More Useful Talents Than Others.

[Samseng Yik]

I completed 30+ normal missions. And these are my opinions about some talents.
Talents that I didn't mentioned mean I don't even learn it due to my feeling to other talents.

Engineer (My engineer doesn't have the heat or time to do other things)
= Sentry Turret - very good talents. Can save a lot your templar heat by defending path that constantly get attacked. Resupply only need 200 SP.
= Capture - good only to make your mission go faster. The damage increase per level is very very very low.
= Heatsink - Not sure how other feel about heat. Even with heatsink, my other templars still constantly have their heat 100+.

Soldier (My soldiers are shooter and overwatcher. He also sometimes buff movement)
= Burst Fire - Low heat and good AOE.
= Shredding Fire - good in theory, but PEN gain per level ARE WAY TOO LOW !!!
= Rallying - I make this to 2 MP, this really help me melee templars move into good spot for AOE attack. Also help engineer capture TACT earlier for earlier SP generation.
= Overwatch - Sometimes I saw xeno directly walk pass and no trigger. Weird.
= Grenade - Useful when only has 1 AP.

Nepture (I use Neptune only in few missions, but I think developer put too much heat into Nepture, and Neptune skills only slightly better than other in term of shooting)
= Full Auto Burst - very very high heat and doesn't much better than Soldiers standard burst.
= Concentrated Fire - good damage and lower heat when your target is alone.
= Semi Burst - I prefer this more than Full Auto Burst, because the heat is lower. Unless got special situation.

Paladin (Exactly what it say on the tin, Heal and Tank and Slash)
= Slay - Standard slash
= Shalun Wrath - I always use this for the buff, once in few turns. Because I don't know it will stack or not.
= Holy Light - unique healing that no other classes access to. I cannot imagine harder campaign without Paladin this skill
= Shield Buff - Important when moving into unknown or xeno infested area.

Berserker (Berserker do all melee thing better than other melee class and thats all)
= Chop - normal heat saving attack
= Unbalancing Blow - Use on dangerous target, or if I have no confidence to kill it this turn.
= Berserker AOE - AOE melee. Need some MP buff for better position.
= Shield Buff - Important when moving into unknown or xeno infested area.
= Grenade - Useful when only has 1 AP, or I need to kill something but don't have the MP to reach.
= Indomitable - Very high heat, in exchange for some hope to counter attack. ONLY 1 TURN !

I didn't use other class save for few mission demands.

[Trese Brothers]

Great guide to your strategy and talent use! Did you ever consider posting this as a Guide on Steam so that others could find it more reliably? Great strategy!

[Samseng Yik]

My post is actually about "how useless" are other talents.
Those other talents I will only use when I really nothing to do and low heat.

[Deadworth]

Umm.... yeah. The other talents are not useless. One of the successes of this game are the multiple ways to play it.

Playstyle is a factor.

[Samseng Yik]

OK. I will wait other show case their play style and different talent which still can win the game within turn target.

[Trese Brothers]

Originally posted by DFunck:

Umm.... yeah. The other talents are not useless. One of the successes of this game are the multiple ways to play it.

Playstyle is a factor.

I'm glad you find that in the game. Thanks for posting!

@samseng - use Neptune in every level I play with my current Battleforce and still beat the levels under turn cap, so right there -- we have a different strategy :D

[LeftPaw]

My strategy is to make the xeno laugh that much at my strategy that they forget who it was they were suppose to kill. Works every time.

I hope you realize I haven't got any work done for two days. This game should come with a health warning. ;)

[etalian]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

Originally posted by DFunck:

Umm.... yeah. The other talents are not useless. One of the successes of this game are the multiple ways to play it.

Playstyle is a factor.

I'm glad you find that in the game. Thanks for posting!

@samseng - use Neptune in every level I play with my current Battleforce and still beat the levels under turn cap, so right there -- we have a different strategy :D

How you even do this?

Neptune seems week due to the high heat problem and also how other classes like Soldier bring in more utility in addition to overwatch.

[Samseng Yik]

etalian, ignore the Nepture starting shooting talent.
Go learn another 2 which heat are much lower.

