Is this lag?

[TheShadowHatter]

Hoping I can get help here, but so far whenever I dash, or even at random moments in the game. I'll end up at the beginning of a location before I do an action.

A better way to explain this would be.

1. I start under some tree
2. I dash to the right for a second
3. I end up back under the tree again

another example

1. I am walking by some monsters and decide to eliminate a few
2. I head to the right or something real quick
3. I end up back where I killed the monsters before heading that right

my system is enough to run games like GTAV at top settings at 60fps and this game runs at 60fps just fine too, but this lag? whatever this is keeps happening and it's getting annoying.

is this an issue with the game all around? or is there a way I can fix it?

EDIT:

here's a video to help show what I mean

https://youtu.be/XY8-X7JIdDc

[76561198324547686]

It might be because your internet connection is slow

[TheShadowHatter]

Originally posted by Takaji:

It might be because your internet connection is slow

can't be that. I can play 60fps videos on YouTube with no problem at all, play in other MMOs perfectly no lag (unless I'm raiding and there's millions of things happening at once), among other things.

[76561198324547686]

Try restarting ToS and Steam, if the issue is still coming try restarting your PC and your Router or Pocket Wifi, and if the issue is still there it might be bug or a glitch

[TheShadowHatter]

Originally posted by Takaji:

Try restarting ToS and Steam, if the issue is still coming try restarting your PC and your Router or Pocket Wifi, and if the issue is still there it might be bug or a glitch

I've been playing this game for long enough to know restarting ToS, Steam, or my PC isn't going to do a thing.

Also no pocket wifi or router because I'm connected to the internet directly.

[TheShadowHatter]

updated the OP with a video to show off what I'm talking about in case it helps.

I seriously hope this isn't somehow an issue on my end, but something that can be fixed. Idk why it's only this game that's giving me trouble when I'm doing good with games like GTAV, GW2, PSO2, etc.

https://youtu.be/XY8-X7JIdDc

[Elodean]

I wouldn't use the term "lag" in any kind of problem request because it is so vague and everybody seems to have a different idea of what it means these days.

If you're getting rubberbanded, then I would first check the network. Just because you can stream a video at a high rate doesn't mean you have good latency. (Old Satellite based broadband used to get you >10mbit but with a 2000ms roundtrip, it was useless for games.) You should check to see if other people are using the network, and especially if you have any kind of "optimized" traffic-shaping router in your network topography. Those sometimes don't play nice with network sensitive software.

Also, if you are on some kind of wireless connection for your computer, you should expect inconsistent network behavior. Wireless is subject to all sorts of loss and jitter, even in close range.

Just because one product works well doesn't mean that your system/environment is going to work well for another product. Tree of Savior is a very different game in terms of technology and scope compared to something like GTA. I will say that rubberbanding is unusual for this game; I rarely see it and I play on an old Surface Pro 2 on a 1mbit connection.

[TheShadowHatter]

Originally posted by Elodean:

I wouldn't use the term "lag" in any kind of problem request because it is so vague and everybody seems to have a different idea of what it means these days.

That's why I ended up being as descriptive as I can and ended up creating the video. I know the term rubberbanding but I completely forgot about it so I just stuck to lag as it seems to get more attention.

Originally posted by Elodean:

If you're getting rubberbanded, then I would first check the network. Just because you can stream a video at a high rate doesn't mean you have good latency. (Old Satellite based broadband used to get you >10mbit but with a 2000ms roundtrip, it was useless for games.) You should check to see if other people are using the network, and especially if you have any kind of "optimized" traffic-shaping router in your network topography. Those sometimes don't play nice with network sensitive software.


Also, if you are on some kind of wireless connection for your computer, you should expect inconsistent network behavior. Wireless is subject to all sorts of loss and jitter, even in close range.

All I can say is my computer is wired straight to a router ethernet port on the second slot since my brother is connected to the first. Also I don't believe I have any sort of traffic-shaping router tbh.

Originally posted by Elodean:

Just because one product works well doesn't mean that your system/environment is going to work well for another product. Tree of Savior is a very different game in terms of technology and scope compared to something like GTA. I will say that rubberbanding is unusual for this game; I rarely see it and I play on an old Surface Pro 2 on a 1mbit connection.

I guess I figured saying GTAV would make it easier, but I suppose not. My general message by using GTA was to say that every other online game I play never has me experiencing rubberbanding. From games like Phantasy Star Online 2, Guild Wars 2, World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy 14, Wildstar, etc. But this seems to be the only online game I play where I experience issues such as this.

Rubberbanding is such an unusal experience for myself too which is why I brought the issue here because I was hoping this was an issue with the game itself and the devs were hard at work to fix it, but it seems everyone's general consensus is that it's an issue on my end, though I can't really pin point what it is since this has never happened to me before.

[Nithralder]

I would advise that you disable Nagle's Algorithim.

