying to swap tires on a car when the battery is dead. replace the wheel...it still wont move.

[xXDruidXx]

Messaggio originale di ryan:

and the argument im making is that disfiguring someones dino because they ate their own species doesnt solve the underlying issues youre all trying to solve, not from a game play perspective and not from a natural perspective.

punishing someone for stumbling across a corpse makes no sense on multiple levels in terms of the game. consuming the food ensures you get to survive because of the misfortune of someone else continuing the ecosystem of the server and balancing the population. consuming a corpse removes it from the world, freeing up server resources.

it also makes no sense from a natural perspective, its a fact that cannibalism actually increases the survival rate of the cannibals themselves. they didnt keel over and die of some disease or get mutated/mutilated from doing it.

the issue people have is that their own species is murdering each other. trying to solve cannibalism in an attempt to fix same species murder is like trying to swap tires on a car when the battery is dead. replace the wheel...it still wont move.

No Ryan, that is not my point.
We are not talking about a single (or couple) of desperate acts where you must resort to eating your own kind.
I am talking about players who repeatedly kill or eat their own species on a regular basis.
Yes eating your own species when you're on the brink of death could save your life (from starvation) but doing it often is most probably going to get you sick and make you unhealthier than non-cannibals.

Personally, I am not advocating the sickness to punish and eradicate cannibal players. I am advocating it to add depth to Evrima. Make players think. Should I really eat that? Is it worth the risk? If you are starving the answer is probably yes. If not, then you should probably leave it for a hungrier player.
A side effect is that a long term cannibal/killer of their own species, especially if they are eating their own species raw is probably going to get sick (it's a realistic consequence) .

[PEEBOY]

I know what youre talking about and ive already said it. people who murder their own species. ive said it in almost every single post ive made in this thread. trying to solve cannibalism does not solve this issue. these people arent killing their own kind for the food...they are killing EVERYTHING. ive never run into a person who refuses to eat anything except their own species. im sure some people have opted to play this way, but now youre talking about changing up the entire game, affecting the entire player base, just because of a few outliers.

the issues you all have is same species murder. ill go as far to say you all despise people who are killing for sport/fun of any species. the way you solve it isnt punishing cannibalism. the way you solve it is by introducing mechanics that encourage players to want to live beyond just being adult and giving rewards and incentives for doing so. if the game offered more to do currently than grow, kill, die you would probably see a lot more people not risking their lives to kill their own kind in an equal match up.

[xXDruidXx]

Messaggio originale di ryan:

I know what youre talking about and ive already said it. people who murder their own species. ive said it in almost every single post ive made in this thread. trying to solve cannibalism does not solve this issue. these people arent killing their own kind for the food...they are killing EVERYTHING. ive never run into a person who refuses to eat anything except their own species. im sure some people have opted to play this way, but now youre talking about changing up the entire game, affecting the entire player base, just because of a few outliers.

the issues you all have is same species murder. ill go as far to say you all despise people who are killing for sport/fun of any species. the way you solve it isnt punishing cannibalism. the way you solve it is by introducing mechanics that encourage players to want to live beyond just being adult and giving rewards and incentives for doing so. if the game offered more to do currently than grow, kill, die you would probably see a lot more people not risking their lives to kill their own kind in an equal match up.

That may be other peoples point. It isn't mine. The game is about gritty survival and the harsh reality it brings. Simple pvp doesn't really show that, it shows a small aspect of it.

I am against the idea of cannibals turning white/albino because I don't feel as though that represents what the game is trying to portray. Punishing cannibals simply for eating their own kind is too flat and not really a fair representative of nature.

I do however think that players showing blisters, sores and likewise as an after effect of desperate acts (eating your own species to survive) or if you are simply a player going through and killing everything in sight, (including your own species) in reality that is madness and so there should be an aftereffect to it.
Players can also use this to think... ah I should probably avoid them. If they are frequently killing their own species, they are probably going to also kill me.
If they are desperate enough to eat their own species, then they are probably willing to kill and eat me too.

I think this visual should fade out over time too. If a player has gotten better/recovered (stopped eating their own species).

[bigmoe808]

Messaggio originale di chappy:

Messaggio originale di bigmoe808:

I didn't say you did, I explained why it was bad.

Well you implied it by your choice of words:

Messaggio originale di bigmoe808:

You want to punish people for doing something other players can easily counter by being cautious. You want to give players revenge that they didn't earn.

Punish Cannibals because you couldn't be bothered to think that maybe you shouldn't just walk towards the deadly animal as if you were long time friends-no.

These are accusatory statements and it's actually rude.

If we're going to play with implications, you did imply that you want to punish cannibals by making this entire post.

Stick to your guns.