3-9 - Routing: Split joints horizontally flipped

[Maya]

Is it possible to horizontally flip a split joint? They seem to default to 1-2 layout (red on the left, green on the right). However when trying to figure out why my build isn't working, I see that on the working side, the split joints on the far right edge are flipped to a 2-1 layout (green on the left, red on the right). I don't recall seeing this before, and I can't figure out how to flip them on the other side to make that side work also.

Replay:
http://gallery.drycactus.com/image/view/140489

Screenshot of build (right half working, left half not due to split joints):
http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/258211665256785976/DE9D2F138202636EC2559C303CFBB68225CB7CCC/

Note... I saved it, went to the main menu, went back in and reloaded it. The split joints on the entire left side of the middle part were in the 1-2 layout and all of them on the right of the middle were in the 2-1 layout. Again, it worked on the right during the test but not on the left. So I again copied everything on the right side, flipped it again, and pasted it and now it works... go figure.

[Christian_Akacro]

When using Static Split joints after zooming in all the way the colours of each side correspond to whether they will move or not. Red continues to stay static, green will split away and move as appropriate.

[Maya]

Okay, that's logical, but how is the static side designated? After getting this build working on the right side of the middle platform, I copied and flipped horizontally, and pasted on the left side. It didn't work until I went back to the main menu and loaded it again. Then I copied and pasted again and it worked. There seems to be a bug, but I feel like there is some way to flip the joint. I just can't find anything that says how to.

[Christian_Akacro]

There are split joint side selectors available when you zoom in on a split joint to determine which side is connected to which. Just click on them to switch them from 1 to 2 or 2 to 1. They are explained in detail in Tutorial 6: Hydraulic Draw Bridge. More information can be found in the Manual, available from the Main Menu. Section 2 Campaign and Simulation, subsection Boats, Planes, and Hydraulics.

[Dry Cactus]

It is worth nothing that the split joint 'sides' are fictitious, as in they don't really have a side, since the joints overlap perfectly.
The red/green differentiation is just so you know which number (1 or 2) corresponds to the static joint which will not move (red), and which is the movable joint (green).
The fact that is left or right is more visual, and is dictated by the position of the split static joint in relation to the mid-point of the level.
This could be improved by calculating the 'correct' visual order by finding close land-masses and platforms, but is not a high priority at this point.

[Maya]

I guess I've gotten lucky that my split joints generally worked in the past or I was able to luck into them working. I spent a lot of time looking at the manual and searching online for more details. I just always assumed that if I had a split joint attached on the left side of a static object, that the right side of the joint would attach to the static object and not move while the left side would move. I designated the moving parts according to whatever number was on the side of the joint that I wanted to move. So I knew how to select them, but the green/red NEVER even occurred to me as a designation of movement. I'm usually not that slow at picking up stuff, so I hopefully can't be the only person that got confused.

Additionally, when looking at the manual (2-Campaign and Simulation) the screenshot under the Hydrolics section shows a road and the braces matched to the red(1) side which won't move, instead of the green(2) side. As I understand now, this would result in the road not splitting at that joint... maybe this needs to be captioned with "Incorrect" or something.

And tutorial 6 is a very simple example that does not account for the reversal of colors. The colors are red on the left (static) and green on the right (movable). As you can see in my screenshot of 3-9 when I was working on it, the first 6 static joints are red/green. The last 2 are green/red. Now that I understand that red is always static and green is always movable, I get it. But I kind of think it shouldn't have been this difficult to figure out.I'm not sure what the "correct" solution for this is, other than a more comprehensive explaination in the manual maybe (see below).

Also, when putting split joints in different levels, they seem to arbitrarily choose to be either in the 1-2 or the 2-1 position. On 3-9 Routing, when I just insert split joints, the 4 on the left are all in the 1-2 position and the 4 on the right are in the 2-1 position, demonstrating the mid-point logic you mentioned. But as you can see in my screenshot, when I was working on it, the joints were even funkier. To compare, on 3-6 Up & Away, the 4 on the left are in the 1-2 with only the far right being in the 2-1. So the mid-point logic doesn't apply there. Possible bug?

Could additional details be added to the manual that specify the correlation between the numbers and colors? Maybe something like:

"When a split joint is added to a static object, such as a landmass, the side labeled 1 will turn red. Regardless of the side that it is facing, any object attached to side 1 will not split from the joint. Any objects attached to side 2 (the green side) will split away from the joint."

Thanks for reading this novel :)

[Dry Cactus]

Princess Buttercup,
I agree that the current red/green system is not ideal, it particularly doesn't cater at all to certain color-blind people who would just see them both as slightly different shades of gray.

Good catch on the manual picture, it does indeed show a setup that would result in breaking if simulated, its' a screenshot of the tutorial level just before the game forces you to set them to '2', it makes sense for the tutorial but is misleading as a manual picture, I'll get that fixed up.

In the screenshot you posted I would except the 3rd 'column' of joints to be inverted (red on right, green on left), so that's possibly a bug I need to look into.

Overall I feel the need to improve the split joint visualization when it's half-static and half-movable.
A while ago I was going to try and change the shape of static joints (to aid color-blind players) into a square, while movable joints would remain round.
When split it would be a half-square for the part that wouldn't move (with the relative number in it), and a half-circle for the part that would move.
Possibly it might also be beneficial to remove the invert logic altogether, and always have the half-static joint on the left, since really it doesn't matter if it's left or right as they overlap anyways.

Any more suggestions are welcome, thanks for your input!

[Dry Cactus]

As a follow up to the above, I decided to make the distinction between static and moving joints clearer, so static joints are now red squares, while moving joints are yellow circles.
When splitting a static joint, half of it will be square and the other half a circle, hopefully making it clearer which is which.
The split joint sides no longer reverse, so on a static split-joint the square side is always labeled '1', therefore any struts that are meant to stay attached to the static joint need to be set to '1'.
Picture: http://i.imgur.com/9bkIOwp.png

This will be part of the upcoming patch in a few days.

Hopefully it makes things clearer in this area, more feedback welcome.
Thanks!

[Maya]

That's awesome. I definitely think this is a move in the right direction! Thanks for the update.