I not sure why the Nepture default fire is 5x of Soldier burst.
Probably it is something super strong in developers' mind

[redshadovv]

I'm playing on brutal with ranged capt, 3 scouts, engineer when necesarry, and hydra when 6th slot is open.

For engineer I find that I level turret enough to unlock the next tier of weapon for it and then try to spare a point into capture which increases the base damage on it +1. Turret is defneitely the top engineer skill as having 2 turrets up is about as good as having an extra well equipped soldier without the SP cost and the liability of actually having that soldier. It's really hard to consider leveling the other abilities on engineer when turret is so good and capture makes him do what is often the mission objective faster which makes you win faster and take less casualties, etc.

For the scouts I level piercing fire and the +MS/+dodge/+stealth skill (forget name) to 3 for the +MS. Once I get the scouts to a level where they can spec for a lot of crit, I try to switch oput all the equips from +dmg to +crit and switch the points in piercing fire to headshot. I'm finding that staying with piercing fire tends to perform better tho (currently lvl 15 scouts).
Null Field: I don't see any reason to use null field as the only mission where I really saw a use for stealth was the gates of tundeer where I sent one lone scout to the east gate and enemies didn't home in on him due to using that +MS buff. I think this skill would only be useful on missions specifically designed for stealth and even then I would respec out of it when not in those missions.
Field of Focus: I guess you could max just this and turn your scout into a one-hit-ko turret but perhaps you're better off with a class that can deploy overwatch. Viable, but not something I would use considering that missions tend to be designed around rewarding rushing the objectives rather than stationary defense. Theres also the issue of heat to consider. All sccout attacks cost 6 heat and this costs extra heat as well. Granted you can pretty much ignore heat if you have enough fo a HP buffer and know you will finish the mission quickly
Crippling Fire: You could max this and use in conjunction with needlers to tag enemies and laugh in their ugly alien mugs as they hopelessly flounder after you and eventually die. This probably wouldn't work so well in my setup as soemtimes I need to kill things in front of me quickly and this wouldn't cut it but it definetly could be useful in more diverse templar squad.

For captain, I think you can pretty much pick w/e you want as all his skills are useful and generally efficient. I put 4 points into the 1AP MS buff for +2MS to help the mission critical templars (engineer, hydra, scentist Throll) get to the objective faster. One point into shredding fire for AOE and the rest dumped into honing. I never felt like leveling the two basic attacks, grandes or commanders confidence was really worth it. Thos abilities just don't stand out to me like the MS buff and honing.

[FieserMoep]

Originally posted by etalian:

How you even do this?

With some willpower Heat is no problem at all.

About the OPs Post:

Enginneer:

Was a Fan of Sentries first, later on I never used them again. They might seem nice though there are not many spots worth defending. And heat on my Neptunes is no problem. Also with overwatch being not that great later on they are just some delay mechanic I do not care for I can outrun the xenos. They bring not much to my tactic.

As for capture I advise to just skill it so that you have 3 minimal damage. It is more reliable and faster yet beyond that point hardly worth it. As you said: Speeds things up and that makes even less defense time.

Heatsink sounded nice at first yet my entire force is always overheated so no chance for it have a great impact. Also willpower is way better to battle heat than this.

Powerfield on the other hand is great and the most usefull ability of the Engineer in my build that heavily relies on stacking buffs where possible and working with the "Prolonged Deployment Ordonance". Later on it gets realy noticable and when the Defs add deflection it will be beast. Already save many lives so far and made rushing more viable.

[Edit:] Forgot Fortiy Position, its nice yet I focus on Powerfield first. Later on it might be a devastating combination with calling shots.

Soldier:

Burst Fire is nice yet inferior to Neptunes full auto.

Rallying Charge is jost God-Tier. With the other buffs that is the only reason I bring a Soldier (And that nice Plasma gun). Having this on your entire force is key.

Overwatch gets worse later on. With plasma its just to short to effectivly protect against ranged enemies and it get overwhelmed to easy on soldier for he has less damage than a Neptune.

Grenade is a nice freebe attack, yet I have not increased it over level 1.

Defensive stand works nice in my buff-build and for now I build it up to compensate for ne negative effects from Rallying Charge - will get maxed later on.

Calling Shots is yet again another buff though not THAT good. Might become better later on for Xenos will get harder to hit and that critical might be a nice multiplier shared among the entire battle force.

Neptune:

Full Auto Burst at first is extremly heat ineffctive so level willpower first. At the beginning you should hit most of the time anyway. It also gets more damage than the soldier ones while sacrificing accuracy but you can gain accuracy from many ways. What sets it appart is the increased AoE to clear areas.

Concentrated fire is nice on paper yet more often than not I either need the AoE or the range of other attacks. It looks like some finisher move or last effort kill-shot yet I rarely get in the situation where I need that.

Deadly burst offers more accuracy and less AoE. Heat is no concern anymore so I prefer Full Auto.

Supressing Fire seems to pay of when you spend many Points into it and then it looks like something really good. On low skill levels though It was not worth it.

Stabilize Platform is a nice add to keep on. Also that accuracy is always handy.

Full Vent is bad. It has no place in my highly mobile playstyle and I doubt anyone else thinks sacrificing MP is a good idea.

Paladin:

Havnt played im much, dont like melee besides my captain. His heals are very good though and overal he is extremly strong for unlike the Engineer he is also an exceptional compatant and tank. Might require some rebalance in favor of the Engineer.

Berserker:

Yet again another one I did not use that much.

Scout:

Piercing Fire is a nice debuff that works decent on tough enemies later on.

Sensorkit is nice sometimes if you dont know the map yet increasing its levle is a waste.

Headshot is a nice way to deal damage on an offensive Scout.

Overdrive is a key for any deep op/stealth scout.

Null field with Stealth Armor Relic and maxed stealth and Overdrive is unnecessary.

Hydra:

Hellstorm deals good damage with good AoE, compare it to Full Auto on the neptune.

Napalm Charge is a rather nice AoE with good damage. As with most of the abilities though the flames on the map just dont cut it and are more of a gimmik.

Inferno Seal is a decent Group buff that is mostly good for its deflection and that it allows your squad to pass though the fire inferno you have created without much harm.

Redline Reactor is straight forward more damage. Nice to have but not a top pick.

Napalm lance has the same problem as other skills where it inititally seems kinda weak and might build up later. Havnt tried much though.

[Samseng Yik]

FieserMoep,

Thanks for sharing good insight.
Helpful on next higher difficulty run

[21mirek12]

Samseng Yik - you are wrong abouy Neptun - imo he is much better than soldier. He has overwatch too, and his overwatch is much better - longer range, bigger area, hit harder. Heat is not so big problem - just invest in willpower few points.
Paladin - better tank then captain. two heal skills, include aoe heal/buff, which is very, very nice.
Hydra - napalm! Not only aoe dmg - flames exist many turns, if you use this skill 2 times in row noone pass, except few minibosess. 5 uses and you can recharge it. For hydra overheat is not a problem - Hydra armor give +10 to heat, and accesory +15. You have 125 heat. Few points in wilpower and even 150% heat make small dmg

[CoryTrese]

The primary attack talent for Neptune has high heat because you can hit 15 Xenos with it in one shot =)

If you want to use a lower-heat, single target Neptune build the mech has other Talents for that.

Neptune tends to excel on levels where you are moving forward, they can spend MP then set down for a turn of blasting with the cannon. Next turn, move forward again.

[Samseng Yik]

I didn't use Neptune not because they are weak.
It is because I don't plan to use it on my first run.

My first run is fully focus on Paladin, Berserker, Engineer, Soldier and Captains.
I didn't use Scout, Neptune, Hydra not because they are bad.
It is because role playing and focus.

[Aedwynn]

Originally posted by digitalnoise:

The primary attack talent for Neptune has high heat because you can hit 15 Xenos with it in one shot =)

Only when maxed out though...
I personaly ignore berserk entirely, use Paladin for healing mostly and shielding others. Soldier is good for his diversity and a lot of buffs he can offer. Neptune is good horde cleaner and OW specialist, while struggles with heat initially. Engineer uses turrets to stave off onslaught and Power Field buff to help others. Also Hydra when roster permits, good aoe dmg dealer.
Always have at least one Sniper scout - good at supporting OW and killing priority targets.