Nagle’s algorithm combines several small packets into a single, larger packet for more efficient transmissions. This is designed to improve throughput efficiency of data transmission. Disabling “nagling” can help reduce latency/ping in most games. Nagle’s algorithm is enabled in Windows by default.

To implement this tweak, modify the following registry keys.

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Tcpip\Parameters\Interfaces{NIC-id}

For the {NIC-id}, look for the one with your IP address listed. Under this {NIC-id} key, create the following DWORD value:
TcpAckFrequency and set it to 1 to disable “nagling” for gaming.
TCPNoDelay and set it also to 1 to disable “nagling”
TcpDelAckTicks and set it to 0

Here is a video that someone posted in case you are lost on how to do this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6WPE3NGB0k



Additional Windows Tweaks

Disable Throttling

- Windows implements a network throttling mechanism. Disabling this can also reduce latency in most games.

To implement this tweak, run regedit and modify the registry

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\Multimedia\SystemProfile.

Under SystemProfile, create a DWORD value and name it to “NetworkThrottlingIndex” then set its Hexadecimal value to ffffffff for gaming and max throughput: ffffffff completely disables throttling.



System Gaming Responsiveness
Windows uses something called “Multimedia Class Scheduler” service. Basically this dictates how much CPU a given process will use (in our case games). By Default it is set to 80% meaning that 20% of your CPU power is not being used at all. To Fix this run regedit and modify the registry key

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows
NT\CurrentVersion\Multimedia\SystemProfile

From there, create a new DWORD and name it to “SystemResponsiveness” set its hexadecimal value to 00000000 for pure gaming/streaming.

[Nithralder]

Additional tweaks to help Tree of Savior not run like garbage.

First download and install Notepad ++
https://notepad-plus-plus.org/

This is a text editor that doesn't mess up formatting such as Notepad or Wordpad.


1. Next on your steam library look for Tree of Savior in your game list

2. Right Click on Tree of Savior and go to properties

3. A Box should Pop up, Click on the Local Files Tab

4. Click on "BROWSE LOCAL FILES" This will take you to where Tree of Savior is installed

5. Go inside of the "release" folder

6. Look for a file called user.xml (If you do not have file name extensions turned on it will probably just say user)

http://kb.winzip.com/kb/entry/26/ Guide to enabling file extensions

7. Right click on user.xml and click on Edit with Notepad ++

With User.xml open we have access to some advanced settings



Things we want to change

BitPerPixel
Basically this changes the color depth of each pixel. You can set it to 16, 24,32
Set this to 16

Resolution Mode
1 = Windows Borderless Full Screen
0 = Fullscreen
Setting this to Full Screen can improve your FPS and also fix problems with your minimap

UseFastLoading
0 = Off
1 = On
Turning this on may improve loading times by streaming the next maps in the background.
Doesn't seem to make much of a difference for me.

UseEnvEffect
Set this to 0, this will help with FPS as the environmental effects are poorly optimized

UseCharLod
Set this to 0

UseEffectHigh
Set this to 0

DrawActorPersent
This sets how many players, including NPCS to be shown on a screen at once. By Default this is 99, set this to a lower number to help out in crowded towns. Set to around 15-40

DrawMonsterPersent
This shows how many monsters can be on screen at once, set this to a lower amount if your PC is struggling. I would suggest leaving this on default.

UseGlow
Set this to 0

UseFXAA
0=off
1=on
Toggles off/on FXAA Anti-Aliasing. Personally I left this on because jagged edges on my screen make me cry. You can toggle this off for extra FPS but the game will look like garbage.

UseWarfog
Set this to 0

UseBloom
Set this to 0

UseHighTexture
Doesnt seem to make much of a difference, leave it on

Vsync
Set this to 0

Optional
Enable Japanese Voices
http://imgur.com/a/7QIrE

On the bottom of of the XML, next to the sound options is LANGUAGE. Put in Japanese to get Japanese voices in the game

[TheShadowHatter]

Originally posted by Nithralder:

.

Followed everything you said, but it seems now the game just won't open at all. I click play on Steam, the Tree of Savior downloader client shows up as usual, but after it disappears the game doesn't start at all. I ended up verifying the integrity of the game cache which ended up reaquiring 21 files and the problem still hasn't corrected itself.

I guess I'll reinstall and hopefully that works out.

EDIT: WOW....even reinstalling isn't helping.

[Sloarien]

Editing the user.xml file may or may not prevent the game from opening properly all the time depending on what's changed. Also some addons may cause that problem as well.

Reinstalling does not delete this file either. It needs to be manually deleted. Most of the .xml files are like that.

[Elodean]

Rubberbanding in networked games usually means the game needs to reset your position because the client is out of synchronization with the server and thus the game forces you back to where the server thinks you belong. It usually means lost packets, out-of-order data, or sometimes a race condition between player input and when the player gets some kind of event that contradicts the input.

Nagle is a TCP optimization that doesn't necessarily hurt games like Tree of Savior. It is, in fact, quite useful for high latency connections because it reduces the roundtrip overhead of numerous small TCP packets. However, I don't know the way Tree of Savior handles networking, so you can try disabling Nagle and see if it helps. Also, network intensive games like Tree of Savior most certainly use UDP for certain network traffic as well; Nagle Algorithm is not a factor there.

One thing you must check is the router configuration. In the past, the XBox 360 had issues with certain routers that don't support what's known as a "Cone Shaped NAT". The details are complicated and center around permissions and persistence of port forwarding rules. I don't think your problem is the same as the 360 issue (because then you likely wouldn't be able to connect bat all). I bring it up because today's "automagic" routers make a bunch of assumptions and may need some application-specific customization to work properly.

Starting in Vista, Windows uses a revamped "auto-tuning" TCP/IP stack. In the past, this auto-tuning stack had some issues with certain network configurations. There used to be a bunch of tools to analyze your network, but most of them seem to be gone now (probably because these stupid browsers keep changing and Java keeps getting security sandboxed). You can still go to BroadbandReports and do some line quality tests as a start:

http://www.dslreports.com/pingtest

They also have the most detailed speed test, which provides a lot more detail which may help you identify potential problems:

http://www.dslreports.com/speedtest

And finally, if you corrupted your Tree of Savior install, as other said, you have to manually delete the game data. Make sure anything related with Tree of Savior is gone from the SteamApps/common directory.

ONE MORE THING... When you're making rather unsanctioned changes, don't make too many changes at one time or you might get all sorts of weird behavior and you won't know what caused the problem. Do one thing at a time - for instance, make the registry changes to disable Nagle and then check the game.

[TheShadowHatter]

Thanks for the replies guys. It's really nice to get some support for this issue and hope we end up with a solution too.

I ended up doing both of the dlsreport links and this is the results of the pingtest:

http://www.dslreports.com/pingtest/248627ca5acc/3408314?r=489

and this is the result for the speedtest:

http://www.dslreports.com/speedtest/8287313

I'll go ahead and follow your steps about the xml file and see how this goes.

EDIT: deleted the xml filed and validated the game to reaquire the file. That didn't work so I ended up uninstalling the game from Steam and deleting it's whole folder and reinstalling. Then I had an issue with some .apk errors so I troubleshooted a solution where I had to edit a release txt file to change the update number and blah blah and that didn't work. I ended up re-validating the game to get the remaining files and now the game opens up to the server screen, but whenever I try to connect to ANY server the game, once I click enter, the "connecting to server" prompt shows up for 2 seconds and fades away and nothing happens. I spam the enter button and the same result happens, I even try different servers and the same thing happens.

This game has me at my wits end.

[Deathman.Kenshi]

In game write to normal chat (no team, guild, shout, whisper)

//ping

And write number here ;3

if its above 0.1 or so its lagy
Cause 0.1 is around 100ms what is minimum to play some more dynamic classes (QS3)

[Elodean]

Your network connection looks great for simple line tests, but you have major buffering problems. The range for your downloads and uploads may average low but have huge spikes over 2000ms under load. Something is definitely up with your network configuration. Your connection also shows some retransmits - for these tests, you shouldn't need any retransmits, but your speed test results show 2.5-4.3% retransmits depending on server. I'm throwing a guess out here that your TCP receive window that Windows auto-tunes is not appropriate for the network environment.

BroadBand Reports has a good description of what they call "Bufferbloat" which is your problem:

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/17883

It could be that Windows auto-tuning TCP stack has set an inappropriate TCP RWIN (receive window) size. For an overview of RWIN, look at:

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/626

The problem is that you can't adjust RWIN under the new Windows TCP/IP stack. At best, you can trick Windows into setting a smaller RWIN by getting an old 10mbit hub and plugging your computer into it, then plugging the hub uplink into your main router/switch. That makes Windows think you're on a 10mbit connection and will negotiate a much lower RWIN size. If your RWIN is higher than what your ISP is willing to buffer, then heavy loads will overrun your ISP's buffering and force retransmits, causing an otherwise "fast" connection to stutter a bit.

Oh, one more thing you can try if your network driver allows it: if you go to your Control Panel and open up Device Manager, find your main network adapter. Right click on it to view the properties. Most adapters have an "Advanced" tab that allows you to set "Speed & Duplex". Set it to 10mbit full duplex and try the speed test again. (This is equivalent to forcing a 10mbit link.)

BY THE WAY... Last night, when you were trying to connect, you were failing because they were doing server maintenance. Remember maintenance is normally between 00:00:00EST and 04:00:00EST Tuesday mornings (Monday midnight). Without fail, you always see one or two frustrated posts about the connection failures during maintenance. (: